Consumer Power: Should will writers be regulated?

Former_MSE_Wendy

The Legal Services Consumer Panel has concerns over the quality of wills and poor sales practices (such as pressure selling tactics, problems with storage) as anyone can write a will.

It would like to hear stories of any problems people have encounted with will writers so that it can recommend what needs to be done to imporve the market.

Full details of this and other consultations in the Consumer Power! guide

Let us know your views...

stevepett

110,000 solicitors want to get a monopoly on Will Writing, so they can swell their pockets with £Millions of juicy probate fees charging around £200 an hour PLUS a commission of up to 1.5% of the value of the entire estate (which may double their fee!)

Check out the solicitors compensation bill and the massive cost of their professional indemnity insurance (professional Will Writers pay a tiny fraction of the premiums) and you will see that it isn't just a matter of rogue unqualified Will Writers.

EVERY Will Writer be they solicitor or not should be properly qualified to WRITE WILLS (no, not just a 30 minute lecture in Law School 30 years ago!) and carry out at least 2 full days of updating EVERY year SPECIFICALLY on the subject of Wills.

There are some brilliant solicitor Will Writers, and rubbish ones both inside and outside. I rather suspect that there are more bad solicitor Will Writers than non solicitor ones (110,000 solicitors and maybe 4,000 Will Writers of whom maybe 1,500 are not properly regulated).

So some Regulation is required, but not FSA style "all advice is bad advice" but level headed Regulation that gets rid of rogues and ensures that ALL folk writing Wills have qualifications and ongoing training on - Writing Wills!

So:
1) All Will Will Writers must pass the same exams and have regular updates to the same agreed level - with no pretending that irrelevant subject aren't!
2) All Will Writers should be Regulated by an approved body - Solicitors, Society of Will Writers or the IPW.
3) The professional bodies should work together to agree common standards.

Stephen Pett

jr_morris

The only way a solicitor writing a Will can "swell their pockets with £Millions of juicy probate fees" is if they write themselves into the will.

So if people where more educated on wills and what they need to look out for (i.e. who they name as their executor) then i guess this will avoid some of the horror stories.

Errata

Of course they should be regulated, and if they have already been acting with great probity they'll be gagging for it.

PhiltheBear

Errata wrote: »

Of course they should be regulated, and if they have already been acting with great probity they'll be gagging for it.

Regulation is fine. Just as long as it doesn't mean a closed shop for lawyers. In today's world one of the big problems with writing a will is the minimisation of tax. Lawyers don't understand tax. But, seeing as this review will be loaded with lawyers, you can see where it's headed.

RAS

jr_morris wrote: »

The only way a solicitor writing a Will can "swell their pockets with £Millions of juicy probate fees" is if they write themselves into the will.

So if people where more educated on wills and what they need to look out for (i.e. who they name as their executor) then i guess this will avoid some of the horror stories.

All a solicitor needs to do is offer to be the executor to make a packet. I know one who charged £4000 to administer a will with the value of £8000.

In another case, it took 8 months and numerous letters from a lawyer to get the solicitor to send the original will from storage, because they wanted to execute the will.

Another wrote a will in trust in such a way that they would have been able to claim very high annual fees for administering the Trust for several decades.

No-one who is involved in writing a will should be allowed to store it or be named as executor, either as an individual or other legal entity. Nor should the storage provider or executor be related in any legal way to person or company writing a will, including shared directorships and contractual relationships.

John_Pierpoint

Why oh why don't will writers of all sorts, undertake to tell their clients that changes in legislation have made their wills inappropriate.

With modern computer technology it should be simple to store copies of wills so that they can be searched easily.

I have been an executor of five wills and the only one that did not need updating was the one my mother and I wrote ourselves; in order to cut out the will writer who had made himself an executor.

The latest example is one of those wills that leaves half the family house to the children, in order to avoid the loss of the nil rate IHT band of the first spouse to die. Since October 2007 the percentage unused of the nil rate band has been transferable to the surviving spouse.
Doing things the old way just means that the kids are likely to face a charge to Capital Gains Tax, when the second death makes the house available to them.

John.

As well as the appeals above for legal and taxation training for will writers can I add: Knowledge of the ghastly, bureaucratic "Lasting Power of Attorney" with its in build months of delay. If you leave it until you need it, it will be twice as difficult and twice as costly to get it set up.
When doing the check list the will writer should be required to explain LPA's to the client.

sassy_one

Sounds a good ideal to me

stevepett

We offer a service which offers exactly what Jon Pierpoint recommends and always have done!
What is needed is:
1) Secure storage with decent storage certificates for executors so they actually know where the Will is
2) Regular contact so we stay in touch (we send a newsletter and checklist each each year
3) members can contact us at any time for advice at no additional cost (and often in response to the newsletter)
4) Basic members pay discounted rates for updates, "gold" members pay more beut get free updates.
5) Our storage business is separate from our Will Writing business and has very low overheads so it will survive most things (and if it doesn't, our Regulator will take over).

The big problems are large up front fees (we charge annually or monthly) which some will writers guilty of) and the massive probate rip off where there is no competition at the point of death if professionals are appointed. IF (and it doesn't happen often) we are appointed, we will always stand down if the beneficiaries don't want us and want to pay someone else twice as much!

Both problems are really rather easy to solve! Add in equal qualifications and ongoing training for ALL Will Writers including solicitors and Bob reallyy is your uncle.

Simples!

stevepett

stevepett wrote: »

We offer a service which offers exactly what John Pierpoint recommends and always have done!
What is needed is:
1) Secure storage with decent storage certificates for executors so they actually know where the Will is
2) Regular contact - so we stay in touch (we send a newsletter and checklist each each year)
3) members can contact us at any time for advice at no additional cost (and often in response to the newsletter)
4) Basic members pay discounted rates for updates, "gold" members pay more beut get free updates.
5) Our storage business is separate from our Will Writing business and has very low overheads so it will survive most things (and if it doesn't, our Regulator will take over).

The big problems are large up front fees (we charge annually or monthly) which some will writers guilty of (just ban up front fees which are not actuarially calculated and kept in a trust fund) and the massive probate rip off where there is no competition at the point of death if professionals are appointed. IF (and it doesn't happen often) we are appointed, we will always stand down if the beneficiaries don't want us and want to pay someone else twice as much! So make it illegal not to allow competitive bidding at this point.

Both problems are really rather easy to solve! Add in equal qualifications and ongoing training for ALL Will Writers including solicitors and Bob really is your uncle.

Simples!

Stephen Pett

RAS

SailorSam wrote: »

It's not going to help you get your £300 back, but couldn't you just write another will. That would make the first one void and at least PA assoc couldn't claim to be your executers when the time comes.

Not neccessary.

1. ask for the will and store it with the Probate Office (cost £15 for life)

2. Add a codicil altering the executors before it is stored.