Axe falls on NHS services

neverdespairgirl

Which S London ones do you have in mind?

chucky

neverdespairgirl wrote: »

Which S London ones do you have in mind?

the one between Lewisham and Catford - not sure of the name and the other one comes under London but is in Bromley/Sidcup area.

carolt

neverdespairgirl wrote: »

Most private schools (don't know about nurseries) aren't profit making, though.

BUPA, in this country the biggest private health care mob, is not-for-profit, too.

I've briefly worked in (though not for - complicated) a private school that was part of a huge private education company that covered many areas of education, incl secondary schools, nurseries and much more. That was most definitely run for profit. A miserable place.

Likewise, my DS attended a private nursery which at one point was run by this self-same company; then taken over by another. The profit motive was clear; probably above all else in the appalling salaries paid to staff who therefore don't care to do their job properly - in the preschool sector, there are no set salaries as there are at secondary level, so private nurseries (which is nearly all of them) really do pay their staff abominably. Even the managers are paid pathetic wages for what are incredibly responsible jobs. Whilst the companies cream off the huge profits.

carolt

StevieJ wrote: »

Nick has eyes for higher places, watch out Davey boy

http://www.nickmason.org.uk/?p=285

Really? Well, good luck to him - he seems like a decent sort of bloke. Given the Tories are going to be in power for at least the next few years, I'd much rather they had a few good men about them. I can't just rely on Vince Cable and Ken Clarke.

sammyjammy

Interesting debate, I struggle to come down on one side or another and i like the sound of the Australian way.

Did anyone see The Hospital on Channel 4 last night? It was about a Sexual health clinic in London somewhere, a bit of a fly on the wall thing.

Good article here http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/reviews/last-nights-tv--the-hospital-channel-4-the-games-that-time-forgot-bbc4-2036143.html

The most frustrating thing was these peoples inability to learn from their mistakes, there was talk of the girls who turn up for their fourth abortion within a year, the sigh of relief from them that they only have chlamydia or gonnorhea which can be treated, the questions about use of condoms answered with a negative time and time again. I find it sad that these people have such a low opinion of themselves nad seem to value their health and wellbeng so little but most of all I'm so mad that they see this service as something to be used and abused at will without any thought about where the money comes from.

If the NHS is to continue then it needs to be tougher, I don't want people to go without valuable care but I do want to see a higher level of responsibility from individuals that use it.

Don't get me started on those who make appointments with a doctor and then don't bother to turn up. Last time I visited my surgery the fail to attend rate was over 10% for the previous month :mad:.

treliac

Everything you've said sammyjammy is symptomatic of society today. But better not to get me started on it either.

P.S. A new girl where DD is currently working is announcing to anyone who'll listen, with no apparent remorse or embarrassment, that her abortion at 14 (when her mother let her 19 yr old boyfriend move in) has left her infertile. This is only one of the godamn awful stories DD brings home from her workplace!

neverdespairgirl

chucky wrote: »

the one between Lewisham and Catford - not sure of the name and the other one comes under London but is in Bromley/Sidcup area.

Lewisham Hospital is south of Lewisham, giant old Victorian building? I don't know the other one.

neverdespairgirl

carolt wrote: »

I've briefly worked in (though not for - complicated) a private school that was part of a huge private education company that covered many areas of education, incl secondary schools, nurseries and much more. That was most definitely run for profit. A miserable place.

I think it's unusual, though, taking private schools as a group. My brother, sisters and I went to 6 private schools between us, all charities. My DS' current school is also a trust.

Shakethedisease

most of us the the UK have no concept of handing over cash for contraceptive pills, ultrasounds etc..

Generally agree but have to pick you up on the bit in bold - who do you think buys all the condms for sale in chemists? - not all contraception is free.

Sorry my part isn't in bold anymore.. but a lot of women aren't advised to go on the contraceptive pill for purely contraceptive reasons.. ( heavy bleeding, pcos, very painful periods, edemetriosis, etc ).. a lot of cases women are prescribed the pill without a break to stop the monthly pain or the hormonal disruptions it causes.

