It's STILL tough and not getting better - so how are we coping?

dubgirl

I thought Lidl was supposed to be one of the cheapest supermarkets. Nouvelle is still on special at a £1 for 4 at our local Morrisons. I work in the criminal justice system and we have been told recently that several sections of the service I work for are being put out to tender, part of Cameron's wish for more private in public I guess. It doesnt affect my job, but a lot of others are very concerned. This is on top of an anticipated large budget cut for next year, possibly up to 25%!

BB1984

Evening all! A nice healthy debate going on here I see!

I hope you don't mind if I add my thoughts to the housing issue, but please nobody take what I'm saying the wrong way as I certainly don't want to offend anyone. In fact, I feel that I'm not as knowledgeable about housing issues etc as I should be so I hope that people will put me right if I've got the wrong end of the stick about anything!

Ok, so here's how I understand it: if you're on a low enough income and/or in receipt of certain benefits, you can sign up to go on a waiting list for a HA or council house. If your income subsequently goes up, or your circumstances change, eg your kids leave home, you don't have to move out.

From the point of view of a young person who has worked hard all her life, is paid average wage, and scrimped and saved to buy a home with her husband, I must admit that I'm resentful of people who live in often rather nice houses, for a tiny rent, when they don't really seem to need it. (obviously social housing is a brilliant and essential thing for many people, who DO need it, and I don't begrudge them at all!) One example is my colleague. His wife was a single mum on a low wage, until he met her,they married and he moved in. Now, the kids have left home, they both work and earn average wage, but still live in the house paying only £300 per month- the private rate for a similar house would be approx £600-700.

So am I right in thinking that they are effectively being subsidised by the state, and living in a property that would be perfect for a young family in need? It just seems unfair to me that there are so many people paying private rent that is a far higher proportion of their income, because their income was never quite "low enough" to start with.

As for the argument regarding people being chucked out of their homes; I do have sympathy for some cases such as elderly people who have lived their all their lives etc. Hopefully these will be sensibly assessed on a case by case basis and not a broad-brush approach. However- how is this any different that someone living in private rented, and can be given notice to leave whenever the landlord feels like it? Im not saying it's right, just that I don't understand why someoneliving in HA housing should have enhanced rights over someone who rents privately.(perhaps regs on private housing need to be tightened up?)

Ok I've probably gone on long enough now and it's past my bedtime, so I'll sign off! Like I said, I'm not trying to be judgemental or anything, just trying to learn and understand where other people are coming from.

BB

Ps- I buy nice loo roll, but only ever on offer at the co-op when it's about £2.50 for 9 rolls. The really cheap stuff seems to get used up quicker so it's prob similar cost-wise.

Skint_Lynne

Yes,

I have tried and tested all sorts, from andrex to lidls to tesco value. The winner by far is the brand they sell in Farmf00ds, 9 decent quality thick and quilted for 2.00 for 9, so that makes them around 22p each.

Give them a go, I think they are great (especially when DH comes around, he eats it instead of using it for the intended purpose methinks).:rotfl:

pickledonionspaceraider

I know EXACTLY what you are saying BB1984. I have often wondered this myself

ceridwen

Hmm...I'm not sure how the figures stack up as to whether someone in Council housing is paying an economic rent - or whether there is an element of subsidy there or what. I dont know the answer to that. Obviously a private landlord will be making a profit - or they wouldnt be doing it. Maybe the answer to that might be to work out how much rent is necessary on a 3 bedroom Council house in that area for it to "break even" - ie no profit, no loss and if that "break even" level of rent is higher than actual rent paid on the house - then up the rent to "break even" level at the point at which the house became deemed "too big" for them (which would still be lower than private sector rents obviously - with no profit being factored in to this). Obviously it would be up to the person/couple themselves whether they wished to pay any extra rent that had become deemed payable or swop to a smaller Council property. Obviously there would have to be a safeguard built in that - should there simply not BE any smaller Council properties available to swop to then the rent would have to remain at the original level until such time as the option WAS available to swop (because smaller property had become available).

That way - no-one would be forced out of their home. They would just accept that if they wished to remain in their home (once it had been deemed "too big" for them) AND there actually was smaller property available to swop to then they would have to pay any increase in rent attributable to the rent having been raised to "break even" level. Other people would obviously have to accept that there were some people paying lower rents than themselves - but they would know that these people werent having their rents subsidised in any way - because they had been recalibrated at "break even" level.

There is another angle to this - I was wondering what I would do if I needed a bigger place to live in because I had children. Would I accept someone being kicked out of their home due to no fault of their own - so that I could have my children. The first snag to that line of thought in my head was the fact that ITRW I personally wouldnt have had children until I had my house in the first place - so I would never have been in that position.

