Private sellers who should be business sellers any thoughts?

George666

Another question I would like to put before the forum is this.
If a seller has a private account and running a business through it they are at the very least evading tax so where do they spend their profits?
One simple answer has to be leave it in their paypal account and buy things from ebay with the profits they are making.
The real question is this how many of these sellers are also the buyers we hear about on this forum who never seem to recieve items or if they do the item is always damaged and they want a partial refund?
If a seller is willing to rip off ebay and the taxman then ripping off other sellers will be very easy for them to do they will not think twice about it.
Think about that all you sellers on the forum who are saying this does not impact me the next time a buyer says they have not recieved an item or claims an item turned up damaged and wants a partial refund.
Then maybe you will thank those of us who report this type of seller and try to get something done about it.

Myyrrddyn

I would say that the meccano magazines are still under some sort of copyright.

RFW

I have been fairly reliably informed that Ebay and HMRC work together and high volume private sellers are flagged up to HMRC quicker than any other seller.

Crowqueen

George666 wrote: »

Another question I would like to put before the forum is this.
If a seller has a private account and running a business through it they are at the very least evading tax so where do they spend their profits?
One simple answer has to be leave it in their paypal account and buy things from ebay with the profits they are making.
The real question is this how many of these sellers are also the buyers we hear about on this forum who never seem to recieve items or if they do the item is always damaged and they want a partial refund?
If a seller is willing to rip off ebay and the taxman then ripping off other sellers will be very easy for them to do they will not think twice about it.
Think about that all you sellers on the forum who are saying this does not impact me the next time a buyer says they have not recieved an item or claims an item turned up damaged and wants a partial refund.
Then maybe you will thank those of us who report this type of seller and try to get something done about it.

I think saying that is very unfair on the people who genuinely come here for advice about such matters, both sellers (who may take you at your word and get hit with problems because they automatically disbelieve the buyer with a problem) and buyers who lose out because the seller doesn't believe them.

I know I sometimes make them but there are an awful lot of assumptions in that post.

eBay registration has very little to do with whether someone is registered for tax - although non-declaration on eBay might go hand-in-hand with non-declaration to HMRC, there is a possibility that they may declare to HMRC but not to eBay. eBay business registration has more to do with adherence to returns laws and informing the consumer that they are trading rather than declaration of their earnings to the taxman. Of course it has an impact on other eBay users - particularly when the "private" seller does not have to offer the full range of returns that other sellers have to, and is eligible to use free listing days and the 99p free auction quota each month - but that does not mean everyhting in your post is necessarily true.

I am not of course saying it is right to mislead the consumer into thinking the seller is a private customer, but I would be wary of making people out to be immediately guilty of tax evasion when they say their item has not turned up or has been damaged in the post. A CD I ordered before Christmas didn't arrive for three weeks - so as per your post, me telling the seller this after two weeks and expecting a refund when it did not arrive after a third week means I'm guilty of tax fraud. Because of course everyone's item always gets to them precisely on time and nothing ever genuinely goes missing or gets damaged in the post...

George666

I don't need to make many assumptions there is some very good evidence that sellers like I originally posted about do exactly what I said about evading tax by spending the money they make on ebay.
If this was not happening why would in most cases gift vouchers sell for near to or face value or even sometimes over the face value of the voucher.
When I withdraw money from my paypal account into my bank account I get the full value of of my money with the ultimate voucher real cash I can spend anywhere I like it would make no sense for me to buy vouchers unless the savings were massive which they are not and I only wanted to shop in that one particular store.
We have just had a post from a private seller on this forum who does not sell a lot but was having a clearout for new year and again the classic I want a partial refund routine has been sprung with the buyer doing in my opinion everything they can do to turn the screw while staying below ebays radar.
What a lot of sellers on this forum do not seem to understand is that a lot of real private sellers who only sell on ebay to get rid of things they don't want and make a bit of cash for them will also be people that regularly buy from ebay as well.
These are normally the people that are targeted by the hidden business sellers I started this post to talk about and if they rip real private sellers these people are than driven away from ebay as buyers as well.
One of the appeals of ebay and how I started selling there and many others is that you can get a bit of cash for something you don't want as well as picking up a bargain the core users of ebay are real private sellers and buyers who use ebay like a giant car boot sale selling and browsing for bargains at the same time.
I have also found out that this seller http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/abatoday/ that mobile48 pointed out had the same listing as http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/99paudio the seller I first mentioned is in fact the same seller as they have just replied to my message I sent them stating that they own both accounts this means that if one seller can operate two accounts one business and one private they can swamp ebay with their dubious listings which is no good for any seller on ebay.

macfly

George666 wrote: »

Another question I would like to put before the forum is this.
If a seller has a private account and running a business through it they are at the very least evading tax so where do they spend their profits?
One simple answer has to be leave it in their paypal account and buy things from ebay with the profits they are making.
The real question is this how many of these sellers are also the buyers we hear about on this forum who never seem to recieve items or if they do the item is always damaged and they want a partial refund?
If a seller is willing to rip off ebay and the taxman then ripping off other sellers will be very easy for them to do they will not think twice about it.
Think about that all you sellers on the forum who are saying this does not impact me the next time a buyer says they have not recieved an item or claims an item turned up damaged and wants a partial refund.
Then maybe you will thank those of us who report this type of seller and try to get something done about it.

