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New caravan falling to bits and the sellers aren't interested

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  • Mark1971
    Mark1971 Posts: 39 Forumite
    And her are three of the wheelnuts, the 4th was put back on the wheel as we only had 4 wheelnuts given us by the man who witnessed the wheel coming off and the 5th one (the one with all the thread flattened) is currently being examined.

    2rh4ly1.jpg
    20pykhh.jpg
    p2ipl.jpg
  • Mark1971
    Mark1971 Posts: 39 Forumite
    Got a letter today from Black horse.
    They are sorry to hear about the problems I am having with Robinsons, and as they have supplied the goods to me they are getting in touch with them to try and resolve the matter.
    They have assured me that a certain worker for the complaints department will be looking after my case and keeping me informed.
    They understand I am unhappy with the goods and advise that I keep the repayments up (which of course I will).
    I have been given a personal number to contact them with any questions, and they also advised me on contacting my local C.A.B or the Trading Standards Office.
    This all seems promising and I will keep you updated :)
  • Mark1971 wrote: »
    And her are three of the wheelnuts, the 4th was put back on the wheel as we only had 4 wheelnuts given us by the man who witnessed the wheel coming off and the 5th one (the one with all the thread flattened) is currently being examined.

    2rh4ly1.jpg
    20pykhh.jpg
    p2ipl.jpg

    Thanks for putting up the pictures Mark. Internal caravan ones seem cosmetic in nature to me, where ownber-supplier should be able to get to aome amicable arrangement to effect repair.

    As for the wheel nuts, it may be a little harder to achieve what you want from this, as I pointed out earlier, to me the threads have been 'stripped', which has led to the failure. If you look at the bolts you have placed in your posts, you will note the head of the bolt has the threads stripped. A cause for this could be over torquing of the bolt. Though looking at the rest of the botl, it appears the thread is 'intact', thus effectively keeping the wheel on. Unfortunately the nut side is not shown, and if this is also stripped, as the bolt is, then there is little or nothing that could have kept the wheel attached to the caravan, hence your failure.

    Alas to say, it is good news that you have the finance company on side, and that you will keep up repayment whilst this matter is sorted out, but I go back and say that in this case, no one else was injured in the accident, the previous offer from the supplier seems a good deal.
    Mark, the offer seems to be very good, though it is your, and yours only decision to accept, I suggest that the Company are reasonable in this case.

    For those of you new to the Thread and are unsure about swaging, and over torquing. Take a paper clip and continuously twist it. Eventually it shall break. the portion where the break occurs will have been extruded to a thin point, this is the same as stretcdhing an elastic band.

    The same as possibly occured in this instance.

    Again thnak for the update
  • harz99
    harz99 Posts: 3,719 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Home Insurance Hacker!
    Thanks for putting up the pictures Mark. Internal caravan ones seem cosmetic in nature to me, where ownber-supplier should be able to get to aome amicable arrangement to effect repair.

    As for the wheel nuts, it may be a little harder to achieve what you want from this, as I pointed out earlier, to me the threads have been 'stripped', which has led to the failure. If you look at the bolts you have placed in your posts, you will note the head of the bolt has the threads stripped. A cause for this could be over torquing of the bolt. Though looking at the rest of the botl, it appears the thread is 'intact', thus effectively keeping the wheel on. Unfortunately the nut side is not shown, and if this is also stripped, as the bolt is, then there is little or nothing that could have kept the wheel attached to the caravan, hence your failure.

    Alas to say, it is good news that you have the finance company on side, and that you will keep up repayment whilst this matter is sorted out, but I go back and say that in this case, no one else was injured in the accident, the previous offer from the supplier seems a good deal.



    Again thnak for the update

    Not sure that is quite correct Freddie - those bolts look to me as though they are the type that go through the wheel and bolt into the hub - I think is's called "spigot mounting". If so there is no separate nut to consider.

    They certainly have not fractured, as studs sometimes do for a variety of reasons.

