Bank charges are fair!

System

The case wasn't about the fairness of charges, just if they fell within the scope of a certain piece of legislation and could be assessed by the OFT.

ajharris wrote: »

I appreciate that I am not going to make many friends on here with this thread but I will write this anyway. As everyone knows there was a court case recently regarding the banks overdraft charges. Persoanally I am glad that the banks did win the case. If the ruling had gone against them then we could find ourselves paying for many of the services/facilities which have always been free. This would affect people who never go overdrawn and would effectively mean that they are being punished for the overspending of others.

We hear about cases where people are charged thirty five pounds for going just a few pence overdrawn. These decisions are made by a computer which does not show discretion. If you do not make a habit of going overdrawn then almost invariably the bank will refund you in these instances as a good will gesture.

If people need more money they should speak with their bank first and arrange an overdraft. Going overdrawn without permission or exceeding an authorised overdraft is borrowing money without permission, this is wholly unacceptable. How would you feel if someone borrowed your money without asking?

People commonly complain about the disparity between the cost of sending the overdraft letter and what is charged by the bank. That is business I am afraid. Think of all the things which are made dirt cheap in China which are then sold with a massive mark up over here on our high streets. Why single out banks?

Banks offer total transparency, you can find out beforehand what you will be charged for going overdrawn without permission. These charges are not cloaked. Furthermore we live in an age where it is so easy to keep track of your money, on line, telephone, in branch and also text message banking. It has never been easier.

Some people claimed that they were owed thousands by the banks. For this to be the case they must have been perpetually and severely abusing their accounts. In my opinion the bank owed them nothing and common sense prevailed in the court.

Sharon87

vaporate wrote: »

Jobs are 'near' impossible to come by.

For graduates, taking non-graduate jobs can be a problem as employers 'know' they will do a runner once things pick up (if they ever will).

Then there is 'experience'. No need to explain that one as it is obvious where I'm going with that one.

Agree. I finished uni, moved to London and first of all only looked for jobs in my career path - nothing except 2 weeks unpaid experience. Started looking for shop jobs in Sep 08, didn't get a job till end of Feb 09. Half a year it took. I luckily had some savings and the occasional temp job for a day or 2, but other than that it took ages.

vaporate

Sharon87 wrote: »

Agree. I finished uni, moved to London and first of all only looked for jobs in my career path - nothing except 2 weeks unpaid experience. Started looking for shop jobs in Sep 08, didn't get a job till end of Feb 09. Half a year it took. I luckily had some savings and the occasional temp job for a day or 2, but other than that it took ages.

Thanks. A real life example of my model.

never-in-doubt

ajharris wrote: »

I appreciate that I am not going to make many friends on here with this thread but I will write this anyway.

Yawn, another troll post then eh? Knock yourself out!

ajharris wrote: »

As everyone knows there was a court case recently regarding the banks overdraft charges.

You mean unfair charges - not specifically overdrafts Get it right, at least!

ajharris wrote: »

Persoanally I am glad that the banks did win the case.

Why? So you feel it is ok for bigger companies to dictate and rule the roost over the general public eh? i.e. David and Goliath - so basically lets not put up any fight and instead, roll over and let them just do us from every angle.....

ajharris wrote: »

If the ruling had gone against them then we could find ourselves paying for many of the services/facilities which have always been free.

How so exactly? Your facts surrounding this wild accusation will be interesting - please provide proof or back-up your ridiculous statement with something more concrete..... please?

ajharris wrote: »

This would affect people who never go overdrawn and would effectively mean that they are being punished for the overspending of others.

How so? Have you got this from the banks or BBC website, either way you're way off the mark and totally wrong with your assumption!

ajharris wrote: »

We hear about cases where people are charged thirty five pounds for going just a few pence overdrawn.

EXACTLY - IT IS DAYLIGHT ROBBERY!

ajharris wrote: »

These decisions are made by a computer which does not show discretion.

Just remind me again, who programmes computers :think::think:

ajharris wrote: »

If you do not make a habit of going overdrawn then almost invariably the bank will refund you in these instances as a good will gesture.

Really? so lets assume your bank decides to pay a bill, this makes you 10p overdrawn and as a result you get charged £40 - they don't just refund it, occassionally maybe but not as standard....

ajharris wrote: »

If people need more money they should speak with their bank first and arrange an overdraft. Going overdrawn without permission or exceeding an authorised overdraft is borrowing money without permission, this is wholly unacceptable. How would you feel if someone borrowed your money without asking?

Idiot - what a silly comment in its entirety.

ajharris wrote: »

People commonly complain about the disparity between the cost of sending the overdraft letter and what is charged by the bank. That is business I am afraid. Think of all the things which are made dirt cheap in China which are then sold with a massive mark up over here on our high streets. Why single out banks?