Assuming though that I was someone who had decided to have children first and hope I managed to get a house later.....hmmm...could I sleep at night if I knew someone had been thrown out of their home in order that I could the children I wanted? I don't know the answer to that one - would I stick by my conscience and try harder to buy a house first or think "My decision - so we'd better just squash up some more"? That moral dilemma would give me a good few nights thinking if I were in that position...

If I were the middle-aged person/couple living in a home deemed "too big" for me, on the other hand, I do know exactly what I would do if there was any question of being forced to move - take legal advice as to whether it would be age discrimination to force me to move because of my age (ie if I'd been pensioner age I wouldnt be forced to - so why should I because I was under pensioner age?).

Sometimes one only knows exactly what you would do - and whether conscience or finances would "win out" if you are actually in that position...and obviously it would help the situation all round if Councils had better powers to throw out bad tenants. I've often thought "Why on earth should someone who wrecks a house/flat or is anti-social towards the neighbourhood remain in Council property?" If I were a private landlord and someone was trashing my house or disrespecting the neighbourhood I wouldnt hesitate to throw them out - so I don't really understand why Councils don't do the same and leave more housing available for those who do know how to behave themselves.

ubamother

BB1984 wrote: »

Ok, so here's how I understand it: if you're on a low enough income and/or in receipt of certain benefits, you can sign up to go on a waiting list for a HA or council house.

It may have changed, but as far as I understood it income has (or had at least) nothing to do with it. Anyone in housing need can go on a housing waiting list. In theory the greater your need the higher up the list you go (or number of points you get or whatever - I think it varies by council). Obviously, if you have plenty of money available you are more likely to rent privately/buy etc. so the majority of people on housing lists are likely to be of low income.

It's worth remembering some people have strong political views about living in a council house - for example - not buying it even though they have the means (and quite often a mortgage would be less than the rent!) as this takes it out of the council's housing stock which means a. less job security for council maintenance staff b. the money paid for the house does not go into building more housing stock for those in need and c. their rent paid goes into local government not national.

ceridwen

All this has reminded me of the blog I read through with total openmouthed astonishment recently - that woman is one EXTREME thinker....

But it has got some useful financial pointers - in between the extreme thinking:

http://under1000permonth.blogspot.com/

ceridwen

The article I noticed today is from "The Independent":

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/state-pension-is-not-enough-to-live-on-minister-admits-2038076.html

and the point that sticks out to me is the thought that the employment pension that this Minister is referring to as a possibility for people to put extra funds in would be based on the Stock Market. Now what is that warning about - something like "This could go down - as well as up...warning...warning...". I'm not quite sure why anyone would save money in anything based on the Stock Market now - as it looks so uncertain to me...

Anyways....a topic I often wonder about - with all this talk of State Pension Age being raised on the one hand and the way that a whole tranche of women are already being told that their State Pension Age has increased from 60 (and this started to take effect earlier this year).

Is there anyone who retired at the traditional Womens State Pension Age - but is having to wait for the State Pension to start being paid to them? How have you managed this? Are you living on savings till the State Pension starts up or are you registered as unemployed and claiming JSA (but you are "really" retired, rather than unemployed). Is there anyone else - of either sex - who has decided in the future to retire earlier than their projected State Pension Age and will do so by living on savings or claiming unemployment benefit (and, with that, having to live on an even lower income than State Pension).

I'm only referrring to people of 60 or over when they give up work - or who intend to give up work at 60+ and live on savings and/or benefit (ie not someone of "working age").

flipperOSN

I'm not very thrifty on loo-roll, it's Andrex I'm afraid My DH has crohns so lots of upset tummies means he need something soft on his botty! Obviously if there's a special offer on then I will stock up...

Skint_Lynne

It's obvious that lots of people have very different views on this subject. I get the idea that it might be a tad unfair that an elderley person is living in a big 4 bedroom house alone, therefore, they should be made to move somewhere smaller. I also get the idea that it might be unfair of the middle aged couple living in the nice house in a nice area for a low rent.

BUT: what about all the rent money they have already paid? What about the fact that these places may not be just bricks and mortar to these people, these houses are their homes! I really do think that people should be left alone in these instances. Different if they are a problem and are actually bothering other people.

Lots of council estates are 'so called sink' estates because of the dodgy folk that live in them, not because of the houses. Sureley it is better to leave decent law abiding citizens in their homes instead of moving in the riff raf. And before anyone starts on me, I was brought up on a council estate and still live on one now, although most of the houses are now private in my street.

It just isn't right to move folk out of their houses unless they want to go themselves. (scuttles off to get the fire blanket wrapped round me).:rotfl: