DMP Mutual Support Thread - Part 7

cocker100

scouselad1974 wrote: »

Hi Cocker

Your thread was very interesting and informative to read. Basically I received a letter from Halifax dated 27th May 2010 stating that a Default Notice had recently been issued as I had failed to pay the requested amount by the date shown in the notice. This Default Notice was never received !
The letter dated 27th May also states that my account is now closed and will be passed to a DCA within 7 days. As of today 13th June it is still with the original creditor who continue to telephone me daily and have added £72 in charges to my account only a few days ago.
According to your information this is not correct and therefore I have a bit more ammo to pass over to The FOS. Am I correct in thinking this ? I would be very grateful if you could give me an idea of what to put in the letter to the FOS.

Thanks in advance

Hiya,

Have you already complained to the FOS? If not, I would wait a little longer to give them more time to dig themselves deeper into the hole!

They need to issue a valid default notice before they can legally sell the debt on to a third party DCA. They can however, hire a DCA to chase the debt on their behalf without issuing a default notice. (These are usually in-house) Have you had any contact from any DCA's regarding this?

If not, I would sit tight and wait for contact from the DCA who will demand full repayment of the debt. In the meantime I would send Halifax a SAR request (£10 fee) to see if a default was sent out. If one was, then a record of it would be on their computer system and should be included in the documents you receive. This should also give you access to a copy of the credit agreement to see if it is valid or not, and a full set of statements going back up to 6 years for reclaiming charges/ppi(if you had it).

Remember, these things take time to sort themselves out and you can always reclaim the charges at a later date. For issues like this, I try not to use FOS as their knowledge of these matters is sometimes questionable. The best way to sort out invalid default notices and unlawful recissions of contract is in court defending yourself with help from sites like this and CAG.

Cocker:)

Merecat_2

Good evening,

Could I ask a question please?. I am plodding away with DMP I am nine months in. I have read on this forum about credit agreements that are not enforceable. Can anyone advise on what I am looking for if I request a copy of mine.

Thanks in advance x

cocker100

Merecat wrote: »

Good evening,

Could I ask a question please?. I am plodding away with DMP I am nine months in. I have read on this forum about credit agreements that are not enforceable. Can anyone advise on what I am looking for if I request a copy of mine.

Thanks in advance x

Hiya,

Have a read through the following thread:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2071601

Cocker:)

Merecat_2

Thanks Cocker :T x

Merecat_2

mmm not bedtime reading is it

scouselad1974

cocker100 wrote: »

Hiya,

Have you already complained to the FOS? If not, I would wait a little longer to give them more time to dig themselves deeper into the hole!

They need to issue a valid default notice before they can legally sell the debt on to a third party DCA. They can however, hire a DCA to chase the debt on their behalf without issuing a default notice. (These are usually in-house) Have you had any contact from any DCA's regarding this?

If not, I would sit tight and wait for contact from the DCA who will demand full repayment of the debt. In the meantime I would send Halifax a SAR request (£10 fee) to see if a default was sent out. If one was, then a record of it would be on their computer system and should be included in the documents you receive. This should also give you access to a copy of the credit agreement to see if it is valid or not, and a full set of statements going back up to 6 years for reclaiming charges/ppi(if you had it).

Remember, these things take time to sort themselves out and you can always reclaim the charges at a later date. For issues like this, I try not to use FOS as their knowledge of these matters is sometimes questionable. The best way to sort out invalid default notices and unlawful recissions of contract is in court defending yourself with help from sites like this and CAG.

Cocker:)

Hi again Cocker and thanks for taking the time to reply to my question, unfortunatley I have already complained to The FOS, so far I haven't had any communiactions from a DCA regarding this matter.

pure_dead_dopey

cocker100 wrote: »

Not strictly correct!

There has been lots of debate regarding what a creditor can or cannot do once a default notice has been issued against an account.

A default notice is issued to the debtor if they break any of the terms and conditons of a credit agreement. By not paying your mimimum monthly payment, you are in breach of the agreement and the creditor therefore has the right to terminate the contract between you. To do this they must first issue you with a valid default notice under section 87 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.
If the debtor fails to rectify his/her breach (ie. they fail to bring the account up to date) within the time allowed on the default notice (minimum 14 days), the creditor can then terminate the agreement and demand full repayment of the entire account debt.