No it is not business - with a normal business you have a right to choose and can go elsewhere. With banks this is taken out your hands somewhat, as you've seen when one bank sets presedent they all follow suit.

ajharris wrote: »

Banks offer total transparency,

:eek::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::eek:


On the above note, nuff said. If you really think banks offer total transparency then you're stark raving bonkers and slightly dillusional.... :rotfl: :rotfl:

vaporate

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Yawn, another troll post then eh? Knock yourself out!



You mean unfair charges - not specifically overdrafts Get it right, at least!



Why? So you feel it is ok for bigger companies to dictate and rule the roost over the general public eh? i.e. David and Goliath - so basically lets not put up any fight and instead, roll over and let them just do us from every angle.....



How so exactly? Your facts surrounding this wild accusation will be interesting - please provide proof or back-up your ridiculous statement with something more concrete..... please?



How so? Have you got this from the banks or BBC website, either way you're way off the mark and totally wrong with your assumption!



EXACTLY - IT IS DAYLIGHT ROBBERY!



Just remind me again, who programmes computers :think::think:



Really? so lets assume your bank decides to pay a bill, this makes you 10p overdrawn and as a result you get charged £40 - they don't just refund it, occassionally maybe but not as standard....



Idiot - what a silly comment in its entirety.



No it is not business - with a normal business you have a right to choose and can go elsewhere. With banks this is taken out your hands somewhat, as you've seen when one bank sets presedent they all follow suit.



:eek::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::eek:


On the above note, nuff said. If you really think banks offer total transparency then you're stark raving bonkers and slightly dillusional.... :rotfl: :rotfl:

I couldn't have said it better. Thanks

never-in-doubt

vaporate wrote: »

I couldn't have said it better. Thanks

I'm reading this thread with utter disgust at some of the idiots views! Jobs are plentiful are they? Benefits are available are they?

What planet do these people live on? I mean, why clean a bog for £7 per hour when you'll get more on the dole.... does a p/t job at Maccy D's pay the rent, bills, petrol etc etc etc - these guys are living on cloud cookoo land and as for the OP - he has 4 nuggets missing from the standard 12 pack!

Banks have ripped us off for years, they deserve everything they get and the more accounts I personally find to be unenforceable for people on here the better - sod the banks, the fat bonuses and their ego's. :eek:

Lokolo

never-in-doubt wrote: »

I'm reading this thread with utter disgust at some of the idiots views! Jobs are plentiful are they? Benefits are available are they?

What planet do these people live on? I mean, why clean a bog for £7 per hour when you'll get more on the dole.... does a p/t job at Maccy D's pay the rent, bills, petrol etc etc etc - these guys are living on cloud cookoo land and as for the OP - he has 4 nuggets missing from the standard 12 pack!

Banks have ripped us off for years, they deserve everything they get and the more accounts I personally find to be unenforceable for people on here the better - sod the banks, the fat bonuses and their ego's. :eek:

Us being the financially irresponsible I assume?

Jobs? I got a placement this year, with a number of my friends whom also got jobs. I don't know anyone (in rl) who hasn't managed to get a job over the past year. I find people coming on here saying jobs are few etc. and that they can't get one, personally, I don't believe it.

never-in-doubt

Lokolo wrote: »

Us being the financially irresponsible I assume?

Jobs? I got a placement this year, with a number of my friends whom also got jobs. I don't know anyone (in rl) who hasn't managed to get a job over the past year. I find people coming on here saying jobs are few etc. and that they can't get one, personally, I don't believe it.

Why is it financially irresponsible exactly? See, quick to jump in without actually realising facts - yet again Mr Lokolo......

I used the perfect example, as did Vaporate - assume I have no overdraft (and do not want one) and then for whatever reason I have a bill that gets paid early, lets (for arguments sake) say I rung my bank and cancelled the DD but they then made me overdrawn to pay it - they then charge me god-knows what for the priviledge when all along I wanted them to decline the payment.

Why should the bank be allowed to do this?

Another, more widespread problem affecting thousands - My bank just reduced my overdraft to below the current balance meaning it has made me immediately unauthorised overdrawn - I get charged, can do nothing about it other than pay up.

Is this right?

Regards to jobs, i'm not wasting my time arguing with you on that, your simplistic viewpoint proves that you have no idea about the Labour Market and so it's best I don't humiliate you with the facts. Suffice to say you're talking nonsense if you think it is that easy to go and get a job - at the last count you could be looking at approx 30 applicants per job, so trust me when I tell you students with no experience are the last people getting these so called jobs!

Lokolo

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Why is it financially irresponsible exactly? See, quick to jump in without actually realising facts - yet again Mr Lokolo......

