Ground Source Heat Pumps

Fort_2

Geotherm wrote: »

Glad all looks okay now.
What readings are you getting on GT8/9 and GT10/11 when the pump has been running for about 10 mins on the heating cycle?
You can only close down up to max 30% of the underfloor heating, so you can calculate that from the house/room size.
System here is great, constant 19.5-20C all the time.

Gt1 on 27,7 now 27,9
Gt2 5,9
Gt3 tgt 45 now 45,5
Gt5 tgt 22 now 21,3
Gt6 compressor 32,5
Gt8 28
Gt9 27,9
Gt10 11,9
Gt11 12,7
After running heating for 10min:
Gt8 36,9
Gt9 33,9
Gt10 5,7
Gt11 -0,1
Have you ever heard about shunt valve?
I am thinking installing one to separate ground floor from first so that i could control temperature upstairs.
Thanks.

lovesgshp

Fort wrote: »

Gt1 on 27,7 now 27,9
Gt2 5,9
Gt3 tgt 45 now 45,5
Gt5 tgt 22 now 21,3
Gt6 compressor 32,5
Gt8 28
Gt9 27,9
Gt10 11,9
Gt11 12,7
After running heating for 10min:
Gt8 36,9
Gt9 33,9
These look a little too close. Suggest you check the filter on that line. C series is external, E series internal. Ideal is around a 6C delta. If the filter is clean, then you may need to turn that pump's speed to a lower setting.
Gt10 5,7
Gt11 -0,1
Still a bit high, suggest you still monitor it and recheck the filter again after another week of operation.
Have you ever heard about shunt valve?
I am thinking installing one to separate ground floor from first so that i could control temperature upstairs.
Thanks.

You may need a buffer tank and seperate floor thermostats, with a configeration change to the controller. The example I quoted earlier, has 2 zones each controlled by thermostats, without the internal temperature sensor installed. Best to speak to Ice Energy if you want to look at that solution.

Fort_2

Geotherm wrote: »

You may need a buffer tank and seperate floor thermostats, with a configeration change to the controller. The example I quoted earlier, has 2 zones each controlled by thermostats, without the internal temperature sensor installed. Best to speak to Ice Energy if you want to look at that solution.

I tried to remove and clean filter, but can not remove it. It is fitted externally, only can open cap, and can see filter. How to remove it and clean it properly? That would be heating system filter.
Thanks

lovesgshp

Fort wrote: »

I tried to remove and clean filter, but can not remove it. It is fitted externally, only can open cap, and can see filter. How to remove it and clean it properly? That would be heating system filter.
Thanks

There should be a circlip holding it in, as per the ground loop.

rogerblack

I'm wondering about using a cobbled-together system, that I may or may not upgrade in the future, as a test.

I'm currently in the process of insulating my house, which is largely uninsulated with oodles and oodles of kingspan and related materials.

At the end of this, I will be needing comparatively little heat, to the point at which the gas price starts to noticably rise due to the 'first units' rates.

This, combined with concerns about future gas prices means I am considering a heat pump running on economy 10.

I have been pondering something similar to http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Air-Conditioning-18000-BTU-Split-System-TOSHIBA-DIY-/300375609127?pt=UK_Home_Garden_Hearing_Cooling_Air&hash=item45efc80f27 ,.

This would be hooked up, so it drew air from under the floor void (100m^2), making it similar to a earth coupled heat pump, and the output would be routed into a large volume of gravel, as a heat store for when electricity is expensive.

It would of course somewhat lower the temperature under the floor, but the added insulation should easily counter the small additional heat loss.

Neglecting this, and coming onto the point.

I've yet to find any small heat pumps like this with graphs for temperature in/out vs COP.

Can anyone point me to any?

This would enable me to firm up cost/benefit analysis, so I can actually do detailed calculations as to the benefits and costs.

I would ideally like to get this installed by an approved installer - but that's unlikely to happen, given my budget for the system.

