RANT school non-pupil days!

SallyForth_2

DCodd wrote: »

I know most people think that Teachers and school employees have nice long holidays but they don't, what happens in reality is that they get laid off for 11 weeks of the year and get their pro rata holidays paid only. In fact many Teachers actually are not aware of this as they are quoted a salary when they start but it is not really, correctly speaking a salary it is term time only pay that has been divided by 12 and paid in equal payments throughout the year but has now been "accepted" as being a salary. Support staff still have their pay shown as term time only with a full time equavalent shown for comparrison, but still paid in 12 equal payments.

I can supply the official calculation if anyone would like.

What this all means is that any work a teacher or support staff does outside of the schooling hours is unpaid as are the majority of their "holidays". How many of you would be happy to accept such working/pay conditions? Very very few I would imagine.

That largely depends upon what your salary actually is. If it's more than mine, and I work a full time job, then I might be tempted. I am sure there are plenty who do more hours on much less.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

What? The opportunity to get a good rate of pay, a regular income every month which enables me to get a mortgage/credit on the basis of having secure employment, then all that time off when I am free to either enjoy it or take as many short term positions as I feel like, with the guarantee of the properly paid job back in September?

I don't see the problem.

But then again, I have actually worked as a real temp, where the job is only secure until the moment the employer says it isn't. So your job is permanently precarious, income is uncertain from one day to the next - you might be sent home early or be told when you get there 'no, don't need you today' - and most employers expect temps to do unpaid overtime above that agreed with the agencies, threatening that claiming for it will lead to them demanding someone different.


Whilst I do appreciate from having teachers in the family that it is hard work, I do not accept that teachers work far harder than everyone else and suffer more than everyone else, which the impression some tend to give. The ones that don't complain about how hard their life is, having to deal with other people's children (well, isn't that the point of your job?) tend to be the better teachers.

cat04

iamana1ias wrote: »

............there's no apostrophe for plural words

I taught maths so it doesn't count lol... I hate bad grammar and punctuation, so I feel a bit about that slip up, I'll give the excuse that my 2 year old was taking my attention away from my typing

xmaslolly76

I understand that teachers need training and updateing and i have no problem with training days but why can't the school tag them on to the beginning and ends of the holidays instead of getting back from a holiday for a couple of days then having a training day. They obviously know well in advance when these days are going to be needed so surely it shouldnt be to hard for them to do this.

SnowWhiterThanWhite

Thanks for all your comments, it is very interesting to hear how different parents/teachers cope with it all!

I still personally think that as per the above post, these training days could at least be added to half term weeks, rather than slap dash anywhere!

I was talking to another parent today whose husband works in a primary school nearby-He has all his training days tagged onto the october half-term, which just seems all together more sensible, but then I guess whatever the schools decide, will never, ever suit everyone.

SnowWhiterThanWhite

PinkLipgloss wrote: »

I wish I had a pound for every time I've thought, "If only parents could do my job for a week..." I suspect it would have a huge impact on many parents opinions about schools.

It would be highly impractical for schools to bunch all of their non-contact days together.

Why? I don't understand why some schools have adopted this approach, but you say it's impractical.

I'm not being rude, I would really like to know what your thoughts are. Following a discussion I had at the school earlier, it seems there are a few parents who feel the same as me, so much so that it's been suggested we raise a petition? Not quite sure how that would work, but I will put my name down.

SnowWhiterThanWhite

impy78 wrote: »

My heart really does go out to you. I can't believe the school aren't organising the school year around your hectic calendar and directly consulting you before arranging training days.

It isn't as though they have hundreds of children to educate or anything, is it?

I'm sorry, but if looking after your own children for ten extra days a year is too much of a burden on you, then maybe you should reconsider whether being a parent is for you.

Prior to teacher training days, teachers were paid for 192 days work per year, as these training days were actually part of the holidays anyway.

Then their salary was spread accross the year, to prevent a gap during the summer months.

"Baker" days were introduced in the 80s for which teachers did not and still do not receive any extra pay, despite working the extra five days.

Also one of these five days is used to moderate coursework - unless of course,you don't wish your child's work tobe moderated.

Food for thought.

I think you have misunderstood. I am NOT saying that there should be NO training days, what I am saying is that, like other schools are now doing, they should be lumped together & not ad-hoc.

I am not fortunate enough to be able to be a 'stay at home' parent. I HAVE to work in order to be a parent.

SnowWhiterThanWhite

peachyprice wrote: »

See, for me that would be far worse, it would mean I or my husband would have to take 2 weeks holiday of alone, rather than one, leaving only 1 week to have off together in the summer hols.

For me the odd day here and there is much better, I can take DD to work with me for 1 day, or her grandparents can have her for a long weekend, or I can take 1 days holiday, which I usually have floating around from the easter or half term holidays I have taken.

I can see where you're coming from - Pros & cons I guess. Thanks for your comment

SnowWhiterThanWhite

cat04 wrote: »

When I taught at a Secondary school before having my children we had 4 of our days tagged on to holidays, 2 of these being at the beginning of Setember.

Then the 5th day was split into 'twilight' sessions, i.e. after school hours - therefore making it highly unlikely that I would have been home in time to watch 'Deal or no Deal' as someone suggested all teachers did. I don't know what gets my goat more, non-teachers who complain about the amount of 'days off' we get or those who think they can do a better job at teaching than a degree qualified/classrom experienced teacher. (Yes, that last bit was said tongue in cheek in response to a previous post )

As all teacher's know, the working day isn't 9-3 at all, not even 8-4. There's a hell of a lot of work to bring home with you at the end of the day or over the 'holidays'.

Anyway, back to topic, I'm lucky enough to be a stay at home mum (for the time being anyway!) so INSET/Teacher Training/Baker days don't affect me in the slightest - in fact I think of it as a bonus day to spend with my daughter doing something fun together

I have the absolute utmost respect for teachers - and I do realise that your day does not finish at 3.20!

PinkLipgloss

It would be impractical to lump all of the days together for a number of reasons, I believe some of them have already been explored.

The first one that comes to mind is that there are numerous situations/developments that happen throughout the course of the year which cannot possibly be anticipated and have an impact on CPD sessions. For example, in the area I work there was a national scandal with regards to child protection issues when children were using the Internet at home - this had a clear impact on an upcoming CPD day. Lumping all of the days together would therefore not be practical.

Re: numerous holiday comments - please don't get me started. I actually work more hours per year than my friends with 9-5 office jobs. On a typical weekday I work from 8am-8pm (often more at key stages in the year - for example start and end of terms) plus most of Sundays. In addition to that I attend/help out at numerous parents nights, open evenings, PTA events, Nativity Plays, Christmas Shows, Christmas Fayres, Summer Shows, Burns Supper, P7 Prom, Pupil Discos (each term). I would LOVE to finish at 3pm however it has never, and will never happen.

Strangely - when I start school in August each year my classroom is not "magically" organised with all of the wall displays, curriculum forward plans, daily plans, resources, individual support plans done.