Unenforceability & Template Letters III

never-in-doubt

natweststaffmember wrote: »

I am an old hand on the reclaims stuff but I have a question or you(and I hate saying this) but I am sure it is in the thread here.

Morning Natty - how the devil are you? I see you're still out on a vengeance for reclaims

natweststaffmember wrote: »

1) If the CCA is unenforceable pre April 2006 can you ask a court to give a declaration that it is unenforceable and therefore forever unpayable(so to speak)?

Hmm, good point. Yes you can but not likely the judge will do it (moreso cos they rely on our arguments - not their knowledge of the CCA per se)... However there is no need for this because pre 04/07 agreements are protected under s.127 & s.65(1) which basically spells out the provisions for enforcement. Therefore unless the lender sends a copy of the "actual" original they cannot even get you in court! Yea, some try their luck and get the CCJ but when we get wind of it, 10past6 will come along and then get the CCJ set aside, for example.

Basically a judge doesn't know the CCA so they would not tie themselves down with a commitment that could ensue precedent, if you see what I mean? Plus a lender would be nuts to try and take you to court without the original cos people who understand the act, like me/fermi/george/ras etc will have a field day with them.....

natweststaffmember wrote: »

2) What does the recent CCA cases ie Casey v. HSBC make to the way Unenforceable agreements are advised by yourself on here?

It means nothing mate - that was an isolated case with restrictive circumstances and the judge had already made his mind up before any action had commenced... if it wasn't for the CMC folding then we'd be seeing an appeal, don't rule this out as the Careys were spot on and should never have lost! For that fact, RBS shafted McGuffick and likewise, this is not the last we'll hear of that either :cool:

But basically, a lender always tries to hide behind Carey in case law referrals, but I refute it as basically allowing them the option to pursue an unenforceable debt using fair methods. Basically, a default can be added (McGuffick ruling) as can they chase you (Carey ruling) but they cannot harrass you nor can they force you to pay, or obtain judgement without the original agreement - no exceptions.

natweststaffmember wrote: »

Apologies for asking potentially tough questions early on a Saturday but am trying to get my head around this and sometimes on the Reclaims board I refer them to yourself cos it is still difficult to get out of the approach unenforceable is not unpayable in spite of the First National Case in which the judge did say more or less that any agreement that was unenforceable could be construed as a gift.
I hope the above makes sense.

Basically, all unenforceable agreements become enforceable again IF the lender finds the original agreement within the space between default of s.78 and Statute Barred. To explain this in plain English, lets assume you declare an account unenforceable on 01/01/2004. You last pay on 31/12/2003. The lender never finds the CCA. On 01/01/2010 the account became statute barred (england only) and so no action can ever be taken again, no default can be re-registered and no formal (ccj) action can ever be taken.

If, on the other hand the lender found the original agreement in December 2009, then if they acted fast enough they could enforce the debt prior to it becoming statute barred.

So, this pretty much means that a lender has 6 years from date of last payment (5 years in scotland) to provide the original agreement in court - or the debt will be finished, in its entirety.

Make sense? lol

That was a head mash for this time on a weekend, thanks mate! :rotfl:

scarednshakin

Good morning Niddy, hope you are well today

Reply received from BOS replying to your letter #1169

'I have noted your comments in your letter dated 29 March, however I would confirm we have sent you all the documents we are obliged to provide under Section 78 of the CCA.

You have stated in your letter that a forgery is not a reconstituted agreement. I can confirm that the documents sent have been reconstituted using the historic information we hold regarding you and our products.

Although not required under Sectio 78, we included a copy of the signed application form. All credit card applications are filmed after processing and stored on microfilm. Therefore the copy I sent you is one retrieved from our archives and as such is a genuine copy of the original.

Turning to your allegations of harassmen, it is the bank's obligation as a responsible lender to advise customers as soon as reasonable that they are in arrears. The bank will give no undertaking to contact you for payment, particularly as your alleged "dispute" is unfounded. We are happy to write to you by standard postal services, but we reserve the right, if need be, to contact you by telephone for our legitimate commercial purposes.

