Employment Tribunal ... what are my chances ?

greendollar

Good advice jdturk , but an almost impossible task as my memory has never been that good , I have to sign on today and I know they keep records of vacancies they've given me to apply for and I'm hoping that they go back as far as Aug 2008 , I'll just have to explain that I haven't kept records of my own efforts to find work and hope the tribunal accept that I've done all I can to mitigate my losses , after all I am doing some work .

greendollar

UPDATE

One week to go and just had a meeting with my union rep , he's confident we will win if it goes to tribunal but has said they are desperate to talk (tomorrow) and thinks they will settle .
He did say my employer wrote to the tribunal and requested that I disclosed my income / assets and that the claim should be dropped as their would be no way I could pay their costs should I lose , they make reference to a case in Scotland where a claimant failed to disclose they had been made bankcrupt and the tribunal awarded the employer £8'133 in costs .
More scare tactics methinks , I have been upfront in regards to my financial situation with them , anyway the tribunal dismissed their request saying the all such matters will be dealt with at the tribunal ..... feeling quite upbeat after the meeting and will let you know how i get on .

dickydonkin

He did say my employer wrote to the tribunal and requested that I disclosed my income / assets and that the claim should be dropped as their would be no way I could pay their costs should I lose , they make reference to a case in Scotland where a claimant failed to disclose they had been made bankcrupt and the tribunal awarded the employer £8'133 in costs .

It is getting interesting now greendollar!

Hopefully your persistence and patience will pay off. The reality is that the majority of cases scheduled for tribunals are settled prior to the hearing and I suspect the tribunal panel will take a dim view of your former employer telling them how to deal with your situation regarding disclosure of finances.

Good luck!

jobbingmusician

My money is on the employer settling at the last moment. They are trying bullying tactics in saying that your records of employment efforts are inadequate, IMHO - doesn't your report to JCP list all the jobs you have applied for and interviews attended?

I don't know if you have read the ET thread I started a while back - it might give you some additional useful info as to what to expect, although it does sound as if you are getting excellent advice.

Solicitors have a responsibility to warn you that you might incur costs, but my unerstanding and belief is that they are VERY rarely awarded against the appelant, unless the case is believed to have been brought maliciously. I will be surprised if you see the inside of the courtroom, in any case. Your employer seems to me to be busy preparing an offer. Your risk is now that the Union will try to persuade you to take the first one - you might like to think about how much money you would be prepared to take to drop the case.

greendollar

Hi jdturk , this is the sticking point , IF I settle out of court then its my understanding that DWP cannot touch any of the money , IF I win at the tribunal the DWP will want any JSA paid back from the tribunal award, around £6000 to date , so I'd much rather settle out of court . I take my employers will know all this and base any settlement figure taking this into account ....plus they know I'm skint . As for tax , its my understanding that the award would have to be in the region of £30,000 + to be liable for it .

Then again I'd really like to say , stuff the money , it would be worth losing a few grand just to see these managers squirm for a little bit and justify my treatment to a tribunal , I know one has been off for months with stress , most probably couldn't sleep at night knowing he's screwing decent hardworking blokes over.

dickydonkin

jdturk wrote: »

say you get 8k as an offer, what would you actually take home after paying people the JSA back?

In terms of fairness I would say yes but if we are being realistic I think you probably would want to aim for 1/2 a years wage before tax (do you pay tax on payouts?) after you take costs away such as JSA.

If there is a settlement prior to tribunal - JSA will have no claim on any of the settlement. If the award is given by tribunal they can claim back any payments.

greendollar

Well my ex-employer has phone my union rep to ask if if I am ready to call it a day .
My union rep has said that I was as long as they made a reasonable offer to settle.
Their reply was they were only willing to pay what it is going to cost them to attend on the day , union rep says that will only be around £1000 to £2000 .
So on we go .

greendollar

Well , my ex-employer have said that all thats on offer is a £1000 , no substancial offer will be made and believe that the tribunal will go there way as no reasonable employer would re-employ some-one that had lied at their disciplinary . They openly admit that they haven't followed procedure but think that its irrelevant as I went on to admit the offence at appeal . Again they talk about cost that they say stand at over £15,000 and will increase if the tribunal goes ahead .
I have turned down the offer , which my union rep has said I should accept , and can only hope that the tribunal beleive me when I say I only admitted the offence because the manager implied that it was the only way I was going to keep my job .
Not so confident now but what the hell .

jazzyman01

I really do not understand why they are still going on about costs. If they really felt that the case had nowhere to go they would have gone for a pre-hearing review.

It is EXTREMELY rare that the courts award costs - and in any event it would never be the full amount.

They are trying to force you into accepting a derisory figure. Hopefully you are successful, but even if you are not, it cost them over £15k already - some small compensation?

dickydonkin

greendollar wrote: »

Well , my ex-employer have said that all thats on offer is a £1000 , no substancial offer will be made and believe that the tribunal will go there way as no reasonable employer would re-employ some-one that had lied at their disciplinary . They openly admit that they haven't followed procedure but think that its irrelevant as I went on to admit the offence at appeal . Again they talk about cost that they say stand at over £15,000 and will increase if the tribunal goes ahead .
I have turned down the offer , which my union rep has said I should accept , and can only hope that the tribunal beleive me when I say I only admitted the offence because the manager implied that it was the only way I was going to keep my job .
Not so confident now but what the hell .

Tell them this - See you at tribunal!

Greendollar - they are playing mindgames - you have been resolute for so long so don't get disheartened - the tribunal panel have heard all of this crap before and THEY will ultimately determine the outcome.

MrsP was given a derisory offer when she took her former employer to tribunal which she obviously turned down and the offer eventually increased - that's the way it works.

Ask yourself this - They are making threats of substantial costs but are also offering a settlement.

If you former employer really believed they would win at tribunal - do you think they would be offering you anything at all?

Of course not.

By virtue of offering a settlement (albeit laughable) they are testing the water because they know they are unlikely to be successful at tribunal and they are hoping that you are becoming so !!!!!! off that you will take anything on offer.

This will not go to tribunal and your offer will be increased.