Employment Law - unpaid overtime

NikNox

getmore4less wrote: »

OK we have had a bit of fun but this is serious if he needs to keep the job.

Looks to me the others have just gone along with the must work longer hours so they make the work last that long.

The current approach, I have finished so I am going home now is reasonable but perhaps a new stratagy might help.

Who deals directly with the customers.

How about picking if possible the most important tasks from a business point of view and making sure that all these get done well and on time and that the customers/key people get to know it is hubby delivering.

Start being the most important part of the team when it comes to interactions with other teams, easy if every one else is fed up and taking time over work you are the one with time during the day to do this, leave the less important stuff for the forced overtime.

If the guys in his department are lazy is there another department that needs help do some work for them to help out.

Identify the key guys other than the boss.

Make yourself important, even start doing the bosses work if possible


Then watch the potential mess that happens when he has a weeks holiday.

Are you one of his colleagues in cognito?? You have a pretty good insight to how this company works!! Ironically, if the Boss and hubby's colleague in the sales office are off on business to the Middle East or America, hubby has to run the office all by himself. Hard work yes, but he's not afraid of that, and all runs smoothly. But, if my husband wants leave and it would mean leaving the colleague that goes away on business in the office on his own, he's not allowed the leave because this colleague can't cope on his own! Funny that. My husband is a very hard worker, is very thorough and earns respect from other companies that he deals with. It's always him that does presentations to clients and his knowledge of the industry grows daily, so he takes pride in what he does and does it to the best of his ability. He is regularly quoting hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of business every week, but his other sales office colleagues fall far short of that, and they're the ones who moan about the boss behind his back but won't stand up to him. The trouble is though, that knowing where the problems are
is pointless if no-one is going to herald changes, so it's like banging your head against a brick wall. Where I work, staff are given a financial incentive for thinking of new, improved ways of working if their idea is implemented, and I suggested to my husband that he could suggest that at his company. Hmm, it was poo-pooed at the outset!

Nicki

NikNox wrote: »

If my boss made offensive comments about my husband then I would certainly complain to our Practice Manager. It may be their working relationship, but you don't go around making offensive comments about your employee's spouse. Sorry, but that's just not on, and doesn't make for a happy working relationship aside from everything else that's going on.

Maybe the email won't put him in his place, but at least he'll know that we're offended enough not to attend the Christmas meal, which is on a Saturday, out of work time and certainly not obligatory.

We might have to agree to differ but can't you see the difference in the two situations? In your example you are saying to the PM I, the employee, am offended by comments made to me about my spouse. What you are proposing to do is to write to your oh's boss to say because my spouse is offended by comments you made to me about het, neither she nor I will attend the Christmas party. I think that does make your husband look like you call the shots and will give the boss ammo to continue to make nasty comments to him about you.

I agree you don't have to go to the party if you'd rather not, I just think the way you are proposing to decline the invite could make your situation worse in the long run.

NikNox

Nicki wrote: »

We might have to agree to differ but can't you see the difference in the two situations? In your example you are saying to the PM I, the employee, am offended by comments made to me about my spouse. What you are proposing to do is to write to your oh's boss to say because my spouse is offended by comments you made to me about het, neither she nor I will attend the Christmas party. I think that does make your husband look like you call the shots and will give the boss ammo to continue to make nasty comments to him about you.

I agree you don't have to go to the party if you'd rather not, I just think the way you are proposing to decline the invite could make your situation worse in the long run.

I can see the difference, and you're right, sorry. It would be better worded as so .... 'I am offended by the comments you made about my wife, therefore we will not be attending the Christmas party'. I think that's better, and hubby agrees

getmore4less

NikNox wrote: »

Are you one of his colleagues in cognito?? You have a pretty good insight to how this company works!! Ironically, if the Boss and hubby's colleague in the sales office are off on business to the Middle East or America, hubby has to run the office all by himself. Hard work yes, but he's not afraid of that, and all runs smoothly. But, if my husband wants leave and it would mean leaving the colleague that goes away on business in the office on his own, he's not allowed the leave because this colleague can't cope on his own! Funny that...........

As much as I hate the politics of work I have been quite good at it when I needed to be.

Why is hubby not on these overseas trips?
These are key to getting the bosses ear.

He needs to start sniffing out another job in the industry using the contacts he is making,

NikNox

getmore4less wrote: »

As much as I hate the politics of work I have been quite good at it when I needed to be.

Why is hubby not on these overseas trips?
These are key to getting the bosses ear.

He needs to start sniffing out another job in the industry using the contacts he is making,

My husband has a young daughter locally, who he has had to fight through the Courts to see, and it's been a very long and expensive fight. The overseas trips often include weekends, which is when he sees his daughter, and it's been his choice not to go simply because he doesn't want to miss out on precious time with his child. Therefore he is responsible for holding the fort whilst his colleagues are away, and he does that very well. Since he's been in the job, he's made a lot of contacts and has been offered jobs in Aberdeen and Dubai, but we both have family committments where we are so relocating isn't an option at the moment. But, he has his feelers out!

getmore4less

NikNox wrote: »

The overseas trips often include weekends, which is when he sees his daughter, and it's been his choice not to go simply because he doesn't want to miss out on precious time with his child.