I used the perfect example, as did Vaporate - assume I have no overdraft (and do not want one) and then for whatever reason I have a bill that gets paid early, lets (for arguments sake) say I rung my bank and cancelled the DD but they then made me overdrawn to pay it - they then charge me god-knows what for the priviledge when all along I wanted them to decline the payment.

Why should the bank be allowed to do this?

Another, more widespread problem affecting thousands - My bank just reduced my overdraft to below the current balance meaning it has made me immediately unauthorised overdrawn - I get charged, can do nothing about it other than pay up.

Is this right?

As explain on this forum many times, to fully cancel a DD you must go to the company. Cancelling a DD doesn't mean one cannot be set up again. Think about it, my gas and electric, if I cancelled the DDs on this it would be a big problem for British Gas.

The second option about overdrafts being taken away I agree is a serious one, but it only happens to people (from looking at this forum) who abuse their overdrafts.

And finally, a lot of member here do say a £100 authorised overdraft (or staying £100 in credit) is a good buffer zone for these problems.

Would you say its not financially responsible to have some sort of buffer for these sorts of cases? Living close to £0 for months and months is just asking some problems.

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Regards to jobs, i'm not wasting my time arguing with you on that, your simplistic viewpoint proves that you have no idea about the Labour Market and so it's best I don't humiliate you with the facts. Suffice to say you're talking nonsense if you think it is that easy to go and get a job - at the last count you could be looking at approx 30 applicants per job, so trust me when I tell you students with no experience are the last people getting these so called jobs!

As said in my post, I haven't had a problem getting jobs over the past 2 years and I see plenty of jobs advertised around town at the moment. I'd rather trust real life that what a couple of people on the interweb say.

Bit in bold - and whose faults that? I've had a part time job since I was 15. It's been awesome. I suppose thats why I am able to get a job.

Oh, and I didn't say it was easy, I just said it wasn't impossible like everyone else is saying.

never-in-doubt

Lokolo wrote: »

As explain on this forum many times, to fully cancel a DD you must go to the company. Cancelling a DD doesn't mean one cannot be set up again. Think about it, my gas and electric, if I cancelled the DDs on this it would be a big problem for British Gas.

Actually, to fully cancel a DD you tell the bank, if they then pay it you claim under the DD Guarantee. I was specifically referring to early payment collection, annual car insurance is the worst as they can sometimes get carried away from old DD authorisations....

I understand about BG but ultimately if it between my bank and me to sort payment, not them. They have NO rights and once cancelled with my bank, the fact they try and take money is illegal if not immoral.

Lokolo wrote: »

The second option about overdrafts being taken away I agree is a serious one, but it only happens to people (from looking at this forum) who abuse their overdrafts.

Nope - not at all, it happens moreso now with the CRA CIAS/INSIGHT sharing methods used by banks, therefore more and more people are waking up daily to find reductions.

I'm a prime example, never been in debt and have no debt. Earn well in excess of £70k and have thousands in my account but you know what - my bank lowered mine due to a data feed from Experian showing an incorrect CIFAS.

So, what did I do wrong there exactly? I appealed to HSBC and they did refund the £25 charge (this wasn't an unauthorised o/d fee - more the renewal fee for changing in 6 months - which I didn't ask for so why was I charged?)....

I have now stopped using HSBC all because of this one incident.

Lokolo wrote: »

And finally, a lot of member here do say a £100 authorised overdraft (or staying £100 in credit) is a good buffer zone for these problems.

My mortgage payment is well over £1,300 per month and varies between £900 to £1700 so sometimes I need an overdraft in case they take more. £100 is back pocket change to me, sorry but it is! I drink/gamble this on a good night out lol :rotfl:

Lokolo wrote: »

Would you say its not financially responsible to have some sort of buffer for these sorts of cases? Living close to £0 for months and months is just asking some problems.

Some people are genuinely skint mate - you must see that? The banks are not helping matters, moreso making them worse! There is no need to hit people on the breadline that are trying, with such extortionate charges.

Sorry, maybe it's just me that feels like supporting the majority over banks - but either way, I do and will never change - banks are scum and greedy scum at that! :mad:

Lokolo wrote: »

As said in my post, I haven't had a problem getting jobs over the past 2 years and I see plenty of jobs advertised around town at the moment. I'd rather trust real life that what a couple of people on the interweb say.

Visit JC+ for proof - their facts speak loud and clearly for themselves.... Oh, I worked there for 7 years as well and have a vast insight into the workings and Labour market System and trust me, students and the young struggle - in general - to find sustainable employment. Sustainable being the operative word.....

Lokolo wrote: »

Bit in bold - and whose faults that? I've had a part time job since I was 15. It's been awesome. I suppose thats why I am able to get a job.

Oh, and I didn't say it was easy, I just said it wasn't impossible like everyone else is saying.

I applaud your working ethos - I wish more layabouts had your attitude mate :T :T