The destruction of the Middle Classes commences

Brallaqueen

didn't even realise this was an old thread, the arguments sound so fresh and current!

amcluesent

>didn't even realise this was an old thread,<

Eh? I started it at the weekend just past!

>I guess its the "professionals" next - once most of our jobs have gone...<

What's happening in outsourcing is outrageous. It is going like this -

a) Company decides to outsource to India, on basis that costs are 1/6th of Britain
b) British workers on the dole, claiming benefits (for 6 months)
c) Outsourcing goes wrong dues to reasons of misunderstanding requirements, language barrier, cultural issues etc
d) Outsourcing contractor says needs staff in Britain to engage with client
e) Indian staff pile into Britain on company arranges visas, client pays a 'good value' £300/day plus expenses, plus paying for the team back in India
f) All the knowledge, client payments etc. fly off to India, minimal tax paid in UK, draining wealth from UK
g) British university educated staff left on the scrap-heap, the 'lucky' ones get jobs stacking shelves in B&Q
h) Client's business needs change, outsourcing contractor presents enormous bill for 'change requests' to original contract which was bid as a loss-leader

That's the reality of outsourcing now. It's dripping poison every day on the workforce of Britain and will only hasten our decline.

StevieJ

Brallaqueen wrote: »

didn't even realise this was an old thread, the arguments sound so fresh and current!

Yes I thought that, maybe wageslave is a Mayfly

ILW

amcluesent wrote: »

>didn't even realise this was an old thread,<

Eh? I started it at the weekend just past!

>I guess its the "professionals" next - once most of our jobs have gone...<

What's happening in outsourcing is outrageous. It is going like this -

a) Company decides to outsource to India, on basis that costs are 1/6th of Britain
b) British workers on the dole, claiming benefits (for 6 months)
c) Outsourcing goes wrong dues to reasons of misunderstanding requirements, language barrier, cultural issues etc
d) Outsourcing contractor says needs staff in Britain to engage with client
e) Indian staff pile into Britain on company arranges visas, client pays a 'good value' £300/day plus expenses, plus paying for the team back in India
f) All the knowledge, client payments etc. fly off to India, minimal tax paid in UK, draining wealth from UK
g) British university educated staff left on the scrap-heap, the 'lucky' ones get jobs stacking shelves in B&Q
h) Client's business needs change, outsourcing contractor presents enormous bill for 'change requests' to original contract which was bid as a loss-leader

That's the reality of outsourcing now. It's dripping poison every day on the workforce of Britain and will only hasten our decline.

If that is all true, it does sound like the Indians are a lot brighter than we are and so probably deserve to get all the work.

Procrastinator333

amcluesent wrote: »

Back in the day, Thatcher responded to the demands of the Tory's paymasters by smashing the blue-collar worker and trades unions, destroying the miners pour encourager les autres.

Since that time, boardroom pay and bonuses have sky-rocketed as corporates chase ever-lower wage economies for manufacturing. The never to be repeated low cost of oil allowed millions of containers of cheap plastic items to come from China, all paid for on the never-never.

Now corporate executives have a new target, and the Tory's are eager-beavers to smash this group too.

I mean of course, professional, salaried employees in finance, HR, IT, R&D, marketing etc. Their annoyingly high salaries, generous T&C and pension liabilities are preventing the top-team getting a further 25% on their 'performance bonus'. So they must and will be smashed, like the miners.

Anyone who thinks that studying, getting a 'good' job and a career is available to them in the UK is sadly an idiot.

Temping, zero-hours contracts, right-sizing, off-shoring, the interweb etc. etc. will see to that.

FACT - everyone who uses a computer for their work is now scuppered. There's millions who are younger, faster, cheaper in Lithuania/India/China/Chile who will be doing your job within 5 years. Even a 2:1 or 1st will mean little when equivalent skills are available on a reverse-auction web-site and half the world is undercutting each other to get the work.

England is finished. By 2050, the living will envy the dead.

History is repleat with times when people have feared the ending of the status quo and the end of everything, either in the face of cultural changes, immigration shifts, or technology.

Things change. Get over it.

neverdespairgirl

StevieJ wrote: »

I don't think the living costs in Germany are that much different than the UK, It is lack of investment that is the problem.

Housing is far, far cheaper in Germany.

neverdespairgirl

ILW wrote: »

Never understood why someone with a degree thinks they should by right, earn more than than someone without. In the end you will earn what you are worth to your employer.

You are right. But in many cases a degree with make you worth quite a lot more to your employer. Not necessarily, of course, but frequently.

marklv

ILW wrote: »

If that is all true, it does sound like the Indians are a lot brighter than we are and so probably deserve to get all the work.

Nonsense. They are worker ants - they will work long hours for relatively little pay. However their management skills are poor, and that is their weakness. One thing, though, they are good at fooling lots of people that they are supposedly bright.

Enlighten yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations

Britain = 100
India = 81

NB: British IQ is dragged down by the large number of non-natives residing here. The 'indigenous' IQ is probably nearer 103-105.

marklv

amcluesent wrote: »

>didn't even realise this was an old thread,<

Eh? I started it at the weekend just past!

>I guess its the "professionals" next - once most of our jobs have gone...<

What's happening in outsourcing is outrageous. It is going like this -

a) Company decides to outsource to India, on basis that costs are 1/6th of Britain
b) British workers on the dole, claiming benefits (for 6 months)
c) Outsourcing goes wrong dues to reasons of misunderstanding requirements, language barrier, cultural issues etc
d) Outsourcing contractor says needs staff in Britain to engage with client
e) Indian staff pile into Britain on company arranges visas, client pays a 'good value' £300/day plus expenses, plus paying for the team back in India
f) All the knowledge, client payments etc. fly off to India, minimal tax paid in UK, draining wealth from UK
g) British university educated staff left on the scrap-heap, the 'lucky' ones get jobs stacking shelves in B&Q
h) Client's business needs change, outsourcing contractor presents enormous bill for 'change requests' to original contract which was bid as a loss-leader

That's the reality of outsourcing now. It's dripping poison every day on the workforce of Britain and will only hasten our decline.

Very true. These 'worker ants' are putting highly skilled British workers on the dole, and the government does nothing about it. Personally when I see parasites I reach for my poison spray - I suggest a similar approach to this problem, not using poison of course, but a means with which to stop this insane trend once and for all.

neverdespairgirl

Running_Horse wrote: »

lawyers and barristers charging ever higher fees, .... The gravy train is over; welcome to the real world.

I'm not quite sure of the gravy train of which you speak, certainly as far as barristers are concerned.

When I was a pupil during immigration work, so not even yet fully qualified, I got £350 for an asylum appeal hearing on legal aid.

today I did a legal aid asylum hearing, now 8 years on, and got £300. Reverse gravy!