MSE News: Wheel clamping to be banned on private land

Spartacus_Mills

bigturnip wrote: »

"The other cars in Crawley, West Sussex, were unclamped five hours later when the parking firm realised their error.

A spokesman for Aspire said: "The officer there can not just release vehicles. There is a procedure." But Moat apologised and promised full refunds."

Of course the Officer can release the clamp. To claim otherwise is nonsense.

Spartacus_Mills

Hadeon wrote: »

I guess that's ok then, several motorists having their vehicles held to ransom for 5 hours with God knows what attendant inconvenience, all for the terrible misdemeanour of parking their own vehicles on their own property.

This is one of so many examples as to exactly why clamping is being, & should be banned.

As for small businesses, they really should get their act together & spend some time & a little money to address their individual problems to deter inconsiderate & selfish motorists.

Indeed.

This case demonstrates the precise problem with clamping. The clamper is just interested in the money. They have no reputation to tarnish and will happily clamp and take the cash even if the clamper is in the wrong. People are just told to appeal but appealing to a clamper has shown to be a sham. How often do we see people trying to enfore a CCJ against a clamper and failing ? Some clamping companies see CCJ's as a badge of honour.

What people need to remember is that the clamper will, to start with, deter people from parking incorrectly on their land. However after a while their revenue dries up and they will have to target people who park their legitimately, even the owner of the land, for the most trivial of infringement and the adverse publicity and damage to the owners business/reputation.

As for people who want regulation this is an industry that has failed to regulate itself properly and cannot be trusted to do so. Regulation has been tried. It failed. The crooks extorted money from people and now it has all fallen apart. Good.

bigturnip

Hadeon wrote: »

BTW, what point were you making in your post at #489?

Please can you stop quoting within quotes, it makes it very hard to follow and very hard to reply to, it also makes it look like I said things I didn't.

I read it that a start date had not been agreed between Moat and the residents and that there was an agreement between Moat and Aspire. If this is the case it makes all the other actions of the clamping company seem perfectly reasonable.

The cars were clamped overnight, hence why the 5 hours to sort it out doesn't, at first glance, doesn't seem unreasonable to me.

It's also The Sun, so take it with a pinch of salt.

bigturnip

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

Don't be such a drama queen. Scotland has a system which works.

Does it work? People keep saying it does, but it would seem there is plenty of evidence to the contrary, the SNP even pledged to resolve parking problems in major towns as it had become such an issue.

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

The rest of the UK had a system which worked prior to clamping.

I don't know how long clamping has been legal in the UK, I suspect it has never been illegal, but I can remember them 20-25 years ago, so there was obviously less traffic about to cause a problem in those days. And what was this magical system you speak of?

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

Once clamping is outlawed there is hardly likely to be a free for all.

Depends on the situation, it only takes a few inconsiderate drivers who know they can get away with it, maybe free for all isn't the right phrase, perhaps free for the informed and inconsiderate, but there are enough people like that to cause a problem.

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

How on earth are small businesses going to be losers ? You whine constantly but have not demonstrated how they are going to lose. Do you have proof that their car parks will be constantly abused ?

I think if you look back over this thread I have demonstrated it quite well. But basically if genuine customers can't park, their custom will be lost. And yes, I have experience of parking being abused and trying everything to stop it before a clamping company was employed and 90% of the problem disappeared overnight.

I have never condoned the clamping firms in their current form and realise that drastic changes need to be made, but for small business owners who need to protect their parking it is currently the best option. As much as I don't like seeing motorists thrown on the mercy of a clamping firm, it is a far more preferable option than losing a huge amount of business because customers can't park.

My involvement in this thread was really to try and look for other options if this law is introduced, but it is quite clear from the attitudes displayed on here that people don't care about the impact of this on small businesses and are just happy that they will be rid of the clamping firms.

