New patio - concrete between slabs breaking up

lindos90

Pythagorous wrote: »

Thanks for pointing that out I hadn't even considered that. Could well be a major issue as the patio level is now right up to the patio door!:eek:

Dont panic though, it depends where the DPC is in relation to the new patio level, usually two bricks height is enough, can you do a pic of the bottom of your patio door and patio up to it? Is the patio door to your house or the new conservatory, have they done a DPC on the conservatory?

So at least we have a consensus that the base is made of the right stuff, but only if its been compacted enough (which we dont know) but we do know that they should have used some dobs of concrete as macman says, usually one all four corners and one in the middle (depending on size of slab) Which could be issues.

Has he been round today? Any arkward discussions with him?

jimbo_the_jetset

wallbash wrote: »

Use a 'chopping' action , side of trowel , really compact the mortar.Then finish/smooth off.

Thanks for the tip. I guess there is not a quick way to do it properly. As with you I prefer a nice solid motar rammed into the joints rather than brushing a loose dry mix in.

Job for the weekend sorted!!

Pythagorous

lindos90 wrote: »

Dont panic though, it depends where the DPC is in relation to the new patio level, usually too bricks height is enough, can you do a pic of the bottom of your patio door and patio up to it? Is the patio door to your house or the new conservatory, have they done a DPC on the conservatory?

So at least we have a consensus that the base is made of the right stuff, but only if its been compacted enough (which we dont know) but we do know that they should have used some dobs of concrete as macman says, usually one all four corners and one in the middle (depending on size of slab) Which could be issues.

Has he been round today? Any arkward discussions with him?

Hi again Lindos. Here is the patio in relation to the new patio level.
http://img.skitch.com/20100708-naqn5maexpbh3j8b821wh5gbut.jpg

Here is a pic showing what will be the door to the new conservatory
http://img.skitch.com/20100708-xrjtsm9hbe9ripi1pprqfii3uc.jpg

He's not due back for another couple of weeks as he has to put in the floor of the finished conservatory.

I'm now starting to notice all sorts of little things! As an example the new retaining wall he has built isn't quite as straight as the old wall and the mortar is already coming out of the top brick layer making it look a bit rough with quite a few chips on the top brick layer. See here
http://img.skitch.com/20100708-nwy3acrss4ch8ngkggacjsyew.jpg

The water also seems to lie in the middle of the patio a little rather than running towards the drainige at the side so I'm thinking he should have allowed for some sort of gradient, which he doesn't seem to have done.

I'm pretty happy the sub base is correct and has been well compacted (they used a compactor machine or whatever its called), but as many have said it needs a proper screeding bed (probably mortar). From this website http://www.pavingexpert.com/layflag1.htm it seems that spot bedding is a bad idea.

Do any reliable tradesmen exist. I've had issues with nearly every one I've used over the last few years!

lindos90

I dont see any DPC on your patio door photo, so im assuming they have breached it, can you see where the DPC is on any other walls to give you an idea where it would be on that wall? Looks too high to me. I think the patio they have layed needs to come up anyway as its not been layed properly, so there will be an oportunity to reduce the height of the patio, but unecessary really if they had done the job right first time.

What proportion of money have you actually paid them? If you have paid most of it, then they may just walk off site, if you have paid a deposit, they are more likely to try and rectify.

The conservatory does seem to have a DPC, the black 'flap' in the bottom right hand corner, but its just less than one and 1/2 bricks, which is not deep enough. Did you have to apply for building regs approval or planning for the conservatory, if so perhaps those departments could advise?

I think the more you look at the work, the more critical you can get, and in this case, I think for VERY good reasons!

You really need to get some proper advice about this, if he's off site for a while it gives you time to get some help.

We once had problems with a guy who re did part of our DPC by injecting it and 'tanking' one wall, what he actually did was drill holes and spray along the bricks ( not even in the holes!) then painted the wall with 'tanking paint'....what he didnt know is that I was watching and noticed the 'magic tanking paint' was just dulux silk paint, and he did not remove any plaster which he should have done to a meter high...I called trading standards and they came out and assessed and had a very strong word with him, this was going back a few years I dont know if they would do that kind of thing now though as they tend to divert you to 'consumer direct' who tend to just give advice over the phone.

Dont pay him a penny more until you have advice and he has redone things to your satisfaction, you will get good advice from us MSErs, but you might find a specialist building/diy forum may be more certain about things.

lindos90

Pythagorous wrote: »

Do any reliable tradesmen exist. I've had issues with nearly every one I've used over the last few years!

I totally agree, I thought we were just unlucky! Out of all the tradesmen we have had over the years, (plumbers, builders, electricians, kitchen fitter etc) there is only one person I would genuinley feel confident about recommending to a friend.

wallbash

Do any reliable tradesmen exist

Yes they do , but we have to do our homework. Ask questions , and be patient.
If any tradesman tells you he can start in the near future .. be esp careful.

sillygoose

Same boat a bit. had a conservatory done and decided to have the builder build a new retaining wall and lay a new patio, our slabs look like yours, cotswold stone colour?

Anyway he has just finished and has done a superb job. Hardcore, sand and a good bed of mortar. For the grouting we used a product called Geofix and the buff colour one looks great with this colour of slab. Its an air-activated substance that just has to be swept over the slabs into the gaps and then pressed down with a thin palette tool. No mixing or anything and once exposed to air it sets in a few hours like araldite - rock hard! Doesn't stain the slabs, water permeable, frost and weed resistant and after setting any excess can be just swept off. Not cheap but well worth it. Was available at local landscape merchant. Looks fantastic compared to the Grey cement mix.

bobhawke

sillygoose wrote: »

S
For the grouting we used a product called Geofix

Stay well clear of geofix. Do a search for it on pavingexpert.com forums and you will find that they all refer to it as geosh*t because it usually fails within 12 months

wallbash

I have not used Geofix , so won't pass judgement. But the correct mix of sands and cement , correctly installed will defeat a pressure washer for years.I did my mothers over 18 years ago , and am still proud of the result.

sillygoose

bobhawke wrote: »

Stay well clear of geofix. Do a search for it on pavingexpert.com forums and you will find that they all refer to it as geosh*t because it usually fails within 12 months

Well yes 1 person said that, and the site isn't exactly totally impartial but I am happy to wait and see. Bearing in mind if normal sand/cement mix pointing isn't done really well with the right mix it won't last very long either.