Utter tripe. Fantasy logic. That's akin to saying if someone drives above the speed limit they will be stabbing your granny next.
Ripping off large organisations is far removed from directly stealing from other sellers.

Strapped

George666 wrote: »

<snip>I have also found out that this seller http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/abatoday/ that mobile48 pointed out had the same listing as http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/99paudio the seller I first mentioned is in fact the same seller as they have just replied to my message I sent them stating that they own both accounts this means that if one seller can operate two accounts one business and one private they can swamp ebay with their dubious listings which is no good for any seller on ebay.

First - agree with you that businesses posing as private selers are a bad thing. However, I've given up reporting as eBay don't give amonkeys, even with the most flagrant cases it seems.

Second - it is perfectly OK for one seller to have one or more business acounts and a separate private account. You'll probably find that every business selller on this board also has a private account (or often two - one for buying, one for selling personal stuff, as well as 1 or more business accounts). I agree though that they shouldn't be used to "swamp eBay with dubious listings". In fact, if they have any sense, they'll make sure to keep them separate and not obvious that they are related.

Crowqueen

George666 wrote: »

I don't need to make many assumptions there is some very good evidence that sellers like I originally posted about do exactly what I said about evading tax by spending the money they make on ebay.
If this was not happening why would in most cases gift vouchers sell for near to or face value or even sometimes over the face value of the voucher.
When I withdraw money from my paypal account into my bank account I get the full value of of my money with the ultimate voucher real cash I can spend anywhere I like it would make no sense for me to buy vouchers unless the savings were massive which they are not and I only wanted to shop in that one particular store.
We have just had a post from a private seller on this forum who does not sell a lot but was having a clearout for new year and again the classic I want a partial refund routine has been sprung with the buyer doing in my opinion everything they can do to turn the screw while staying below ebays radar.
What a lot of sellers on this forum do not seem to understand is that a lot of real private sellers who only sell on ebay to get rid of things they don't want and make a bit of cash for them will also be people that regularly buy from ebay as well.
These are normally the people that are targeted by the hidden business sellers I started this post to talk about and if they rip real private sellers these people are than driven away from ebay as buyers as well.
One of the appeals of ebay and how I started selling there and many others is that you can get a bit of cash for something you don't want as well as picking up a bargain the core users of ebay are real private sellers and buyers who use ebay like a giant car boot sale selling and browsing for bargains at the same time.
I have also found out that this seller http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/abatoday/ that mobile48 pointed out had the same listing as http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/99paudio the seller I first mentioned is in fact the same seller as they have just replied to my message I sent them stating that they own both accounts this means that if one seller can operate two accounts one business and one private they can swamp ebay with their dubious listings which is no good for any seller on ebay.

George, I agree with you in the main. I've been a private seller, I've found myself unable to afford to start up a business selling items on eBay, mostly because it can't provide me with a stable income in the current economic climate, and for that reason, I hate people who masquerade as private sellers when they are really businesses, believe me.

The only thing I didn't agree with was you posting such that EVERY person who has something go missing in the post or wants a refund for something damaged is doing it so they can have a free item to flog on as a bogus private seller. That was a pretty stupid post to make - it stretches the imagination so far as to be almost paranoid in its assumptions.

That's advice that's likely to cause more angst than necessary when people who aren't used to dealing with lost or broken items read your post and assume every buyer is lying so they can get a free item, when that's quite obviously not the case.

George666

Crowqueen wrote: »

George, I agree with you in the main. I've been a private seller, I've found myself unable to afford to start up a business selling items on eBay, mostly because it can't provide me with a stable income in the current economic climate, and for that reason, I hate people who masquerade as private sellers when they are really businesses, believe me.

The only thing I didn't agree with was you posting such that EVERY person who has something go missing in the post or wants a refund for something damaged is doing it so they can have a free item to flog on as a bogus private seller. That was a pretty stupid post to make - it stretches the imagination so far as to be almost paranoid in its assumptions.

That's advice that's likely to cause more angst than necessary when people who aren't used to dealing with lost or broken items read your post and assume every buyer is lying so they can get a free item, when that's quite obviously not the case.

I did not say every private seller running a bogus business on ebay is doing this I asked how many in my original question and my evidence does point towards the fact that quite a few are doing exactly what I stated in the question.
What I wanted was peoples points of veiw and to alert some people here that this is going on and ebay would be a better place without sellers like this.

Myyrrddyn

I vote let them be