Damp Proofing Quote (Chemical Free)

phoenix__

Hi all,

We have a semi-detached house built c1900, no sign of existing damp proofing. Have just had a person round from Frank Schrijver UK (http://www.schrijverdampcontrol.co.uk) who identified rising damp on the ground floor (didn't check anywhere else) and provided a quote of £2,200 to install their system on the outside walls (~ 21m of wall).

He didn't do anything with the party wall, and obviously their system wouldn't go near it. He did say (when questioned) that there could be damp issues there as well and we could consider a 'regular' chemical application but they don't do that.

Do people have any thoughts on this chemical free system, and the price?

Cheers,
-Jeff

ormus

there is no such thing as rising damp. dont trust anyone who uses the term.
and the quote is way too high anyways.

phoenix__

ormus wrote: »

there is no such thing as rising damp. dont trust anyone who uses the term.
and the quote is way too high anyways.

Thanks for the prompt reply. If there is no such thing as rising damp, what are they referring to and what term should they be using?

How much would you expect a quote to be?

ormus

in a normal house:
damp is caused by either water ingress from outside, through the walls or from above.
or condensation within the house.

one of the biggest causes is the outer ground levels being higher than the DPC. the answer to that is usually very simple.

cellars are a different problem altogether.

all other options should be investigated before paying good money to some possible dubious marketing company.
speak to a proper builder first.

phoenix__

ormus wrote: »

in a normal house:
damp is caused by either water ingress from outside, through the walls or from above.
or condensation within the house.

one of the biggest causes is the outer ground levels being higher than the DPC. the answer to that is usually very simple.

cellars are a different problem altogether.

all other options should be investigated before paying good money to some possible dubious marketing company.
speak to a proper builder first.

He claims (based on the age) our house is built with yellowstone brick, which is very good at absorbing water - I have no idea about this; based on the reading from his damp meter, I can understand the logic he was referring to about water being absorbed from the ground and moves up the wall (this may be flawed logic). There is no existing DPC, so the outer ground level will be higher than nothing. We have no cellar (part of the ground floor is a suspended floor, if that makes any difference).

The survey from when we purchased the house says "We obtained high damp meter readings around the front bay and to the front chimney breast. We also obtained slightly high readings in places to the main flank and rear walls. These high damp meter readings have been caused by a combination of the failure of the damp-proof course, external render bridging the damp-proof course and high external ground levels".

Assuming that there is no (working) damp-proof course applies, is my logic that 'rising damp' (whatever it actually is called) is caused by the building being in the ground and absorbing water, which gradually soaks into the brick? And that with the application of a DPC (be it this system, or a chemical one) will prevent this from happening, and the damp will eventually dry out?

This sounds like basic stuff for someone who understands anything about this; which I don't.

Cheers,
-Jeff

robk2468

It does sound quite high (Although I am no expert!). I would suggest getting a couple other quotes to compare.

ewcs

phoenix__ wrote: »

Hi all,

We have a semi-detached house built c1900, no sign of existing damp proofing. Have just had a person round from Frank Schrijver UK (http://www.schrijverdampcontrol.co.uk) who identified rising damp on the ground floor (didn't check anywhere else) and provided a quote of £2,200 to install their system on the outside walls (~ 21m of wall).

He didn't do anything with the party wall, and obviously their system wouldn't go near it. He did say (when questioned) that there could be damp issues there as well and we could consider a 'regular' chemical application but they don't do that.

Do people have any thoughts on this chemical free system, and the price?

Cheers,
-Jeff

Hi,
There are chemical creams out that prevent the damp travelling through the cement joints, we charge £500 per elevation, so a terrace house front & back £1000, semi detached front, back & side £1500 etc.

Schrijverd are new on the market and the price reflects that, but the system offers no more protection that the cream.

Jon.

phoenix__

robk2468 wrote: »

It does sound quite high (Although I am no expert!). I would suggest getting a couple other quotes to compare.

I intend to, however these are the only people who seem to offer a chemical free system.

David_Aldred

As far as I am aware this system has no British Standard as a means of dampness control. When rising dampness does occur it contaminates the plaster with ground salts. Unless such contaminated plaster is replaced to a specification able to hold back such salts within the wall the plaster will remain damp irrespective of whether any new damp proof course (dpc) is effective or not and the need for such a new dpc should be clearly justified rather than guessed at unless you fancy putting a new one in simply as a precautionary measure but that woudl be your choice.

An electrical damp meter cannot on its own confirm the prescence of rising dampness. This can only be done by taking several wall samples for each and every wall under investigation and subjecting them to laboratory analysis as described within Building Research Establishment (BRE) 245. The elctrical damp meter is simply a useful tool for highlighting areas of concern requiring further investigation and will reveal the moisture content in timber to indicate whether that wood is at risk of decay.

Such concern may relate to many things other than true rising dampness such as contaminated plaster, poor sub floor conditions migrating up into plaster / timber above, debris bridging wall cavities, condensation, sulphates from soot within old chimney breasts migrating into plasters, damp hearths, external defects etc.

Chemical damp proof courses do have a British Standard BS6576 which details assessment for dampness and how these systems should be installed along with associated works such as clearing debris from cavities, re-plastering etc. This is obviously very useful should a dispute arise whereas if there is no British Standard to compare a system against then you are obviously struggling to establish what that system is designed to do, whether it was justified for the problems that you have, whether it is actually effective at resolving that dampness problem and whether it has been installed properly.

Before spending a considerable sum of money you may wish to consider having the matter properly investigated by a competant surveyor who should be qualified to CSRT or CTIS / CRDS standard. A list of both contractors and independent surveyors who are appropriately qualified may be found within the Property Care Association (PCA) website.

There are other systems on the market to the one you describe if you are dead set against a chemical dpc (if indeed a new dpc is actually justified) although the modern cream based chemical dpc's are much more user friendly being odourless etc than the previous pumped hazardous types.

Kindest regards, David

Johnhowell

If your property was built about 1900 then the DPC will probably be slate rather than the felt systems used today. It is rare for DPC to fail, the cause is usually a fault caused by bridging [you mention high outside ground level], failed guttering/downpipes or damaged after DIY works. Most bricks absorb water but they breathe and dry out. If the source of water continues then obviously the brick will not dry out.

As recommended by others - get in a qualified Structural Engineer/Surveyor - not a salesman from a DPC company.

Our elderly neighbours live in a 1900s farm cottage and luckily there grandson arrived just before they signed up for a damp-proof spray system to the outside of the brickwork. It turned out that the damp was condensation due to them not opening windows! They had replaced windows with doubleglazing which the old buildings were not designed for!

Good luck,
John

earthlyideas_2

We had this installed on a very old property about 18 months ago. The salesman told us that after 12 months there would be an inspection by the MD of the company. We heard nothing from the company and the house is showing signs of damp again. When we contacted the company in the last few weeks, they told us that we have to book the appointment with the MD, even though the salesman suggested this was automatic, and that as 12 months had passed we would also have to pay for this visit. Reading other reviews elsewhere, it would appear that it is very unlikely they will stick to the 12 month money back guarantee. I wouldn't recommend this company or this product to anyone. It would appear to be a scam, which offers a lot and fails to supply.