Limescale prevention for whole house...

poorbutgettingricher

Volcano wrote:

Crystal precipitation and formation for carbonates is controlled by ion concentration, pH and temperature ONLY. ANY anecdotal accounts of magnetic/electric water 'conditioners' working are due to a coincidence with fitting these gadgets AND a change in 1 or more of the above factors.

What disgusts me is that as these do not work, the companies that peddle them are forced to invent 'science' in an attempt to offer an explanation re. the link from #1:



induction energy? alters the characteristics of the hardness salts? complete and utter lies!

just buy a britta water filter if you dont want your kettle getting covered in limescale!

Volcano

As I stated before the work at Cranfield has shown there can be an effect in circulating industrial systems, but this requires industrial sized units and powerful magnetism as v0n stated.

Could we say that the results of tests have been inconclusive rather than proven not to work?

No. Many of these mains water devices have been tested and none have been shown to work.

For Skiduck's link: Again this company uses its own version of science to justify its product. The "physics and chemistry" page is split up into 2 halves: the first contains an outline of water and hardness, which if it was an A level chemistry essay I'd give about 20%. The second halve attempts to provide an explanation and method for how the device work based on its claim:

When HydroFLOW is present, crystals are formed and grow helped by the orientation of the ions in the applied field.

Which is ridiculous as a temporarily applied magnetic field is far weaker than the constant inter-molecular forces between water molecules and calcite ions.

This company claims its device works by encouraging molecules to stick together. Your earlier post said: "an electromagnetic field changes the molecular structure of scale sufficiently to stop a build up - basically preventing molecules "sticking" to each other."

This could be a simple mistake by yourself but I think it is more likely indictive of the companies varied attempts at providing an explanation for something they know nothing about.

vicdec

I have read with some degree of interest the comments regarding the control of limescale buildup since I also suffer from this problem. I note the comments made regarding the magnetic shielding effect of copper, and this lead me to wonder whether the problem could be got round by inserting a short length of ferrous-based pipe around which the coils could be wound. This could be of stainless steel which should allow the magnetic-field to pass through.
Comments appreciated!

playitagainsam_2

I believe the copper acts not as a barrier or shield but as a conductor, transmitting the field throughout the entire water system. As copper is such a good conductor this has some credence. Copper can transmit RF energy easily. Well I am going to try this gadget which was recommended to me by British Gas to help reduce the number of their costly callouts to fix my overheating furred up boiler which is on a maintenance contract and if it seems to work I'll let you know.

efunc

Skiduck wrote: »

The Hydroflow has also helped customers with scoriosis. It will work up and downstream.

Scoriosis?? What's the connection?

George_Bray

Volcano wrote: »

I'm quite happy that I know and understand that these things don't work. The companies that make these also know that they don't work. This is why they have to lie and fabricate 'science' in an attempt to convince people to buy them.

I agree. There's no way these devices work. Advertising standards would ban the false claims if the regulations had any teeth.

The con artists have won though because, even if only 10-20% of people are left believing that the devices could work, they will still make quite a lot of money from selling them.

To anyone in any doubt, try some water softener test tablets (like about £2 for 10 tablets from Homebase). Do they indicate that your hard water has been turned soft by these devices? I very much doubt it. Also try washing your hands with soap. Do you get that soft water feeling, like with real soft water? I doubt that, too.

watersaving

There is a product on the market that does actually work - the Cistermiser Combimate. This product can be installed directly on the mains water coming into your house therefore offering whole house protection. It is not magnetic or electromagnetic but releases food grade material called Siliphos into your water system which simply coats your pipework and things like the heat exchanger in your boiler or electric shower. This coating helps prevent the build up of limescale! Simple, very clever and it works! Limescale can still build up on the outside of your taps or outside your keetle but the important (and expensive) inner parts are protected - they will even pay for your new boiler to be de-scaled should it scale up if the Combimate has been installed. Our plumbers swear by it and your plumber should know all about it too! If not, they can ask one of the builders' merchants. Good luck...

squeakyclean226

Look at the Hydroflow HS38 electrolytic water conditioner. IMO, the only decent one on the market - this is from feedback from customers. Liff wrappa is OK but would be my second choice, any other ones are a waste of money.

The Hydroflow has also helped customers with scoriosis. It will work up and downstream.[/QUOTE]

I used to get really bad limescale in my house, taps, kettle shower etc., and i had the Hydroflow fitted about a year ago and haven't had a problem since! And my fuel bills have gone down, which is apprently due to the fact that it ahs disolved all the limescale inside my boiler. So it definatley works!

Imp

Having looked at this problem for a long time and being an engineer for the water industry, I have installed one of these on the feed to my hot water system only, so the cold water is untreated.

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/68371

It is a polyphosohate dosing unit, delivering food grade chemical which should coat the pipe.

I have taken time to go through the peer reviewed literature. Electronic and magnet water treatment stops water scale sometimes, but whether or not they work is not predicable, and the length of time the water will not produce scale for is unpredictable. The papers indicate they are less rather than more likely to work.

The polyphosphate will eliminate hardness, but in high doses. At the low doses it apparently affects the formation of the crystals so they don't scale up the pipe.

There are two types of hardness, magnesium and calcium. The polyphosphate will make scaling worse if your hardness has magnesium but should be eliminated if it is calcium.

I am waiting to find out how well the dosing has worked, the shower screen seems to be keeping cleaner, but I will report back.