Failed Medical Stats.

jonty1970

My sister had her medical last week. I gave her a lift there and back.
I went in into the medical with her.
She has depression, panic attacks and alcohol problems.

She was asked if she could use the bus. She has had to twice in the last 6 months, but only because I couldn't give her a lift to the Shaw Trust for her appointment.

Other than that, she never goes out, unless I take her to the doctors.

She thinks she has failed because the interviewer was pushing her to say yes, she can use a phone and use the bus, if she has to.

But she never goes out, unless she has to.

NASA_2

jonty1970 wrote: »

My sister had her medical last week. I gave her a lift there and back.
I went in into the medical with her.
She has depression, panic attacks and alcohol problems.

She was asked if she could use the bus. She has had to twice in the last 6 months, but only because I couldn't give her a lift to the Shaw Trust for her appointment.

Other than that, she never goes out, unless I take her to the doctors.

She thinks she has failed because the interviewer was pushing her to say yes, she can use a phone and use the bus, if she has to.

But she never goes out, unless she has to.

I never go out, unless I have to, which is to go to work.

Other than that I am in the same positions as your sister. I just put myself through it on an ongoing basis.

jonty1970

NASA wrote: »

I never go out, unless I have to, which is to go to work.

Other than that I am in the same positions as your sister. I just put myself through it on an ongoing basis.

I'm happy for you that you can cope with life. My sister can't at the moment and is waiting for CBT.

She can't work as she gets suicidal

She can't wash herself or keep her house tidy, because she has depression. It's not like she is just fed up or can't be bothered to go out. She can't at the moment. That is what benefits are for, to look after ill people

Oldernotwiser

jonty1970 wrote: »

My sister had her medical last week. I gave her a lift there and back.
I went in into the medical with her.
She has depression, panic attacks and alcohol problems.

She was asked if she could use the bus. She has had to twice in the last 6 months, but only because I couldn't give her a lift to the Shaw Trust for her appointment.

Other than that, she never goes out, unless I take her to the doctors.

She thinks she has failed because the interviewer was pushing her to say yes, she can use a phone and use the bus, if she has to.

But she never goes out, unless she has to.

So she can use the bus if she has to - where's the problem in her admitting it?

NASA_2

jonty1970 wrote: »

I'm happy for you that you can cope with life. My sister can't at the moment and is waiting for CBT.

She can't work as she gets suicidal

You've stated yourself that she can do these things when she has to.

Harsh as it sounds - getting suicidal doesnt stop you working. Any study that I have read suggest that worklessness will make suicide more likely than less - though each individual case is of course different.

I hope she gets the CBT soon - from ongoing personal experience it can be quite helpful - though not a solution in itself.

jonty1970

she said she had to, not that she was ok doing it. She said it makes her ill and very tired when she does have to go out on her own.

At the moment, she is too stressed to do anything. Getting a job would only make her worse.

She isn't a scrounger. That is how people are made to feel.

I have tried numerous times to take her out, even for just a drive in my car, but she can't leave the house, or even get dressed most days.

She isn't able to get a job and hold one down She can't even have a wash every day?

The stress of looking for a job and holding one down is out of the question at the moment. She needs help, no made to feel like she is making up her illness.

jonty1970

You've stated yourself that she can do these things when she has to.

She doesn't want her money stopped and is in the work related group, so sees someone for help while claiming ESA. If she doesn't go, they stop her money! Once a month is a bit different to a full time job. She can manage that.

Harsh as it sounds - getting suicidal doesnt stop you working.
No, but being suicidal is often lethal. She has tried a few times to take her life. It tears our family apart that she is this way and we do all we can to support her.


I hope she gets the CBT soon - from ongoing personal experience it can be quite helpful - though not a solution in itself.

I hope so too. I don't want to have to see her in hospital again on a drip after she took an overdose!

