General question

bumble1

Bear with me on this:
I have a neighbour aged 61 whose has a child aged 16, still at school, who wishes to stay on for A levels. He earns approx £14500 p.a, claims NO benefits whatsoever ( refuses to, even if entitled to claim), but does receive child tax credits ( not sure how much). His dilemma is that it costs approx £100 pm to get his child to and from school, due to the fact that he lives in one area and the school is in a neighbouring area and there is no bus service (rural). He is not entitled to any assistance towards sending his child to school as there is a school much closer but since he does not want to disrupt any schooling at this stage has bitten the bullet and funded the travel costs himself, which he admits puts a strain on his finances, especially since the cost of fuel has risen so sharply.
This all came up in a general conversation in which I said that I thought they could get an allowance for staying on at school after 16 ( which would pay for the travel costs) but I now understand that has stopped.
He hasn't asked for advice or assistance , but I was wondering if any such support exists. Thank you

[Deleted User]

I take it hes still at school and not college?if so then there is no help for this,but he should check if hes entitled to any other benefits.
When he goes to college he would have got ema but this has been abolished from this september,however this may yet be replaced by some other form of help for students from very low income families

bumble1

Thank you. Yes school, not college.
He's a thrifty soul who never complains, so he will manage to get her through her A levels and on to university. Hopefully then she will get some form of grant because he certainly cannot afford to fund that.

RAS

EMA has been changed. It would be a case of making a hardship request rather than entitlement.

This person needs to look at www.turn2us.co.uk and find out what they could get. To be honest, it might be a good idea for them to claim what they can, because the fees are going up in 2012. The daughter will get a fees loan, grant and bursary, but any help the parent could offer then would be very useful. TRy to get them to think of it as savings to help the child at university not scrounging.

viktory

bumble1 wrote: »

claims NO benefits whatsoever ( refuses to, even if entitled to claim), but does receive child tax credits

Child tax credits are a benefit.

bumble1

viktory wrote: »

Child tax credits are a benefit.

Thank you, but I won't pass that on as I'm sure he looks upon it as a tax allowance, like one used to get. I think his wife probably made the claims before she died last year and he would not claim if he was told it was like asking for charity.

parsons

bumble1 wrote: »

Thank you, but I won't pass that on as I'm sure he looks upon it as a tax allowance, like one used to get. I think his wife probably made the claims before she died last year and he would not claim if he was told it was like asking for charity.

Your neighbour is not alone in his attitude towards benefits.
Many that I come across on a day to day basis (and yes I have to admit they, like I am, are in the 60+ age group), see benefits as begging for charity.

Yes I too would view Tax Credits as a benefit - hence the reason why I have never claimed them in the past whilst working.

It's not surprising that people in our age range are like this. We remember the long queues outside the old 'National Assistance Board' offices which became the Ministry of Pensions and National Insurance.
All the down and outs looking for a welfare payment. Not daring to tell anybody, even family that they are receiving National Assistance such was the stigma attached to it.

It's also not surprising that our age range are an embarassment to the Governemnt for not claiming money that has been put aside for us. Even now, the Government are once again giving money away to people without any claim being made for Pension Credit. This is in the hope that they will after 6 months put a formal claim in. Not many will!

There is nothing wrong in being proud, we have lived through some of the hardest years as well as some of the most exciting ones.

Off the subject slightly, even my grandfather refused to claim his OAP before he died in 1970 aged 79 on the basis that he saw it as charity and was working 16 hours a day 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year as a farmer right up until a few hours before his death.

There is nothing wrong in being poor, proud and honest!

bumble1

parsons wrote: »

There is nothing wrong in being poor, proud and honest!

Both admirable and honourable in my book.

However it is a shame that the term "benefits" appears to be so stigmatised by by the holier than thou people who sit on their high horses castigating anyone who dares mention the term, and why so few older people ask for help because they are afraid of being labelled scroungers.

In one way or other we ALL make use of so called "benefits".
We are fortunate that we (still) live in a free society where we work, pay taxes into a common pot and enjoy the benefits (rightly or wrongly) that our system prescribes for us.
We pay for wars, government waste, put money into the hands of corrupt foreign countries, EU bureaucracy, etc etc, yet nothing infuriates some people more than the thought of people claiming "benefits".

If we choose to run a smaller car we benefit from lower car tax.
A smaller house- we benefit from lower council tax.
Pay by direct debit- we benefit from lower bills.
We all benefit from, a free health service
OAP's benefit from free bus passes
Our children benefit from a free education
etc etc etc

We ALL enjoy these benefits because that is the way our system works.
And we ALL enjoy the benefit of living in this wonderful free country because our forefathers fought and died to make it that way.

