HSBC charging me for unauthorised transactions

Marksweb

Before Christmas there were 5 payments made to play.com for just short of £900. Now being a recent graduate I'm still good friends with my overdraft & would dream of making such payments.
I phoned HSBC & they instantly refunded etc.

This morning I've had a letter from them to say their investigation has concluded that I authorises the transactions & they will re-debit my account in the next 7 days. The evidence they attached appears to be multiple duplicate documents (1 for each transaction altho each states the order of 5 4th gen iPod touches!) which seem to only say that each transaction would have required that secure 3D thing.

There's no details about me, and a few days before this all happened I had an email from play.com about a change to the registered email on my account. At the time I contacted them but heard nothing, and my accounts obviously been taken over so I can't do anything there.

What can I do!? When this payment lands on my account it will take me well over my overdraft limit again & I can't see the bank doing anything after what this letter says if I call them.

I'm currently considering moving my money & changing where I get paid to try & keep my money, mine!

Help!

simongregson

Next step banking ombudsman. Details of how to use should be provided by your bank (they have recently got in trouble for not making it clear that you can complain further!)

Just because the transaction went through 3dsecure doesn't mean that it is not fraud. In particular Play.com is vulnerable to fraud because they always store your card details and provide no option to delete them. Do you share a house, or is your post delivered to a communal area? Where were the items delivered to?

If the transaction took place in your overdraft your maximum liability is £50.

It would be a good idea to change the bank you get paid into while the amount is in dispute, as you might lose access to money paid into your current bank account while the complaint progresses.

Fiddlestick

Have you tried disputing the bill with play.com?

You said you contacted them - what did they say?

Marksweb

Fiddlestick wrote: »

Have you tried disputing the bill with play.com?

You said you contacted them - what did they say?

They didn't ever get back to me. I emailed them when the email address changed on my account to say I didn't make the change, and then again when the transactions were made after I had spoken to the bank.

But as I say, I can't access my account, the email changed & didn't require the authorisation from the existing account. And therefore I can't perform a password reset etc. Useless company!

I've just spoken to HSBC, the team that deal with this stuff don't work weekends! Useful when that eats in to the 7 day process!

Well, I've submitted my request to change my payment account with work & going to move some available cash so I can fill up my car in the week & still go out to celebrate my mates birthday today despite not exactly feeling up to it right now!

simongregson wrote: »

If the transaction took place in your overdraft your maximum liability is £50.

How does that work? HSBC will be phoning me back on monday so I'd like to know the details so that I can dispute anything they say then.

olly300

If play.com didn't respond to your email then the onus is on you to either phone them up or send them a letter (preferably by recorded signed for) disputing the transactions.

Just leaving something as you have found doesn't mean it will go away.

Once you have some proof that you disputed the issue with play.com you can then show this to the bank.

Marksweb wrote: »

How does that work? HSBC will be phoning me back on monday so I'd like to know the details so that I can dispute anything they say then.

As far as HSBC are concerned play.com says the transactions were genuine so this doesn't apply. If you were still in dispute with play.com then HSBC couldn't make you liable for more than £50.

I suggest you get back in touch with play.com asap* then tell HSBC that the matter is still disputed by you.

*When you are on the phone first ask the operators name and write it down. Then write down the date and time of the call. Also ask if there is an address to send a letter to. If there is put a summary of the call in the letter making it clear at the end you still dispute the charges.

Marksweb

olly300 wrote: »

If play.com didn't respond to your email then the onus is on you to either phone them up or send them a letter (preferably by recorded signed for) disputing the transactions.

Just leaving something as you have found doesn't mean it will go away.

Thanks, I assumed HSBC would deal with all of that on my behalf.

Fiddlestick

Marksweb wrote: »

How does that work? HSBC will be phoning me back on monday so I'd like to know the details so that I can dispute anything they say then.

If you were within your overdraft at the time the transactions hit then it would be covered by the Consumer Credit Act just like a credit card would for liability.

It's a tricky one to make fly with the banks though but it *IS* possible.

Marksweb

A few of my friends last night suggested that if the bank won't sort this then I should report it to the police. A few of them knew people who have been through the same thing & as soon as they involved the police it was resolved quickly.

Mr_K

Don't know if this helps but play.com have a very poor security record. There are numerous cases where people have had their account hacked
e.g.
http://forum.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2898802
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/1531695
http://www.creditcardhelp.org.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=104
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=573504

The banks must know this so it should strengthen your case.

Once your credit cards details are on Play , there is no way to delete it. My CC has now expired on there, I won't be updating it or using them again.

Forget Play they're a waste of space, pursue with your bank and inform the police.

Marksweb

Thanks for the links.

I've had what will probably be the last conversation with HSBC on this matter this morning.

Essentially this week I've phoned them in the evening 3 times & been lied to. So phoned at 9am today to ensure I could speak to someone.

I was passed on to an off-shore call centre & told that they would not consider taking the case any further because the transactions had passed through 3D Secure authentication and "only you should know your password" were their reasons.
None of this seems to meet the FSA Guidelines (5.1.11) which states that they must prove that I authorised the payments.

I've been in contact with the Police (on twitter!) & was told to report it to actionfraud.org.uk and I also sent the story to BBC's Watchdog.

I don't know if its worth going to the local police station as well this evening.

olly300

If you want HSBC to keep your money then go ahead and make it your last conversation, however I would:

1. Get in touch with play.com again in writing. I would do it via an email and also a letter with proof I posted it to them i.e. recorded signed for, asking them to state that their system is 100% secure, there is no chance that your account could be hacked and no-one else has complained of this in the past 6 months. Plus I would also ask for my money back. I would also ask them to reply to the letter within 21 days. (They won't answer your request or give you the money back but I would be after proof that I tried to contact the retailer more than once.)

2. Write a letter with the title "Formal Complaint" to HSBC again sent by recorded signed for so they couldn't claim they didn't receive it. Informing them:
a. Of what the specific section of the banking code says
b. That I was still in dispute with Play.com and so far they have refused to reply to correspondence
c. If they didn't resolve the matter properly I would take them to a regulator or court.

3. Wait 8 weeks then if they hadn't bothered to pay me back either:
a. Launch a small claims court claim (this would cost me and take a few months)
b. Complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service (this would cost them and take nearly a year)
I would then use the proof in my case that I emailed play.com twice (helps if you got automated email replies from them) and sent them a letter that they highly likely would have got because I have the mailing slip, but they didn't reply.

OR
If they had paid me back complain to the FSA about how they treated me and ignored the banking code until I kicked up a fuss.

(And yes I've had disputes with banks and credit card companies about transactions and yes I've got my money back but my amounts have been smaller than yours. )