Faster Payment Service

Olipro

you have not actually articulated what this "abuse" consists of.

Mikeyorks

MDD wrote: »

Now it seems to me that FPS was set up as a Faster Payment Service for the people to have use of.

You seem to be intent on establishing a precedent that doesn't exist. As those of us who've been waiting around, for full implementation, since FP staggered onto the stage in May 08 will tell you ........ there is absolutely no requirement on any of the Banks to actually use Faster Payment.

So I'm afraid your original premise :

is a service to help the people it is not one that the banks have control over

.... falls at the first hurdle. As the Banks have been demonstrating for the last 3 years that they have absolute control over it.

Legislation to make them toe the line doesn't materialise until 2012.

MDD_2

Olipro wrote: »

you have not actually articulated what this "abuse" consists of.

That is absolutely right in what your saying. My understanding of the FPS is that it was intended to speed up the clearing of money transactions. The Office of Fair Trading said that banks were making about £30 million pounds a year under the old 3 day system. The general consensus is same day clearing, within 2 hours, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week and 365 days a year. MBNA have decided that weekends don't apply. If my understanding is right, which I believe it is, then it is an abuse of what the FPS is set up for. Obviously if I am wrong and weekend banking was not intended then MBNA can deny having received money transferred during weekends, hold on to it and not pass it on to the beneficiary customer. As there is no legislation which has been pointed out by another member I feel it is important that whoever set up the principles of the FPS ensure that they are adhered to. Hope this expresses my view.

MDD_2

Mikeyorks wrote: »

You seem to be intent on establishing a precedent that doesn't exist. As those of us who've been waiting around, for full implementation, since FP staggered onto the stage in May 08 will tell you ........ there is absolutely no requirement on any of the Banks to actually use Faster Payment.

So I'm afraid your original premise :



.... falls at the first hurdle. As the Banks have been demonstrating for the last 3 years that they have absolute control over it.

Legislation to make them toe the line doesn't materialise until 2012.

Appreciate your response. I am not sure that defending the banks is the way forward. The FPS was set up before the MBNA decided to join and the rules are common to me, having my rights included.

Milarky

@MDD,

What you say about weekends isn't covered by the current or even future rules - which merely state that payments will have to arrive by the next 'working day' - thus ruling out BACS because it takes a day too long. This still allows (for example) your bank to take the instruction on a Friday but not take the money from your account until Monday - then instantly credit MBNA. MBNA gets the money on a 'working day', so give you immediate value - but only from the point of view of when the money is taken from your bank - not from the point of view of when you would like to pay them.

I'm guessing paying at the weekend is desired because the 'due date' MBNA generates falls on a weekend rather than during the week. Of course, they are entitled to do this because a 'due date' simply means they must receive the money by that date - but are free to ignore the actual weekend date of any receipt because the 'rules' -established by the government and regulators - will allow them to only give a customer value from the first working day after where it falls on a weekend.

Bit of a complicated picture and there's nothing we can do about it other than staying informed to avoid these traps- in your case, I'm guessing paying MBNA on a Thursday rather than a Saturday or Sunday

Joe_Bloggs

@ Milarky and those who know.
I would like to make money payments 24/7 and have my payments accepted and the timing of the payments acknowledged.
How are banks dodging the spirit of 24/7 banking. Was 24/7 banking a viable concept ,is it a reality elsewhere ?
J_B.
I can't bank when I work because I am working.

MDD_2

Milarky wrote: »

@MDD,

What you say about weekends isn't covered by the current or even future rules - which merely state that payments will have to arrive by the next 'working day' - thus ruling out BACS because it takes a day too long. This still allows (for example) your bank to take the instruction on a Friday but not take the money from your account until Monday - then instantly credit MBNA. MBNA gets the money on a 'working day', so give you immediate value - but only from the point of view of when the money is taken from your bank - not from the point of view of when you would like to pay them.

I'm guessing paying at the weekend is desired because the 'due date' MBNA generates falls on a weekend rather than during the week. Of course, they are entitled to do this because a 'due date' simply means they must receive the money by that date - but are free to ignore the actual weekend date of any receipt because the 'rules' -established by the government and regulators - will allow them to only give a customer value from the first working day after where it falls on a weekend.

Bit of a complicated picture and there's nothing we can do about it other than staying informed to avoid these traps- in your case, I'm guessing paying MBNA on a Thursday rather than a Saturday or Sunday

I am so glad you replied. Can you please point me to where the rules are. The situation I had. Made a payment to MBNA through HSBC bank using the FPS. The money was taken from my account immediately and HSBC online say the money would be with the MBNA within 2 hours. This was on a Saturday (lot more to the story). I was charged / lost £250 - £300 as MBNA said that they had not had the money until Monday. As the money had gone out of my account I asked MBNA to put a trace on the transfer, they got angry over the telephone because I said if the money wasn't in my account then where was it. To my mind banks make their own rules for their own convenience but cannot deny the reality of what is.

Milarky

@Joe_Bloggs,

The concept of '24/7' is incomplete is all. You can take cash out '24/7' and the banks have no difficulty debiting your account on the relevent weekend date. However for settlement [i.e. inter-bank] purposes it's a different matter. So, if you send some money to a different bank's account, it not being a 'working day' makes a difference - but only so far as 'settlement' is concerned - faster payments [where it is available] still ensures the transfer is effected immediately.

Milarky

@MDD,

If the receiving banks [they use Co-operative and NatWest, I think] got the funds on the weekend they would have put Monday's date on the payment. MBNA would just be 'reading across' from what dates their own statements from their own bank told them. Given they cannot control this, you have no recourse I think. And you are half right, at least, to say that if payments can be made 365 days a year then why can't/shouldn't they be applied to accounts 365 days too?

MDD_2

Joe_Bloggs wrote: »

@ Milarky and those who know.
I would like to make money payments 24/7 and have my payments accepted and the timing of the payments acknowledged.
How are banks dodging the spirit of 24/7 banking. Was 24/7 banking a viable concept ,is it a reality elsewhere ?
J_B.
I can't bank when I work because I am working.

The reality is the money is transferred to the receiving bank when it is sent there isn't someone sitting at a desk checking it on a Monday morning