She can't cope with life, never mind a job. It is awful seeing her this way and these interviews make her feel like a scrounger and even more worthless.

cit_k

Two4Tuesday wrote: »

Interesting post, but I suspect that ATOS would claim that their medical reports are not for employment or insurance purposes. They may argue that employment purposes cover only reports done on behalf of an employer or covering an existing employment.

Whether or not this is accurate may have to be tested in court one day.

stazi wrote: »

Both cit_k and skcollob make interesting points- but both miss the point-
1) The WCA report belongs to DWP- not ATOS, therefore ATOS have no right to give the benefit claimant a copy;
2) The benefit claimant is not the patient of the ATOS HCP;
3) DWP is not a ‘third party’, the WCA report belongs to DWP;
4) A copy of the WCA report is freely available to the benefit claimant from the owner – DWP.
5) The WCA report is for ESA, and not for employment or insurance purposes.

Im not missing the point sadly, It matters not who the report belongs to.

The point is the medical professional is producing the report, and as such has to comply with GMC rules regarding these reports, and also professional ethics etc.

The GMC have specifically confirmed to me that these reports do count under these rules, and that they must follow those rules for the ATOS report.

I have personally contacted them and had this confirmed direct from the GMC (and NMWC too) using the specific circumstances of someone having a IB or ESA or any other benefit assessment by ATOS, where a report is produced that is used as evidence by decision makers for the purpose of deciding benefit entitlement.

They were quite clear, after going of to check with the compliance team, that those circumstances are covered under the rules and that the offer to show the report must be made etc as per rules.

cit_k

stazi wrote: »

Both cit_k and skcollob make interesting points- but both miss the point-
1) The WCA report belongs to DWP- not ATOS, therefore ATOS have no right to give the benefit claimant a copy;
2) The benefit claimant is not the patient of the ATOS HCP;
3) DWP is not a ‘third party’, the WCA report belongs to DWP;
4) A copy of the WCA report is freely available to the benefit claimant from the owner – DWP.
5) The WCA report is for ESA, and not for employment or insurance purposes.

To continue,

1) The WCA report belongs to DWP- not ATOS, therefore ATOS have no right to give the benefit claimant a copy;

1 - The WCA report is paid for by the DWP correct, ownership is immaterial as I have pointed out though.

2) The benefit claimant is not the patient of the ATOS HCP;

2 - The benefit claimaint is the 'patient' being assessed by the medical professional for the purpose of the report. You are probably right though, they are not the patient as ATOS tends to write imaginary reports that do not reflect the person being examined, so they must be writing about someone that does not really exist insteda of the person they are interrogating.

3) DWP is not a ‘third party’, the WCA report belongs to DWP;

3 - Of course the DWP is a third party -

Party A - Claimaint being assessed by medical professional
Paryt B - Medical professional doing the assessment
Party C - The DWP paying for ATOS for the assessment.
Party E - ATOS who hired the assessor
etc etc

Or are you expecting us to believe that ATOS actually OWNS the DWP or vice versa?

You also point out about it not being a insurance report etc, can you not see your own contradictions? Reports for an insurance company are owned by the insurance company that pays for them, just like the DWP will own reports - yet you have no problems with them failing under the ruling. Your post has so many holes in it, you seem to be trying to justify the fact ATOS and theh DWP are acting unethically and very possibly illegally.

4) A copy of the WCA report is freely available to the benefit claimant from the owner – DWP.

To late then to comply with the rules, the rules state it has to be provided BEFORE it is sent.

5) The WCA report is for ESA, and not for employment or insurance purposes.

As I pointed out, I have had it direct from them that benefits are also covered under that ruling. Besides arguing that ESA has nothing to do with 'employment' is a bit silly considering ESA stands for

EMPLOYMENT Support allowance.

Bit of a clue in its name, not that its needed as I say, they have confirmed what I say is correct.

You are stating the GMC lied to me basically.

Skinticket

sorry for going a little off topic, but i have a query regarding ESA...

i get esa and have some of it deducted because my wife claims carers allowance, she only gets £41 CA as she has some deducted for a social fund loan, my question is, should should my ESA be changed or is it correct that my esa stays the same?