What you seem to be saying is he won't do the business trips.

Reasons don't matter but it will be a black mark that will overide any good he does.

NikNox

getmore4less wrote: »

What you seem to be saying is he won't do the business trips.

Reasons don't matter but it will be a black mark that will overide any good he does.

Not at the moment he won't, no. He loves his child very much, and spent a long time not seeing her, so to have her back in his life means more to him than anything. Some things in life are far more important than work.

dark_lady

Especially when you work for an !!!!!!. Incidentally if it had been the other way round and Nik Noxs husband had insulted his bosses wife i bet that other poster would be saying it was gross misconduct. But its ok for the boss to insult the employees wife is it? Different rules for different folks it seems. And there is no way that £120 pounds should be taken from his wages. That is illegal as others have said. Incidentally Pennman and Summerland at the Daily Mirror are asking for stories about Scrooge bosses and you can stay anonymous if you wish. So if you fancy a bit of revenge.........!

Nicki

dark_lady wrote: »

Especially when you work for an !!!!!!. Incidentally if it had been the other way round and Nik Noxs husband had insulted his bosses wife i bet that other poster would be saying it was gross misconduct. But its ok for the boss to insult the employees wife is it? Different rules for different folks it seems. And there is no way that £120 pounds should be taken from his wages. That is illegal as others have said. Incidentally Pennman and Summerland at the Daily Mirror are asking for stories about Scrooge bosses and you can stay anonymous if you wish. So if you fancy a bit of revenge.........!

I'm not sure how it helps getting the OP even more revved up about all this!

Whilst it is equally morally repugnant for either boss or employee to insult the other's spouse, the hard fact of the matter is that only one of the two has the power to discipline the other for gross misconduct.

OP's husband needs this job until he can find a new one. If he were to resign and claim constructive dismissal he probably would not succeed, and if he did the damages he would get would only be the equivalent of a few months worth of salary. In these uncertain times the more prudent situation is to stay in the job until he can get a new one, and to play the political game well enough so he is not in the firing line as much. Given that it is the owner of the company, not a manager or senior employee who is causing the problems what realistically are the alternatives? A grievance is not going to be worth the paper it's written on.

The risk is that egged on by OP, the husband gets more and more bolshie at work, and ends up being unfairly dismissed. Yes he'll get compensation ultimately for this, but that'll take time and probably won't meet all of what he'll lose in the meantime.

It's a rubbish position to be in but the husband does seem to be capable of seeing the big picture and be prepared to do what it takes to get through this until a new job opens up. It's OP who appears to want to rock the boat more, and I still think while that may be short term satisfying, long term it's a mistake.

NikNox

Nicki wrote: »

I'm not sure how it helps getting the OP even more revved up about all this!

Whilst it is equally morally repugnant for either boss or employee to insult the other's spouse, the hard fact of the matter is that only one of the two has the power to discipline the other for gross misconduct.

OP's husband needs this job until he can find a new one. If he were to resign and claim constructive dismissal he probably would not succeed, and if he did the damages he would get would only be the equivalent of a few months worth of salary. In these uncertain times the more prudent situation is to stay in the job until he can get a new one, and to play the political game well enough so he is not in the firing line as much. Given that it is the owner of the company, not a manager or senior employee who is causing the problems what realistically are the alternatives? A grievance is not going to be worth the paper it's written on.

The risk is that egged on by OP, the husband gets more and more bolshie at work, and ends up being unfairly dismissed. Yes he'll get compensation ultimately for this, but that'll take time and probably won't meet all of what he'll lose in the meantime.

It's a rubbish position to be in but the husband does seem to be capable of seeing the big picture and be prepared to do what it takes to get through this until a new job opens up. It's OP who appears to want to rock the boat more, and I still think while that may be short term satisfying, long term it's a mistake.

Why would I want to rock the boat and make life worse at work for my husband? That's ridiculous. I don't want revenge, and came here seeking advice for a problem that is affecting not only my husband but also his colleagues. One of his female colleagues is not taking her partner because he has told her he will punch her boss in the face if he goes, that's how much this man winds up his staff, and subsequently winds up those closest to them, but just because I'm wound up by his comments doesn't mean I want to seek revenge. 2 wrongs don't make a right.

It's difficult trawling through the net trying to find exactly what you're looking for in terms of accurate advice on employment law, so posting a question on an internet forum that can be answered by those in the know is, for me, a better option.

The behaviour of other people can adversely affect others, and this bosses behaviour affects those who work for him. My husband and his health and happiness is of utmost importance to me, and I would never do anything to make things worse for him. I'm simply trying to find out what his rights are, and any indication I may have given to anything else was done with no active intention, purely in jest.