Divide & conquer

breadlinebetty

ninky wrote: »

sorry generali but that's just really nasty. i respect your economic knowlege and whilst we may not agree politically i've always enjoyed the banter.

i'm afraid you've gone down somewhat in my estimation. although i don't suppose you mind about that.:(

Ninky, I wouldn't let his snidy comment worry you. Considering his age and his so-called economic knowledge, he struggles. Doesn't even have enough money to raise a DEPOSIT on a house. So I'd say it's HIM that's dim! Me thinks he spends too long on his 'puter daydreaming!:rotfl:

Lots of fantasists on the internet you know.;)

mardatha

Good post lemonjelly, thank god its not only me who is saying this. But even in this thread, divide & conquer has worked. I thought you lot in here would have been wiser.

Sapphire

michaels wrote: »

Now that the two Milibands are competing for the top spot in Labour who is to say that they won't pass state secrets to Mossad when they come to power? Can they be trusted? I'm not convinced that they can. We live in interesting times.

Reported this.

WHY did you that??? Is this a PC thing?

Sapphire

ninky wrote: »

okay...who was responsible for lending out money to people who were unlikely to be able to pay it back?

who then cut back in lending to business, just at a time when it was most needed?

who reduced wages to the minimum they could get away with and creamed off profits in the good times (often to offshore untaxable places), thereby lowering tax revenue (and so increasing the deficit).

My company (private, publishing) certainly wasn't responsible for any of these things. My company couldn't (still cannot) afford to pay higher wages, and is barely holding out.

It's very galling to see people in the bloated public sector continuing to receive pay increases, and that hard-working taxpayers have to pay for the privileges it gained during labour's long and disastrous period in power. :mad:

carolt

Sapphire wrote: »

WHY did you that??? Is this a PC thing?

Er, no.

It's an anti-racism thing? You know?


Or is blatant anti-semitism OK in your world?

Malcolm.

lemonjelly wrote: »

There seems, from my perspective anyway, to be an significant increase in the polarization of society right now.

To me, it seems to be an age old way of getting your own way. Get the populace divided, blaming each other (or particular sectors) for the current woes and ills, meanwhile, push through your own policy regardless of opinion, expert analysis, or whether the populace are actually in favour of it. (A prime example of this, Michael "unable to tell the truth" Gove, & the academies bill, which in the space of 2 weeks went from 1500 interested schools, to 150 interested schools, to 50, to 16.)

Certain groups are easy targets. Asylum seekers. We can see - from the many threads on here that the welfare benefits system (& benefits claimants) can create a hell of a lot of vitriol, finger pointing and so on.

I've posted a few times that I feel that the private sector played a significant role in creating this deficit that we have. I struggle to see how it couldn't make a significant impact, given the billions ploughed into the banking system et al in a ridiculously short space of time. Funnily enough, other countries who also had to pour ridiculous totals into their national banking systems also have major deficits to deal with.

But apparently, it is the welfare state etc that is to blame...

Now, when the private sector started to contract last year, many in the private sector started there & then arguing that it was time for the public sector to be shrunk etc, feel the costs of the deficit & the like. Seems to me there are some that positively gloat about people losing their livelihoods. To me, this is a worrying trait.

We have been told repeatedly that we are in this together. I'm struggling to see how this is the case. We have a guy appointed to Barclays on £11.5 million a year+. And we have stories like this:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11279763

The general feeling is that the downturn is past for the private sector. It is now the case that the public sector must bear the brunt of the majority of job losses, pain and pay freezes for years to come.

I don't see this as fair or reasonable. Typically, it seems to me that the private sector is skipping any social responsibilities. They will argue it wasn't their fault, they didn't do it, blah blah. However we have massive amounts of bad debt transferred into the public purse, whilst the good debt remains in private hands.

Seems to me they've got away with it.

Further, they'll be protected by the condems, which in the longer term will only be worse for all of us. Of course, uber-capitalists amongst us won't worry about that as they are generally only in it for short term gain, and also themselves (rather than the social aspects).

But to return to the main point, there appears to be some significant polarization within society, a grand play of divide & conquer, which will allow the tories to do their bidding, and the Lib dems to be a proper sacrificial lamb, complete with some growing divisions in society/class/cultures and amongst other such groups.

Thoughts?

Are banks partly responsible for the 'bust', yes. However, they were also partly responsible for the boom!!!!

Did the government put money away during the good times (taxation of banks is and was a large revenue generator for HMRC) to pay for the bad times? Of course they (the Labour govt) didn't... they far were too busy 'buying' votes by spending, and largely wasting, others money.

Coming onto your divide and conqueur theory, I believe it's unfortunately human nature for people to turn on one-another (/other groups) during bad times. Self-actualisation and esteem are less important a need than safety (employment, property e.t.c.). This is an unfortunate truth.

carolt

breadlinebetty wrote: »

Lots of fantasists on the internet you know.;)

You don't say.

Malcolm.

breadlinebetty wrote: »

Lots of fantasists on the internet you know.;)

carolt wrote: »

You don't say.

Are you typing naked again, carolt?

carolt

Not sure if that's fantasy or horror? Wrong genre, possibly.

marklv

Sapphire wrote: »

WHY did you that??? Is this a PC thing?

It is a PC thing. Expressing your opinion is now no longer acceptable, it seems. Welcome to Stalinist Britain, where everyone needs to have a fixed smile on his face and promote multiculturalism. I'm just glad that some people, like that German cardinal, can see through all the cr*p. He was quite right to state that Britain is a 'third world country'.