disciplinary help please - SUSPENDED!!!

olly300

BritishBoy your GF needs to write to a letter to the Area Manager addressed to the Head Office. The letter needs to be sent by at least recorded delivery - special delivery if you want the letter to get there the next day.

That way there is no argument about your GF not contacting work and giving them the full story.

longwalks1

Thanks again everyone, sent letter off to Head Office recorded delivery this morning stating that still havent recieved letter confirming initial disciplinary 2 Thursdays ago, and still no copy of the original notes that were taken, so that she could work on a defense (I think she is by law entitled to a copy of the hand written notes, before being typed up, is this right?)

She recieved a long answer phone messagew today (I havent heard it yet) from her area managress (Who suspended her initially), wil lupdate you all on what it says tomorrow

mum2one

Shes entitled to a copy of the notes from the discilpinary at the time of the interbiew, which in a way is good, (meant that in the nicest way) as it shows a breach of terms and conditions and a point that goes against the company,
good luck with the ansafone messgae

longwalks1

Hello again all

Listened to the answer phone message and as her area manager is off from tomorrow (31st), its been handed over to the area managers manager (hope that made sense) and is re-scheduled for Thursday 1st April, my gf return to work day. Still no letter confirming this, still no copy of the meetings notes (am i right in thinking they should be copies of the hand written ones taken, and not a copy of what was typed up after?)

melou

There is no legal requirement to provide handwritten notes. I had this come up in a recent grievance and checked with both ACAS and an employment lawyer. Both said that it is not required (and the lawyer said he would never give over his handwritten notes as they are made in his own "shorthand" as an aide memoire rather than every word spoken). Your girlfriend should take her own notes (or ask her companion to do so). Bear in mind that if the Company don't provide them then they can't refer to them at a later date as your girlfriend hasn't agreed them as an accurate representation of the meeting.

longwalks1

Right,
this morning recieved in the post a letter from area manager (postmak 29th March), confirming original disciplinary hearing on 25th March in London at 4pm (5 days too late!!) The letter was actually dated 16th March (the day gf had her back to work interview and was suspended), and on the letter it said she was suspended on 15th March (a day too early), we've sent her new sick note off recorded delivery today to her area manager, we're currently compiling all the discrepancies/errors they've made to hopefully raise a grievance, or take it further if gf is sacked

longwalks1

mum2one wrote: »

Shes entitled to a copy of the notes from the discilpinary at the time of the interbiew, which in a way is good, (meant that in the nicest way) as it shows a breach of terms and conditions and a point that goes against the company,
good luck with the ansafone messgae

See my previous post mum2one, they've made a few mistakes already, not sure if/when to raise a grievance if we do?

zzzLazyDaisy

I have skimmed through this quickly, so apologies if I am repeating anything, or if I have misunderstood something. But just a few comments that might help....

1 She has been suspended and escorted off the premises. This will only be appropriate in cases of suspected gross misconduct. Therefore the company are considering dismissing her. A suspension in law is not part of the disciplinary process but is a neutral action to enable an investigation to take place, so she is not entitled to be accompanied or to be given notice of a meeting to suspend her. However, removing her discount card *may* be viewed as evidence that the decision to dismiss has already been made, in which case any subsequent investigation or meetings may be viewed as a sham procedure.

2 The letter requiring her attendance at the disciplinary hearing should have informed her of the conduct that the company wishes to discuss with her, advised her that this is a potential GM situation and therefore her job is at risk, and also advised her of her right to be accompanied by a colleague or TU rep.

3 If the letter or procedure is flawed, it is probably in GF's interests to keep quiet about that because procedural flaws are the main reason that companies lose tribunal cases. They have their own legal advisers and she is not even expected to know that stuff. If she does point out their mistakes, they will simply have another hearing to review her concerns and do it right this time, thus correcting the errors so she can't later rely on them.

4 It is unlikely that they will press her to attend while on sick due to stress/depression because then she could later argue that she did not have a fair hearing because she was not well enough to present her case. If her doctor supported this at tribunal, again they would run a serious risk of losing the case, so normally a company will tread softly on this

5 This won't help her forever - eventually they will start capability proceedings anyway on the grounds that she is not fit to do her job. They may refer the case to the OHA, but ultimately, even if she is covered by a sick note, she can still be dismissed on capability grounds provided they go through proper procedures.

6 Taking lots of time off sick is not, on its own, grounds for a gross misconduct dismissal (unless the employee is refusing to provide sick notes, or forging sick notes or something like that)

6 It seems incredible to me that one text is viewed as grounds for a gross misconduct dismissal, unless it was extremely offensive. I do wonder if there are other allegations that your GF hasn't told you about (sorry) but as I said above - whatever the allegations are, they should be set out clearly in the letter so that she has a fair opportunity to defend herself.

This may, or may not, help, but keep posting as things come to light.

Good Luck

Daisy

Chrisblue1962

Hi, have read what seems to be a very complicated matter.
If possible, could the OP clarify the following:

OP's g/f was allegedly slandered by a work colleague to a group of her (g/f's) friends out of the workplace outside working hours.

G/f sent text message which colleague found offensive and cites bullying.

• What exactly did the work colleague say to OP's g/f?
• How did OP g/f find out and from whom?
• Have any of g/fs friends confirmed that the colleague did actually say something offensive about g/f?
• Has work colleague admitted to slandering g/f?
• If yes, has this been brought to attention to management?

Call me pedantic but difficult to pass informed opinion if not in possession of all the facts. I was an ex PCS Union Rep so have had some training on such matters.

dickydonkin

britishboy wrote: »

Right,
this morning recieved in the post a letter from area manager (postmak 29th March), confirming original disciplinary hearing on 25th March in London at 4pm (5 days too late!!) The letter was actually dated 16th March (the day gf had her back to work interview and was suspended), and on the letter it said she was suspended on 15th March (a day too early), we've sent her new sick note off recorded delivery today to her area manager, we're currently compiling all the discrepancies/errors they've made to hopefully raise a grievance, or take it further if gf is sacked

Based on the information provided, it would seem that the company are making a complete hash of the situation.

For all of the company's apparent shortcomings however, it does provide them with an 'exit strategy' that could work in the OP's GF's favour.

It would allow them to suggest that they were correct in using the disciplinary procedure to address the alleged bullying, however, it also allows the company to save face to some degree by not progressing the disciplinary action due to procedural 'technicalities'.

That would be the ideal situation, however, judging by the seemingly incompetence of the company involved, I would not hold my breath on that one!