The system isn't perfect and yes there are a lot of people who abuse it, but I am sure my neighbour and his young daughter would be more than happy to forfeit their 25% single person council tax benefit if it meant the return of a wife and mother.

parsons

bumble1 wrote: »

Both admirable and honourable in my book.

However it is a shame that the term "benefits" appears to be so stigmatised by by the holier than thou people who sit on their high horses castigating anyone who dares mention the term, and why so few older people ask for help because they are afraid of being labelled scroungers.

In one way or other we ALL make use of so called "benefits".
We are fortunate that we (still) live in a free society where we work, pay taxes into a common pot and enjoy the benefits (rightly or wrongly) that our system prescribes for us.
We pay for wars, government waste, put money into the hands of corrupt foreign countries, EU bureaucracy, etc etc, yet nothing infuriates some people more than the thought of people claiming "benefits".

If we choose to run a smaller car we benefit from lower car tax.
A smaller house- we benefit from lower council tax.
Pay by direct debit- we benefit from lower bills.
We all benefit from, a free health service
OAP's benefit from free bus passes
Our children benefit from a free education
etc etc etc

We ALL enjoy these benefits because that is the way our system works.
And we ALL enjoy the benefit of living in this wonderful free country because our forefathers fought and died to make it that way.

The system isn't perfect and yes there are a lot of people who abuse it, but I am sure my neighbour and his young daughter would be more than happy to forfeit their 25% single person council tax benefit if it meant the return of a wife and mother.

I have to say that that was a well thought out and logical answer. You are completely correct in what you say. Most if not all people in this country do 'benefit' with most things in their lives.

However, using the word 'benefit' in that context detracts from the 'normally used' definition. When we talk about benefits we are generally describing government money (not a relief or advantage), that is handed out in exchange for a claim being made.

It is this 'cash' advance that causes such turmoil with people. They see it as their money that they have given to the government in order to run the country to provide a 'benefit' for all to enjoy.
And certainly not to be handed out willy nilly to all and sundry that apply for it.

Maybe we should decribe these cash payments as 'National Assistance' or 'Welfare Payments'. These are exactly what they are!

It is for that reason that most if not all in our age group will willingly accept the 'benefit' of free healthcare, but refuse to take up 'Welfare Payments' as that is seen as only one step up from asking the local vicar for charitable help or asking the local DWP for food and clothing stamps.

I would agree entirely with you that having the 'relief' of a certain percentage of the Council Tax is no compensation for the loss of a wife and mother.

It does seem to follow in this country that there are those that have no thought of shame or embarassment in asking the state for as often as they can get away with it, for cash handouts.

Obviously my heart does go out to those who are less fortunate than others due to illness or disability. For those state support should be given unconditionally.

However, too many are on the bandwagon looking for their bit if they can get it.

Consequently, the public now look at ALL Welfare recipients as being scroungers.
Would I sell my soul for that to be thought of me - NO! Hence the reason why I keep well away from the DWP even though I know that I am entitled to some of those cash handouts.

bumble1

parsons wrote: »

Maybe we should decribe these cash payments as 'National Assistance' or 'Welfare Payments'. These are exactly what they are!

The problem with that argument is that we have a legal framework, enacted by Parliament, which guarantees access to a range of benefits based upon our sense of social equality.
These are called entitlements by the government and people are invited to apply for them; and, subject to meeting the requisite criteria, people are paid these entitlements in order to allow them maintain a set standard of living, as determined by the powers that be.

The fact that these now appear to have got out of control is more the fault of successive governments who have chosen to use the benefit system to carry favour with the voting populace and keep down both wages and the actual size of the dole queues, whilst allowing the real cost of living to escalate out of control.

If you tell someone they are entitled to £200 they will accept it just as willingly as does a politician who is told he is entitled to a claim for "living" expenses, real or otherwise.

Weaning people off benefits has to be like weaning a baby onto solids.
A slow, gradual process that, if done properly, ensures there is no return.

Jowo_2

bumble1 wrote: »

Both admirable and honourable in my book.

However it is a shame that the term "benefits" appears to be so stigmatised by by the holier than thou people who sit on their high horses castigating anyone who dares mention the term, and why so few older people ask for help because they are afraid of being labelled scroungers.

In one way or other we ALL make use of so called "benefits".
.

I share your concerns. I hope your friend can be persuaded to check his entitlements to help with budget. He should be able to find out from the school what their plans are to help with costs for those on low incomes.

99% or greater claimants are legitimately receiving their full entitlements from the 50+ ones available. Many, like your neighbours, are entitled to some but do not apply for many reasons.

But one of the reasons why the current govt is making radical changes to the structure (and hope to influence the culture) around benefits is because currently more is paid out in benefits each year than is received in income tax receipts, a highly unsustainable inbalance.