In view of the above I am unable to agree with your complaint and I hope that you understand my reasons for this decision.

As this letter forms the Bank's final response on the matter I have to advise you that if you remain unhappy you can refer your concerns to the FOS.'

They have once again sent all the same paperwork that I received at the start. Where do I go now, do I send out the final response? Cheers mate:beer:

BeenieCat

Omg Capquest... *voodoo*

They should have received my 3.2 template letter by now and i'm being hounded

I've got a call blocker on my mobile and the log tells me it's blocked 93 :eek: of their calls since 12th April :eek:. I'm gonna have to ring Virgin and change my number, it's doing my head in now.

edit - and a nice letter from the litigation dept threatening legal action etc. Morons :mad:

never-in-doubt

BeenieCat wrote: »

Omg Capquest... *voodoo*

They should have received my 3.2 template letter by now and i'm being hounded

I've got a call blocker on my mobile and the log tells me it's blocked 93 :eek: of their calls since 12th April :eek:. I'm gonna have to ring Virgin and change my number, it's doing my head in now.

Hiya Beenie...

Seriously? Ok, hold fire 5 mins before changing numbers, we'll get a letter off to them - i'll post it here when I come back (at 11am)....

Dont change your number, not yet! We'll threaten crappyquest first of all hehe

never-in-doubt

scarednshakin wrote: »

They have once again sent all the same paperwork that I received at the start. Where do I go now, do I send out the final response? Cheers mate:beer:

Hiya

Thats right mate - send the Final response - CCA Received letter off. They have done what you wanted and issued theirs, so time to issue yours....

Worry not soldier boy, all is ok! :rotfl:

BeenieCat

hehe, thanks Nid. Their latest letter is from some ponce who says he doesn't want full payment, but wants to come to an agreement.

How about not at all matey since you probably don't have a CCA :mad:

scarednshakin

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Hiya

Thats right mate - send the Final response - CCA Received letter off. They have done what you wanted and issued theirs, so time to issue yours....

Worry not soldier boy, all is ok! :rotfl:

Cheers, will get it sent out, must cost BOS a fortune photocopying the SAME pages every time :rotfl::rotfl:

A quick question, before I leave you in peace for the weekend. CRappy One and Clydesdale CC's wrote to them last year and got the final responses from them about Sept last year. I never sent out the Final Response, do I send it now or just leave well alone as have not heard from them since

Locke

Morning NID.

I just thought I'd let you know I had Barclaycard in the phone this morning, I've been away from home most of the week but they've been ringing my house around 5 or 6 times daily with an automated message for me to contact them urgently.

I took the womans name and the time and then read out that message you gave me earlier in the week in post #1605, she kept trying to interrupt me so I had to put my hand over the earpiece just so I could get it all out.

When I finished I could hear her saying "I couldn't hear you properly" which I put down as a poor attempt at making out the request from me wasn't made.:rotfl:

I posted the letter off you recommended too so they should get that next week and that should be (fingers crossed) the last I hear from Barclaycard over the phone.:)

BeenieCat

Locke i've had Barclaycard too, and the answer machine picks it up halfway through the automated message, very annoying. And the man's voice is highly irritating. Also sounds a little like he wants to slice off my face.

never-in-doubt

scarednshakin wrote: »

Cheers, will get it sent out, must cost BOS a fortune photocopying the SAME pages every time :rotfl::rotfl:

A quick question, before I leave you in peace for the weekend. CRappy One and Clydesdale CC's wrote to them last year and got the final responses from them about Sept last year. I never sent out the Final Response, do I send it now or just leave well alone as have not heard from them since

It must cost us, the taxpayer a lot for HBOS' wastage! lol

Yep, leave well alone mate - let it become SB'd.... unless they write to you in which case, well, come see me