excessive landlord's notice fee months after completion date

sobre44

Hi,

Months after the completion date for the small leasehold flat that I bought I received (out of the blue) a letter from my solicitor informing me that:

"Further to completion of your purchase of the above property, we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry.

Unfortunately, prior to completion, the Managing Agents misinformed us of the necessary notice fees which were payable to the Management Company and Landlord. The Landlord's are now requesting further fees to provide their consent to registration, which regrettably is essential.

They are asking for a further £368.00 (which we find extortionate and have expressed this view to them) before they will give the necessary consent. We would therefore be pleased if you could let us have a cheque for £368.00 in respect of their additional fees as soon as possible.

We apologise for the additional expense but unfortunately we have no option and we were not informed of this prior to completion.

Yours sincerely,

---

"

My questions is am I liable for such a fee after my completion date?
(there was no mention of it during the process).

Also £368.00 seems excessively high for the landlords merely to give their consent regarding the land registry.

I have already paid the Land Registry fee (£50), the Land Registry Search (£8), a fee for the "Registration of Deed of Covenant" (£176.25) and a "Notice of Assignment" (£99.88) etc.

The flat is small and was under £50,000.

Am I obliged to pay the £368? Are there any steps that I can take?

Thanks

MegaMiniMouse

sobre44 wrote: »

Hi,

Months after the completion date for the small leasehold flat that I bought I received (out of the blue) a letter from my solicitor informing me that:

"Further to completion of your purchase of the above property, we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry.

Unfortunately, prior to completion, the Managing Agents misinformed us of the necessary notice fees which were payable to the Management Company and Landlord. The Landlord's are now requesting further fees to provide their consent to registration, which regrettably is essential.

They are asking for a further £368.00 (which we find extortionate and have expressed this view to them) before they will give the necessary consent. We would therefore be pleased if you could let us have a cheque for £368.00 in respect of their additional fees as soon as possible.

We apologise for the additional expense but unfortunately we have no option and we were not informed of this prior to completion.

Yours sincerely,

---

"

My questions is am I liable for such a fee after my completion date?
(there was no mention of it during the process).

Also £368.00 seems excessively high for the landlords merely to give their consent regarding the land registry.

I have already paid the Land Registry fee (£50), the Land Registry Search (£8), a fee for the "Registration of Deed of Covenant" (£176.25) and a "Notice of Assignment" (£99.88) etc.

The flat is small and was under £50,000.

Am I obliged to pay the £368? Are there any steps that I can take?

Thanks

I would say that if completion has taken place, then any further demands are irrelevant. That's what solicitors are paid to do!

If the deeds clearly show that you are now the leaseholder of the property, then tell the solicitors to prove your liability for these random additional charges...

MMM

sobre44

Thanks MMM,

I went into the estate agents to ask for advice about this. The lady there suggested I not bother paying it now, but it would become relevent if ever I wanted to sell the property.

If the landlord refuses to give consent then the land registry will not have a record of my ownership so that would presumably stop me ever selling the property until the matter was resolved (If I understand correctly).

Could this be an issue?

J

MegaMiniMouse

sobre44 wrote: »

Thanks MMM,

I went into the estate agents to ask for advice about this. The lady there suggested I not bother paying it now, but it would become relevent if ever I wanted to sell the property.

If the landlord refuses to give consent then the land registry will not have a record of my ownership so that would presumably stop me ever selling the property until the matter was resolved (If I understand correctly).

Could this be an issue?

J

Clearly, this is an issue! And now is the time to get it sorted out...

Solicitors make vast profits out of the complications of property ownership - if they !!!! it up, then there are proper channels for complaint

You are either the legal owner of the lease, or you are not. Your solicitor was paid to ensure the transfer of ownership into your name - if the transfer was flawed in any way, then the liability is almost certainly the solicitor's - they are supposed to find out about all the issues surrounding the transfer of ownership, including landlord's charges etc.

