fitting clutch/gearbox help,please!!!

simon88

I've just fitted a new 3 part clutch to my hillman hunter.Used tool to line it up & checked clutch disc fitted on gear shaft first.However much i try i cant get the gearbox back on without leaving about a 2 inch gap between engine & gearbox bolt holes..the shaft is going on but it seems like not the full amount.I dont know what to do.Is it a bad idea to try & draw them together with longer bolts? any help greatly appreciated.

mikey72

Sounds like the splines aren't lining up properly.
Have you tried turning the shaft slightly, or turning the box slightly as it goes in.?
The other thing is the clutch isn't lined up properly, in spite of using the tool, so try that again.
(How many hours have you spent lying on your back now with the gearbox on your knees and chest, and now smelling of Hypoid 90 for the next week? Happy days)

simon88

thanks mikey,will go through all those tomorrow.I guess it must be one of the reasons you suggest.It's just ive taken the clutch off 3 times,re aligned it etc & still no joy.its so frustrating
ive got the gearbox on far enough that it will spin but theres still this big gap!!!

mikey72

Other thing could be the angle, as you take the box off the engine can tip forward, so a mate pushing it back, or a jack under the front can help, as you may not be able to lift the back of the gearbox high enough, especially if you have left the back mount on.
(Mind you, I had a Hunter back in the 80's, so it has been a while since I did the clutch.)
Don't try to force it with longer bolts, as you shouldn't leave it hanging off the input shaft, and you may well just push the shaft into the box if it is stuck on something. Either will damage the box or the oil seals.

simon88

thanks mikey,will try tilting engine.sounds hopeful will let you know how i get on.thanks again for your help.

forgotmyname

Rotate the crank or driveshaft joint to help align the splines.

epninety

Some cars are just a pig to get the box back into the first time. If you're unlucky enough to get lots of practice on one car, it ends up being really easy. One of my cars, it took 4 of us two days to persuade the box back in the first time. 10 years on, I can do it on my own in a few minutes. I have had quite a bit of practice with that particular car though...

Depending on the gap, you can guess where it's hung up. First stage is to go through the spring fingers of the cover plate, second is getting the end of the input shaft through the clutch plate, third is getting the input shaft splines into the clutch plate then finally the end of the input shaft into the spigot bush. (3 and 4 might happen at the same time, or in reverse order depending on the design of the shaft)

Remember you need to be aligned in 4 directions before it will mate up. It's got to be in the right position left/right and up/down, the shaft has to be aligned with the crank, and the rotation has to be right for the splines to engage.

I start by putting the input shaft as close as I can to the right position left/right and up/down (just by eye), then try to bring the engine and box together.

Then move the tail of the box around to get the gap equal all the way around, that should mean its aligned with the crank. Try moving the box slightly up/down/left/right and see if it wants to go home.

A two inch gap sounds like you've not got the spline engaged with the clutch plate yet. You can put the box into gear and rotate the output flange to turn the input. If it won't turn, the splines have engaged, and if the alignment to the spigot bush is close, you should be able to wiggle the two together.

ONLY if I was sure the splines had engaged would I be tempted to try drawing them together with bolts. It's a bad idea, but I have done it a couple of times - once it even worked and didn't break anything

mikey72

epninety wrote: »

ONLY if I was sure the splines had engaged would I be tempted to try drawing them together with bolts. It's a bad idea, but I have done it a couple of times - once it even worked and didn't break anything

I don't like forcing, it should go together easily.
Looking at the Haynes manual, (yes I still have one 25 years later, and I can find it) you're supposed to tilt the engine down at the back to take the box out, then chock it with wood on the anti roll bar. But you're right, some can be real pigs, then they just slide in hours later.

djheath

I feel your pain. This is the exact same situation I found myself in when redoing my Pug 406 clutch. I spent a whole day trying to get it in, but it just wouldn't go in that last inch. I ended up, taking everything off again. Re-aligning the clutch to make 100% sure it was right, then phoned a mobile mechanic!!

He came. Laid under the car. Lifted the gear box onto his chest. Then in a blink of the eye lifted, aligned and push the gear box in!! I couldn't believe it!

Took all of 10 seconds!! I gave him £20 for his trouble, but would have paid more for the pain and suffering I had been through.

The only thing he did which I didn't was to put the gear box in neutral before he fitted it. I suppose that would help the splines turn a bit to align better.

Hope this helps! Good luck!

simon88

sounds just like my scenario djheath:(...so tempted to phone up a mobile mechanic too.Just feel i'm so close to doing it & it will be some acheivement for me,lol.
Thanks for your advice epninety.I went and got me old oily clothes on to try again today but i'm so knackered from yesterday(my arms feel like dead weights)that i'm going to wait till tomorrow now.
I can see tilting engine to get the angle right makes sense.I sort of tried that yesterday but gave up because jacking the sump up tilted it ever so slightly but then started lifting whole car up from the ramps.Would it help to undo nuts on engine mountings? or is that not a good idea?

somech

simon88 wrote: »

sounds just like my scenario djheath:(...so tempted to phone up a mobile mechanic too.Just feel i'm so close to doing it & it will be some acheivement for me,lol.
Thanks for your advice epninety.I went and got me old oily clothes on to try again today but i'm so knackered from yesterday(my arms feel like dead weights)that i'm going to wait till tomorrow now.
I can see tilting engine to get the angle right makes sense.I sort of tried that yesterday but gave up because jacking the sump up tilted it ever so slightly but then started lifting whole car up from the ramps.Would it help to undo nuts on engine mountings? or is that not a good idea?

aww come on your 99.9% there just tilt it slightly and rotate output shaft (prop end) whilst wiggling the box into place