RosieLee_2

if your land is so important to you it's worth spending a little to protect it, you can get a fold down parking post on the net for about £40 so i dont see what all the fuss is about.
if its a wider area go to the local wood yard or pallet yard for cheap offcuts and build yourself a fence, again not expensive to do.

AlexisV

Read back over this thread and you will see many of us have offered advice and solutions.

trisontana

One of the stupidest answers from a pro-clamper appeared over on the CAG forum. When I pointed out that the ban had been in force in Scotland with no problems, their answer was "there is not the same demand for parking in Scotland as there is in England". Yes, I suppose Glasgow and Edinburgh are tiny little villages, and hardly anyone north of the border drives a car.

lucylucky

^^^they do know how to make us laugh.

Coupon-mad

bigturnip wrote: »

My involvement in this thread was really to try and look for other options if this law is introduced, but it is quite clear from the attitudes displayed on here that people don't care about the impact of this on small businesses and are just happy that they will be rid of the clamping firms.

Your involvement has ended up being as someone just 'defending clampers' though (and before you say it - yes I have followed every single post on this thread because I have been a regular poster for ages in encouraging people to take clampers and landowners to Court).

The reason you come across as just 'defending clampers' is because you have rejected out of hand every solution suggested - all of them lawful - bleating that the only thing that works in your opinion is something along the lines of highway robbery which is now, rightly, to be banned.

So you are a landowner who has been relying on a very murky dark grey area of law(lessness) to protect your car park until now. Count yourself lucky your firm who contracts the clampers has presumably never been sued as jointly and severally liable for an unlawful clamping situation. I've never seen a case reported on here or pepipoo forums where any clamping firm got it all right in terms of clear, contractual, adequate signage and paperwork and a fair, representative release fee IMHO so your clampers must have been one in a million if you reckon they did.

I do care about small businesses, most people here have probably worked for or know someone who works for a company with private parking. I used to manage a customer-facing service with just 3 private spaces - including what purported to be a disabled bay - very near a shopping centre and next door to other services/shops with busy spaces, but we never resorted to clampers.

We just put notes on a car asking them not to park there again if we got an 'abuser'. The same people/cars didn't repeat it 99% of the time.

I recall just one serial abuser who we just decided to nip in the bud by looking out for her after a few weeks of her unsociable parking. I deliberately waited 20 minutes after she'd parked in 'our' bay and then followed her into the neighbouring gym and got them to announce her reg number out. Neighbouring businesses understood the importance of car parking spaces just as well - if not better - than any 'parking enforcement' firm!

The woman 'parking space nabber' had to emerge into the reception area all sweaty from her gym class and I just sternly 'instructed' her to move her car as one of our disabled elderly clients needed it for an appointment with us - and no doubt they would block her in if she didn't move immediately. I also said the person in question was known to us as not being a great parker and had been known to hit the wall before, let alone other cars...;)

Said lady was very embarrassed in front of other people, she moved the car and never did that again.

Obviously it's not always practical for a staff member to run out and face the unsociable parker, but I reckon a well-worded polite sign would do the trick just as well in most cases, and if not then notes on cars would see off others. And I fail to see why a removable chain across a free bay would be an issue in most small car parks. It certainly wouldn't bother me if I were visiting a shop and had to stop outside and 'beep' my horn, press an intercom or pop in and ask for the chain to be undone so I could park.


P.S. Yes we are EXTREMELY happy to be rid of the leeches known as clamping firms.

usignuolo

The Minister said when interviewed on tv, there are two reasons why the current system does not work: the clamping industry has been allowed to self police and basically failed to act responsibly or reign in the cowboys AND the police simply don't (read won't) prosecute clampers however menacing or extortionate the circumstances.

In fact this raises another issue which is why the police have decided they will not get involved in anything THEY define as a civil offence - which includes illegal clamping and demanding money with menaces - even when the rest of us might regard this as extortion. Indeed they won't even issue crime numbers for such offences.

Anyone any idea why this is?