Long story short, entered DMP on 15th january, Amex terminated and cancelled our agreement on 29th January (before we had actually missed a payment) and apparently passed to RMA. No notice of assignment and no default either although they have threatened one. They are continuing to add on interest, which is actually more than the DMP payment which we have never missed. Several conversations with RMA, them offering 60% settlement. However, received another statement from Amex adding more interest and promising to add interest next month. Phoned and argued (I know you shouldn't phone but i have been quite successful sorting out various creditors on phone and they don't intimidate me) but they say that they are Amex and can do what they like as long as this is within their "procedures", told me their procedures were different from any contract law.
Question is what do I do now, I will write and complain (is there a template for this sort of thing anywhere?) but does anyone have any idea what I am quoting?
Amex customer services were always very good, but obviously when you turn into a debtor you are treated as sh$t on their shoe and it really riles me that they think they are above the law!!!

thanks for any wise assistance, is it just me or does anyone else really grudge the time and effort it takes to makes these eejits behave in a reasonably ethical and professional manner ???

If they (the creditor) do then go on the terminate the agreement, then IMO they are not permitted to add any extra interest or charges to the outstanding balance without taking action in the court. This is because the creditor relies on the terms and conditions of the credit agreement in order to be allowed to charge interest and charges etc. Once this agreement ends (because they have terminated the account) there is no contract left in existence to allow them to keep adding extra interest and charges, therefore any they do add are unlawful.

However some creditors fail to adhere to the rules and continue to add interest in the hope that the debtor does not know his/her rights.

So yes, a default in itself may allow a creditor to continue adding interest, however if this is followed by confirmed termination of the account, then they are no longer allowed to do this. This is my interpretation of the law following extensive reading up of cases on the Consumer Action Group website.

Also it is vital to remember that many creditors issue invalid default notices and go on to terminate agreements on the back of them. If this happens, then they are on a very sticky wicket indeed, as they would then be only allowed to claim the arrears on the account at the time of default. (Which is ususally 2-3 months of missed payments). This is because by doing this, they are unlawfully recinding the agreement and are subsequently in breach of the original contract. Again, many creditors will argue that they are playing by the rules and that the full amount is still repayable, however should a debt ever get to court, an invalid default notice is a complete defence to any claim made against you. There is case law that backs this up!:D:T

Here's an excellent link for information on this subject:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/196312

Cocker:)

ong story short, entered DMP on 15th january, Amex terminated and cancelled our agreement on 29th January (before we had actually missed a payment) and apparently passed to RMA. No notice of assignment and no default either although they have threatened one. They are continuing to add on interest, which is actually more than the DMP payment which we have never missed. Several conversations with RMA, them offering 60% settlement. However, received another statement from Amex adding more interest and promising to add interest next month. Phoned and argued (I know you shouldn't phone but i have been quite successful sorting out various creditors on phone and they don't intimidate me) but they say that they are Amex and can do what they like as long as this is within their "procedures", told me their procedures were different from any contract law.
Question is what do I do now, I will write and complain (is there a template for this sort of thing anywhere?) but does anyone have any idea what I am quoting?
Amex customer services were always very good, but obviously when you turn into a debtor you are treated as sh$t on their shoe and it really riles me that they think they are above the law!!!

thanks for any wise assistance, is it just me or does anyone else really grudge the time and effort it takes to makes these eejits behave in a reasonably ethical and professional manner ???

scouselad1974

Hi

I haven't really got any advice for you regarding Amex, I just wanted you to know that they passed my account to RMA within a week of my sending a DMP Notifictaion.

I haven't heard a peep from RMA even after requesting an up to date balance from them on numerous occasions, tbh I don't know if they have frozen interest or not, if they haven't then my balance will have shot up big time.

My next creditor to tackle must be this lot, hopefully somebody will pop on with some good advice for you.

BTW I to am fed up having to fight with creditors to make them see sense, just when you get one to finally accept your argument another kicks off !

pure_dead_dopey

Hi Scouse

Did the same with me and terminated the account within 10 days. Amex told me this morning they can do what the like as they have "procedures". Makes me spit!!!

I would phone ordinary customer services or RMA and get a balance, RMA told me they had stopped interest and this wasn't the case, they are currently adding on more than I am paying, so it will never end.

Good luck

PDDxx

mamajojo

Hi
Just hoping someone can put my mind at rest regarding HSBC. Statement has just arrived with interest at £103 against cccs payment of £36:eek: I knew things were going too well! Initally their said they wouldn't accept proposals but the zero interst lulled me into a false sense of security. Phoned them and all I got out of the call was pay 2.5% of the debt as payment or else!
So I'm hoping they want to sell me on to a DCA. Just wondered if anyone further along the dmp experience had any thoughts.
Thanks