Brown sticks his foot in his mouth

Degenerate

lemonjelly wrote: »

http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2010/04/29/feeling-empathy-for-gordon/

Quality blog from martin. I suggest you all read it. Then come back & query why we've wasted 15 pages arguing about nothing.

"If any of you have seen the Ricky Gervais film “the invention of lying”, you’ll see the farcical world we’d all live in if everyone told the truth to each other’s face. What do we want, political Tourettes?"

Class.

lostinrates

lemonjelly wrote: »

http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2010/04/29/feeling-empathy-for-gordon/

Quality blog from martin. I suggest you all read it. Then come back & query why we've wasted 15 pages arguing about nothing.

I agree with martin on the fist part...think I sai something similar on the very first page.

The second part I disagree with....not because I think she is or isn't a bigot, or he is or isn't fool, but because ...its obviously very important to some people and thus, perhaps the ''15 pages of arguing'' is their version of getting in the car and ranting aside with the microphone on....

abaxas

lemonjelly wrote: »

http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2010/04/29/feeling-empathy-for-gordon/

Quality blog from martin. I suggest you all read it. Then come back & query why we've wasted 15 pages arguing about nothing.

Ermmm,

Even if that is the case. His lack of professionalism in the job is amazing, he cant simply 'get on with the job', if he cant do the required job of being a modern leader.

Wheezy_2

JasonLVC wrote: »

If Brown had a point then why apologise? Do you want to add hypocrite, two-faced and desperate to the list of his attributes?

and so I see no racism in asking "why is the country full of immigrants" just as asking "why do we have so many unemployed people" or "why must we have nuclear proliferation" are all perfectly valid questions.

Jason,

She said: "All these eastern Europeans that are coming in - where are they flocking from?"

If she would have said:
"All these gays in this country - where are they flocking from?"
or
"All those 'mooslims' in this country - where are they flocking from?"

...she would have been hung, drawn and quartered right away But it's okay now, it's just those Eastern Europeans, you see...

ninky_2

JasonLVC wrote: »

What media code?. The BBC state clearly they are happy to secretly record conversations if there is a public interest :-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/editorialguidelines/edguide/privacy/secretrecint.shtml

and isn't it just AMAZING that the BBC are quite fond of leaking private conversations when it suits their agenda :-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/feb/04/bbc-television

Carol Thatcher's leaked "golliwog" conversation was private and yet still got out into the public domian.

So I'm not buying the whole "Murdoch anti-Labour campaign" argument on the basis the BBC have done it and are happy with doing it.

Do you operate under a different media code of conduct/sector of the media?

read your own link. undercover filming has to be pre-approved and for a clear public interest reason.

The following rules apply to any proposal to secretly record, whether for news, factual or comedy and entertainment purposes.

• All proposals to record secretly must be approved in advance by the relevant senior editorial figure in each Division or for Independents by the commissioning editor who may consult Editorial Policy. Each Division is responsible for maintaining these records to enable the BBC to monitor and review the use of such techniques across its output.
• A signed record must be kept of the approval process, even if the request is turned down, and secretly recorded material must be logged. This record is required even if the material gathered isn't broadcast.
• The gathering and broadcast of secretly recorded material is always a two stage process. The decision to gather is always taken separately from the decision to transmit.
• Any deception required for the purposes of obtaining material and secret recording should be the minimum necessary and proportionate to the subject matter and must be referred to the relevant senior editorial figure or for Independents to the commissioning editor.
• The re-use of secretly recorded material must be referred to a senior editorial figure or for Independents to the commissioning editor before transmission and a record kept of the decision.

non of the above was done for this recording. this obviously was not a pre-approved case or in the public interest to deliberately record a feed from a press conference microphone which was not designed to be monitored or recorded at this moment. if it was in the public interest to constantly secretly record would be leaders then lets bug their homes, tap their phones etc etc!!

the carol thatcher comment was not secretly recorded and broadcast - it was merely a report of a conversation which had occurred.

tbh i don't think this is going to make a difference to how people vote. those who don't like gb or labour will gleefully rub their hands whilst those who support labour will continue to do so.

lostinrates

ninky wrote: »

tbh i don't think this is going to make a difference to how people vote..

I agree, I doubt it will.

PrivatisetheNHSnow

it probably will if you're a concerned old person - plenty of them around, and they don't appreciate their [STRIKE]moaning[/STRIKE] concerns being met with insults.

A._Badger

It's a bit of a liberal fantasy that only 'old people' are concerned by immigration levels.

It may not be a hot topic among the blogerati, but it gets plenty of traction out there in the real world.

Screaming 'bigot'' and 'racist' is simply doing the BNP's job for them. They could hardly have a better recruiting sergeant than some twittering airhead from the Guardian or the BBC trying to shut down discussion.

JasonLVC

Wheezy wrote: »

Jason,

She said: "All these eastern Europeans that are coming in - where are they flocking from?"

If she would have said:
"All these gays in this country - where are they flocking from?"
or
"All those 'mooslims' in this country - where are they flocking from?"

...she would have been hung, drawn and quartered right away But it's okay now, it's just those Eastern Europeans, you see...

It's nothing to do with 'Eastern Europeans'. Brown accused her of being a bigot, not a racist, so the whole 'immigrants' thing is a red-herring. A bigot is someone who's opinions and views cannot be altered or changed.

Her views on crime, education, pension credits and employment were what Brown was criticising, not the one aspect. She was deemed a bigot for having a 'daily mail' view of the country - crime, poverty, jobless and yes, even immigrants, etc.

Just becuase Brown considers any debate on his performance or policies to be off-limits, doesn't make everyone else bigots.

Wheezy_2

JasonLVC wrote: »

It's nothing to do with 'Eastern Europeans'. Brown accused her of being a bigot, not a racist, so the whole 'immigrants' thing is a red-herring. A bigot is someone who's opinions and views cannot be altered or changed.

Her views on crime, education, pension credits employment were what Brown was criticising, not the one aspect. She was deemed a bigot for having a 'daily mail' view of the country - crime, poverty, jobless and yes, even immigrants, etc.

Just becuase Brown considers any debate on his performance or policies to be off-limits, doesn't make everyone else bigots.

Sure, I'm not defending Brown here...his reaction was poor, to say the least.
My point is more that this country DOES need a grown-up discussion about immigration, but I'm not sure if starting out with a 'daily mail' view of the issues is the right way to go.