    To me, it looks as though the bolts have "backed off" allowing the wheel to move from side to side and damaging it and/or the thread nearest the head part of the bolt; then when all the tension is lost the bolts will have simply unwound in the hub threads until the wheel came right off .

    As I think I said before you really need a motor engineer to investigate; but it does not look promising as to you getting what you want, maybe better to accept what ever is now offered by the dealer.
  • Mark1971
    Mark1971 Posts: 39 Forumite
    harz99 wrote: »
    Not sure that is quite correct Freddie - those bolts look to me as though they are the type that go through the wheel and bolt into the hub - I think is's called "spigot mounting". If so there is no separate nut to consider.

    They certainly have not fractured, as studs sometimes do for a variety of reasons.

    To me, it looks as though the bolts have "backed off" allowing the wheel to move from side to side and damaging it and/or the thread nearest the head part of the bolt; then when all the tension is lost the bolts will have simply unwound in the hub threads until the wheel came right off .

    As I think I said before you really need a motor engineer to investigate; but it does not look promising as to you getting what you want, maybe better to accept what ever is now offered by the dealer.

    Although I am unsure what the term "backed off" means I think this seems likely what happened.
    If all the bolts started to unwind, with them all being the same length this would ring true with why I managed to find all 5 within 2 foot of each, other almost in a pile.
    I am going to email Robinsons later again to ask what has been said between the finance company and themselves and am going to rush straight home from work tomorrow to ring the Black Horse too.
  • Mark1971
    Mark1971 Posts: 39 Forumite
    OK peeps.
    To keep you updated I called black horse this monday to see how things where going and i spoke to the person representing my case.
    She told me that Robinsons had contacted me with the offer of the "service now and they will sort out the damage" offer.
    I told her that they had offered me the chance to have the caravan serviced and they would reinstall the warranty (which is good) and sort out the minor issues of the lighting and that this wasn't good enough.
    I need the caravan restoring to all its glory and then i will have it serviced.
    They are now in further talks and only respond by snail mail (which in this day and age is weird to me?!?! but each to their own)
    The Black Horse representative who is sorting out this case asked me "If you don't accept the offer from Robinsons, and they don't agree to restoring the carvan, You are telling me you want a full refund for the goods as they have been sold to you unfit for the purpose as opposed to the longevity etc etc."
    I said yes,
    she is now trying to sort the matter out again and i will keep you posted:T
  • Mark1971
    Mark1971 Posts: 39 Forumite
    When my partner heard me having this latest conversation with Black Horse her eyes welled and she said to me "what if they take the caravan back? we won't have one and i love this van?"
    If we don't get what want and they take the van back and we get a full refund, Robinsons will surely have to repair the van and sell it second hand?!?!?!, I may buy it! Bargain!
    Anyway i will keep you guys updated :T
  • wealdroam
    wealdroam Posts: 19,180 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    Mark1971 wrote: »
    ...Robinsons will surely have to repair the van and sell it second hand?!?!?!, I may buy it! Bargain!
    But will they sell it to you?

    :D
  • Just throwing some fuel onto the fire here:
    1. You say that you checked the wheel studs with a torque wrench each and every time you made a journey. The only way to do this is to undo the studs, then re-tighten with a torque wrench. Simply applying the same torque wrench to already tight studs would result in over-tightening, and hence stripping of the threads, and then in turn looseness.
    2. Those type of studs with the conical bearing surface must be exactly the right size and pitch for the wheel and hub. All rotational force should be on the conical part, but from these pictures it looks like the wheel was loose and was bearing upon the threads. Bolts are only strong in tension, if they aren't tight, they will do nothing. The conical design means that there is a lot of "spring" in the connection, which in turn gives a lot of leeway when incorrectly tightened. Ones of the wrong size cannot take advantage of this spring, or worse still just bear down directly on the hub.
    3. It looks like you have a plain hex-headed machine bolt in one of the 5 positions. If this is the case, this is really quite dangerous.
  • DCFC79
    DCFC79 Posts: 40,641 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Why not accept the offer put forward to you
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