The deeds either show that you are now the leaseholder, or else they show that somebody else is the leaseholder - there are no half-way positions - you have paid your solicitor to sort this out - do you have a mortgage?

ps - the estate agent has presumably been paid, and probably has no knowledge or interest in whether or not the transaction has been properly and legally finalised...

sobre44

I agree that they should have found out everything regarding such issues.

I also think though that if the Managing Agent did misinform them as stated in the letter I received then they (the management company) could be liable and so any extra fee that came after the completion date is a loss that they must take.

In any case is there any consumer protection against such large fees? From what I have read tonight such a fee might perhaps be £40 to £100-and as it is a small property maybe on the lower side of that spectrum.

£368 seems far too high and not justified for merely giving their consent.

If the solicitors are to blame then you recommend that I complain about them via proper channels?

I think that if I just talk to them they will claim that they are not liable as the managing agent misinformed them. They could refuse to pay and the registry would remain undone. I am concerned that if things turn sour then I will have to find another solicitor to complete the land registry-with additional cost-and I may have to pay the fee as well.

Yes, I have a mortgage on the property and things are tight moneywise.

J

MegaMiniMouse

sobre44 wrote: »

I agree that they should have found out everything regarding such issues.

I also think though that if the Managing Agent did misinform them as stated in the letter I received then they (the management company) could be liable and so any extra fee that came after the completion date is a loss that they must take.

In any case is there any consumer protection against such large fees? From what I have read tonight such a fee might perhaps be £40 to £100-and as it is a small property maybe on the lower side of that spectrum.

£368 seems far too high and not justified for merely giving their consent.

If the solicitors are to blame then you recommend that I complain about them via proper channels?

I think that if I just talk to them they will claim that they are not liable as the managing agent misinformed them. They could refuse to pay and the registry would remain undone. I am concerned that if things turn sour then I will have to find another solicitor to complete the land registry-with additional cost-and I may have to pay the fee as well.

Yes, I have a mortgage on the property and things are tight moneywise.

J

If the transfer of ownership has been 'completed', then there can be no further demands! Clearly, both your solicitor and your lender's solicitor, as well as the seller's solicitor, were satisfied that all necessary procedures had been completed, and that all necessary monies had changed hands.

I would suggest that your biggest worry is whether or not you are actually the legal owner of the lease - the figure of £368 is possibly a kite-flying exercise which your solicitor is reluctant to deal with 'free-of-charge'.

MMM

DVardysShadow

sobre44 wrote: »

"Further to completion of your purchase of the above property, we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry.

Unfortunately, prior to completion, the Managing Agents misinformed us of the necessary notice fees which were payable to the Management Company and Landlord. The Landlord's are now requesting further fees to provide their consent to registration, which regrettably is essential.

They are asking for a further £368.00 (which we find extortionate and have expressed this view to them) before they will give the necessary consent. We would therefore be pleased if you could let us have a cheque for £368.00 in respect of their additional fees as soon as possible.

We apologise for the additional expense but unfortunately we have no option and we were not informed of this prior to completion.

Yours sincerely,

---

"

Solicitor is not too happy with this, but is recommending paying up. Personally, I would not feel happy with this - it looks like the Managing Agent is responsible for misinformation. I suggest getting from the solicitor a copy of the correspondence from the Managing Agent, advising the charges and take it from there - possibly paying up and taking the Managing Agent to the small claims court. But I think you would need to see the correspondence first.

G_M

You have received a lot of misinformation above.

Your solicitor said: " we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry." so first off, the Transfer is NOT complete and you don't yet formally own the property!

2nd off, this is not the solicitor's fault "the Managing Agents misinformed us of ..." so blame the managing agents, not your solicitor.