Thanks!

lovesgshp

rogerblack wrote: »

I'm wondering about using a cobbled-together system, that I may or may not upgrade in the future, as a test.

I'm currently in the process of insulating my house, which is largely uninsulated with oodles and oodles of kingspan and related materials.

At the end of this, I will be needing comparatively little heat, to the point at which the gas price starts to noticably rise due to the 'first units' rates.

This, combined with concerns about future gas prices means I am considering a heat pump running on economy 10.

I have been pondering something similar to http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Air-Conditioning-18000-BTU-Split-System-TOSHIBA-DIY-/300375609127?pt=UK_Home_Garden_Hearing_Cooling_Air&hash=item45efc80f27 ,.

This would be hooked up, so it drew air from under the floor void (100m^2), making it similar to a earth coupled heat pump, and the output would be routed into a large volume of gravel, as a heat store for when electricity is expensive.
I can see the point of pulling in the air from the floor void, but you will use a lot more energy heating up the gravel.

It would of course somewhat lower the temperature under the floor, but the added insulation should easily counter the small additional heat loss.

Neglecting this, and coming onto the point.

I've yet to find any small heat pumps like this with graphs for temperature in/out vs COP.
Most HP suppliers will give COP figures, but they are to a specified performance level.
http://www.worcester-bosch.co.uk/homeowner/products/air-source-heat-pumps/air-to-air-heat-pump/technical-data-tables


Can anyone point me to any?

This would enable me to firm up cost/benefit analysis, so I can actually do detailed calculations as to the benefits and costs.

I would ideally like to get this installed by an approved installer - but that's unlikely to happen, given my budget for the system.

Thanks!

I honestly cannot see why you would go through this complicated route with a air/air system.

dnichcole

Where would you position the gravel? This would have to be carefully graded. But honestly, the gravel doesnt hold enough heat - perhaps half a kWhr per cubic meter, per degree change, which would need a lot of either gravel or of temperature rise. You may have heard about gravel stores in large commercial power systems, but these were doing alarming things like alternately cooling them to minus 40, and heating to hundreds of degree.

nosha123

Hi Geotherm
Hope you are well over there in Italia!
I have been doing almost DAILY readings of our elec meter and the GSHP hours of operation...
I have adjusted the room temps (via the Heat Pump... not the individual room stats) to 20º
The daily hours of operation... are averaging about 14hrs per day (Is this a more average normal usage?)
Hours of additional heat source have only increased by 3 hours in 3 weeks - which seems MUCH better than before!!!!
And our meter is showing an approx usage of 60 to 80kWh per day
This is all MUCH more normal.... the gas has been topped up too! Only 1kg of vapour was lost apparently.
I am going to keep an eye on the readings...
What else can we adjust or fine tune to get the bills down more? I still think that our usage is a bit on the high side.... and I am guessing the majority of it will be the heat pump (80kWh equates to £216.00 per month

dnichcole

Dear Nosha123 where are you living? In Finland?
My heat pump (the same model as you, possibly, the IVT C6) has used ONE hour of additional heat in the entire winter, and during this part of February, the average daily consumption is about 20kWh/day, and the worst it got during December was nudging over 30 kWh/day a few days.
Perhaps it has to do somewhat with the depth or length of your store. Undersized boreholes or horizontal piperuns would cause the machine to run out of heat more quickly.

nosha123

Hi Dnichole - well we had some teething issues over xmas which caused the system to switch to electric. Now trying to get some recompense from supplier as faulty part caused the problem.

How can I get my pump to consume just 20kwh per day??????? I would LOVE to know!!! I thought this system was supposed to be CHEAP to run!

I live in London area. 2 adults in house. One shower one bath per day and usual appliances and mod cons. House is 3,000sqft+ (can never remember actual size) UFH throughout.

Pipework is horizontal ground loop in garden - 3 trenches 50m long to a depth of 1m at a width of 1m.
Each trench received 200m of 32mm pipework in slinky design

ANy advice?