Don't breed your dog unless you have £1200 spare

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

She earned £800 a month, her OH is described as 'jobless' and they have two children. She also apparently admits that she was hysterical, and lost her temper to the extent that the practice had to call the police.

£800 + £120 child benefit + WTC + CTC + OH's ESA = enough to pay for a backyard money making opportunity.

They could have contacted an animal rescue place, the vets probably would have been more helpful if she hadn't been aggressive, and they probably refused to let her take the dog 'to another vet' because they suspected that, like many individuals who see pound signs when they get Staffs (they already had the animal's dam at home, so they presumably make a habit of breeding), they would just hope for the best and let the dog labour until it died.

The vet didn't kill the animal and her puppies, the owner did.

myothercarisaferrari

I never understand why people want to breed.

There are enough dogs in the UK needinghomes :-(

Arg

Jojo_the_Tightfisted wrote: »

They could have contacted an animal rescue place, the vets probably would have been more helpful if she hadn't been aggressive, and they probably refused to let her take the dog 'to another vet' because they suspected that, like many individuals who see pound signs when they get Staffs (they already had the animal's dam at home, so they presumably make a habit of breeding), they would just hope for the best and let the dog labour until it died.

The vet didn't kill the animal and her puppies, the owner did.

I would side with the owners. The vet's there to practice medicine not make moral judgements.
It would be interesting to see what the outcome would be had the vet been wrong about the dog needing to be put down.

ps,Vets see pound signs too.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

Vets have an obligation to ensure that their patients do not suffer unnecessarily. I wouldn't let someone going mad at me about the cost of treatment take an animal that was suffering out of my care.

I would expect a vet to make a moral judgement, which in this case was that the dog would suffer less being put to sleep with her pups than being taken home to die in agony. If the police called to deal with her felt the vet was in the wrong, they would have happily suggested an animal charity were contacted there and then and ensured the dog was handed over safely.

ali-t

cinderellacomplex wrote: »

I will hopefully be having a litter from my current border collie when she is older. She's only one now but I have already have a conversation with my vet about it and they were very helpful. I knew about all of the health tests which she is now getting done, but the vets can also give you advice on things like the build of dog to choose to lower the risk of needing a C-section. I know that there is still a chance that she will need one, but I would never ever get her put down if she did. Even if by a twist of fate my bank accounts had been completely wiped I would try and negotiate a payment plan and cut back in other areas, turn my phone off and eat baked beans for while!

I don't think your vet is the person you should be having the conversation with, it should be the breeder of your dog who will know the pedigree inside out and any of the elements that need taken into consideration when finding a suitable stud. I don't know much about collies but, for example, if your dog has a particular feature (bite, straight back, tail carriage) you may need to find a dog that complements this so certain features don't become too strong, exagerated or recessive.

You should be looking back generations of your !!!!! and any potential stud to look for any genetic quirks and behaviours e.g. are you breeding to produce a working dog or one more suited to a pet lifestyle.

My own view is that litters should be bred for the good of the breed rather than just because the dog is 'nice', has been health tested, loads of people have said they want a pup or worse 'the vet said she is healthy'.

This isn't meant as a dig at you but as a pointer that there is more to think about than birth complications.

A good breeder will take back any pups they have bred at any point in their lifetime and if you have chosen a stud on the basis of colouring/size etc rather than temprament, and suitability with your !!!!! you could be heading for a stressfull and expensive life with vet and behaviourist bills.

If you do decide to breed from your !!!!!, IMO you would be better to find a mentor in the breed to support you rather than taking advice solely from a vet.

ANGLICANPAT

myothercarisaferrari wrote: »

I never understand why people want to breed.

There are enough dogs in the UK needinghomes :-(

Totally agree with you . Every time a person breeds a litter of anything, and finds good homes for them , thats so many good homes taken up that existing dogs/cats/rabbits etc unloved in rescues could have had -- and there definitely arent enough to go round !

Re the vet situation on this thread. Its a tricky one. Would a rescue pay a breeders bill ? And let the owner keep/sell the pups? How would their supporters view that. Should the vet do the work for nothing - the owner would still own and sell the puppies . OK maybe if it was just the odd case, but these situations and similar are occuring in practices half a dozen times a week. If they just let people off - word gets around and soon everyone would be pleading poverty.

foreign_correspondent

Arg wrote: »

I would side with the owners. The vet's there to practice medicine not make moral judgements.
It would be interesting to see what the outcome would be had the vet been wrong about the dog needing to be put down.

ps,Vets see pound signs too.

This was not an unexpected occurance such as the dog having injured itself running.. then I may have some sympathy with them. They decided to breed their b1tch despite knowing full well they could not pay out for an emergency proceedure should she need one.

It is not unusual for a dog to need a c-section, or to have other complications during pregnancy and birth - and these things often happen out of hours, incurring extra call out fees. Of course vets see £ signs - they are in business - and vets fees are not cheap - and surely we all know that when we take a dog on....?

cinderellacomplex wrote: »

That's so sad

I will hopefully be having a litter from my current border collie when she is older. She's only one now but I have already have a conversation with my vet about it and they were very helpful. I knew about all of the health tests which she is now getting done, but the vets can also give you advice on things like the build of dog to choose to lower the risk of needing a C-section. I know that there is still a chance that she will need one, but I would never ever get her put down if she did. Even if by a twist of fate my bank accounts had been completely wiped I would try and negotiate a payment plan and cut back in other areas, turn my phone off and eat baked beans for while!

Some dogs may be at lower risk of needing a c section, but complications can be varied and unpredictable - please read the post by ali-t above - if you are thinking of breeding her this should only because she has something exceptional to add to the gene pool

Plenty of border collies end up in rescue, many of them are neurotic and psychologically stressed/damaged because people take them on expecting them to be easy to train... but underestimate the amount of exercise and stimulation they need. They are not an ideal breed for most pet homes, and good homes are hard to find for collies. Look at all the collies here - most are young, and so many have been goven up because the owner didnt have time to give them what they needed... http://www.dogsblog.com/category/border-collie/

Kimberley

How sad and I doubt that the Vet enjoyed putting to sleep a young dog and her unborn pups. Sadly there is lots of this BYB. You see plenty on Gumtree or the other free ads.

I also wonder if this family would have gone to the national newspapers if they had not got paid for their story.

Ellie2758

gratefulforhelp wrote: »

What a sad, sad story. Even "reputable" breeders can't turn down a fast buck (some of them) we were on a list for a labrador puppy from a KC reg breeder and so many things she said rang warning bells that we backed out.
She may have been KC reg but she was pushing it, the puppies wouldn't be KC reg because....and....and....

KC reg means NOTHING I am afraid when it comes to breeding. Best to go by word of mouth/recommendation. Go to a county show for the breed you want and speak to people there then make up your mind based on what they tell you. Take a lot of it with a pinch of salt as "show people" can be a bit strange but you will get a "feel" for what is right and what isnt. Never rush into it, take your time. It really is worth it in the end.

Kimberley

One thing that worries me about this being in the media is that other irresponsible people who breeds from their pet dog/cat will not risk taking their dog to the Vet and just hope for the best.