A lot of women in the US can't afford an appointment, never mind the prescriptions. Sorry if I wasn't clearer.. this was what I was getting at. In the Uk we have no concept of this sort of thing. Paying for 'the pill'.

As for ultrasounds. I've given birth 5 times.. 2 in Scotland, and 3 times in different English trusts. All excellent. 2 miscarriages too.. again my care/hopitalisation each time was excellent, wherever I was. The 'norm' is an ultrasound at 12 weeks, ( to establish the pregnancy is viable).. and another abnormality scan at 20 weeks. I've had them wherever I was ( the 2 missed miscarriages were diagnosed at the 12 week one ).. So no complaints from me about the NHS. Wasn't all hearts and flowers.. but the care was very through, even if there were a few paint flakes and frayed edges here and there going on. I was too upset or out of it to notice much.

I digress..

Well, at the end of the day if healthcare = based on ability to pay.. then it's all a step back for the UK. And a very sad one. It does need a complete overhaul, the 'trust fund' and postcode lottery thing was a mistake.. as is the amount of management, red-tape etc, getting private firms in for cleaning, 'holistic care' tat, agency workers, paying for docs in to cover 'out of hours' from Europe and, of course, overall, the 'targets'. The list is endless.

But it's such a bad state of affairs when folks here are calling for 'tax breaks for private healthcare policy holders', and 'oh how much better' if we can introduce 'levels' of care based on what we can afford to be insured for. Not much on a pension or £65 JSA if the worst comes to the worst. Not really.

Uk wise ? Let those that want to pay for private do so.. but let them also think about the fact that one day, when they're a quite a bit older, or god forbid, that the disease or disability they or their loved ones may suffer from may be too much for them financially..that perhaps one day they also may find themselves not having the luxury of being able to pay for it. Or to sneer at it.

Like most of us, if or when the money runs out for 'private'.. they'll still unashamedly take their places in the ( omg ! ) 3 month ( instead of 3 days ), waiting lists for that hip op, or that that knee replacement, a kidney transplant, or a child that's been diagnosed with something expensive but treatable long term, or cancer treatments. And they'll be very glad indeed they live in the UK. They won't care about the flaking paint or the crap food.

Those too will thank god for the NHS. Because otherwise, there's nothing else.

Simple as that.

Hannah_10

Recently I was talking to an American friend. I was saying about an older man who had become suddenly ill, this is the overview:
The ambulance had been called to him by a neighbour in the evening but he had refused to be seen, after a jolly good try the ambulance service were forced to give up and go without examining him. The next morning he was worse still and phoned a relative very frightened. The relative then called the ambulance service. A paramedic car was sent. The paramedic found him to be far worse than expected and called a full ambulance. He was treated to stabilise him enough to move and taken to hospital for 5 days. He is fine now (in case anyone wondered).
At the time of telling the friend the story I was very upset with the man's behaviour and was thinking of giving him a stern telling him off. My American friend was quite concerned that I not do that "he has enough to worry about" she said, which perplexed me as I thought I had clearly explained it was a lack of worry on his part that was the problem, not an overflow of it.

She had forgotten about the NHS and on having already heard that he was not a wealthy man (previously always worked a physical job in the building trade) had made the natural assumption that he was not insured. Then using the best of her knowledge she had totted up the likely bill for 3 ambulance call outs and a 5 day hospital stay as in excess of $100,000 USD (roughly £66,000 GBP).

She is a kind of junior accountant in America, her husband is a pastor. They have 2 children and live a simple life- even so with two reasonable incomes they still can not afford healthcare insurance, it costs more than thier mortgage. A great number of other Americans are in the same position, terrified of every cough or sneeze in case this is the bill that costs them thier house.

I know it's not strictly on-topic but I thought it was perhaps worth highlighting what it looks like when you capitalise a basic human need.