3rd, without the consent of the Managing Agent, the Transfer cannot be registered with the Land Registry, so payment of their fee is compulsory.

and finally, your solicitor is not making money on this - it is a fee which the MA gets - the solicitor just pases it on. In fact the solicitor is now doing extra work on your behalf, for free (well, within the fee you've already paid him) to sort out the MA's mistake on your behalf.

Yes, the MA should have specified the right fee up front. If you want to make an issue over this, and delay completion of your ownership further, take your dispute up with the MA.

Your solicitor might charge you fo handling this dispute if you choose to employ him to do it rather than raise the dispute yourself.

edit: to check if you DO own the property, pay the Land Registry £4 and see if your name appears on the lease Title. I suspect it won't. You can download it instantly online.

sobre44

Hi G_M,

G_M wrote: »

You have received a lot of misinformation above.

Your solicitor said: " we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry." so first off, the Transfer is NOT complete and you don't yet formally own the property!

Did the completion date etc mean anything then? I signed and paid and I am paying council tax for the property etc.

G_M wrote: »

2nd off, this is not the solicitor's fault "the Managing Agents misinformed us of ..." so blame the managing agents, not your solicitor.

That seems right to me. The only point is that the soliciter's paperwork does not mention the landlord's notice fee in the breakdown of fees (unless it is notice of assignment?-which I paid £99.88)

As I understand now this "landlords notice fee" is a usual part of the process. So shouldnt the soliciter have enquired about it? If it was not on the list then shouldnt they have noticed that as unusual and got clarification from the landlord/managing agent?

G_M wrote: »

3rd, without the consent of the Managing Agent, the Transfer cannot be registered with the Land Registry, so payment of their fee is compulsory.

I see. Isnt there some kind of legal upper limit that they can charge though? I agreed to buy the property with the information of fees etc that I had been given. Now they have demanded this seemingly excessive figure of £368 for the process to be completed. What would stop them from charging say £10,000? If the usual admin fee for such consent is around £60 then is not £368 an unfair and unacceptable fee?

G_M wrote: »

and finally, your solicitor is not making money on this - it is a fee which the MA gets - the solicitor just pases it on. In fact the solicitor is now doing extra work on your behalf, for free (well, within the fee you've already paid him) to sort out the MA's mistake on your behalf.

I understand that the soliciter is not making money on this-they would just be passing the sum on. They are working now within the amount I paid them to arrange completion. Still if they did not enquire properly about the landlord's notice fee then I would say that they might be at fault in some way. Is this correct?

G_M wrote: »

Yes, the MA should have specified the right fee up front. If you want to make an issue over this, and delay completion of your ownership further, take your dispute up with the MA.

Any advise regarding this? Do I have any rights as they were in error and seem to be charging a massively excessive amount regarding such a small property-and after the official completion date?

G_M wrote: »

Your solicitor might charge you fo handling this dispute if you choose to employ him to do it rather than raise the dispute yourself.

I would feel like disputing any such charge as I paid them the agreed sum for arranging the completion plus they may not have enquired about the lack of landlord's notice fee in the paperwork.

G_M wrote: »

edit: to check if you DO own the property, pay the Land Registry £4 and see if your name appears on the lease Title. I suspect it won't. You can download it instantly online.

Thanks, I checked with the land registry as suggested and the record shows that the property is still registered as with the previous lease holder-the lady who I bought the property from.

I also enquired about the freeholders and they are:

FREEHOLD MANAGERS (NOMINEES) LIMITED


J

sobre44

I will phone up the Land Registry tomorrow for their view on this. Any other advice appreciated.

Thanks everyone.

timmyt

MegaMiniMouse wrote: »

I would say that if completion has taken place, then any further demands are irrelevant. That's what solicitors are paid to do! gibberish

If the deeds clearly show that you are now the leaseholder of the property, they don't, that is the point "we are still in the process of registering the property at the Land Registry" then tell the solicitors its not them that are asking, and the lawyer is the clients mouthpiece only...its for OP to prove to prove your liability for these random additional charges...

MMM

not a very helpful post