Average civil servant earns less than a private sector worker

dandy-candy

Ty for explaining it
Omg it is amazing how much it all adds up to! Although it would be unfair to cut back peoples pensions after they have paid in all these years with the understanding that they would get "X" amount at the end.
Is the civil service obliged to offer pensions? Why don't they make it so that new staff who want a pension just arrange it themselves privately with a company and not through their employer? Would that work?

Old_Slaphead

People don't realise how phenominally expensive final salary pensions are under the current arrangements (that's why private companies have all but stopped them).

In about a decade, if things continue as at present, much more money will be paid out in public sector pensions than is being spent on the education system

princeofpounds

Is the civil service obliged to offer pensions? Why don't they make it so that new staff who want a pension just arrange it themselves privately with a company and not through their employer? Would that work?

No, it's not obliged to going forwards. But it has been standard practice for many years. There are incremental reforms to make it more affordable - councils are raising contribution rates for instance, and I believe some schemes are even moving away from defined benefit to defined contribution (which have their own problem where you have to rely on the individual to be far sighted enough to fund their own pension).

One of the main problems has been that using these promises of pensions has allowed them to keep wage rates down, and also that any attempts to reform them have been fiercely resisted by unions (unsurprisingly).

Omg it is amazing how much it all adds up to! Although it would be unfair to cut back peoples pensions after they have paid in all these years with the understanding that they would get "X" amount at the end.

Yeah, it's really expensive. I think you are starting to get it. One of the main problems is that yes, it would be in a sense unfair to take away benefits promised to people who had done their jobs well for many years. On the other hand, someone has to pay for it, and the problem is that it won't be the generation that made these impractical promises, it will be their children. So it's not fair on the younger generation either.

Either way it is going to be not fair on a very large group of people. That's why it doesn't get tackled by politicians. We will probably end up with increasing incremental pressures, and fudge a solution down the middle - Britain will become a higher tax economy for many years, but maybe retirement ages will be steadily worked upwards. There is no other way to deal with this but austerity.

treliac

A lot of public sector jobs are low paid, many well below average wage. Poorer pensioners are likely to qualify for welfare benefits in retirement, which will cost the country. Which will be cheaper? At least PS workers will have contributed to their occupational pensions.

Also, what is an average length of service - does anyone know? Many public sector jobs are performed by women, who have taken time out to have families and who work part time. Not too many qualifying for 40 years worth of pension based on full pay!

Old_Slaphead

Mozette wrote: »

Well if you join the Civil Service now - if they were taking on rather than getting rid - you'd find that the pension scheme is rather different now for new joiners.

But there's still about 35 years worth of staff to go through with the 'old' scheme ie retiring at 60.

Old_Slaphead

treliac wrote: »

A lot of public sector jobs are low paid, many well below average wage. Poorer pensioners are likely to qualify for welfare benefits in retirement, which will cost the country. Which will be cheaper? At least PS workers will have contributed to their occupational pensions.

Also, what is an average length of service - does anyone know? Many public sector jobs are performed by women, who have taken time out to have families and who work part time. Not too many qualifying for 40 years worth of pension based on full pay!

There are more lower paid workers in the private sector (over a million are on minimum wage - no public sector worker is being paid that little!) - who knows what the rules will be on welfare benefits in retirement will be in 20 years time?

Although average length of service individually may be low - for each job/position there may be several workers filling that role over the years and each will have accrued a part pension for that position.

Bootski

Why should they earn more??

They are the most inept, unhelpful bunch of timewaster there ever was.

Andy_L

Old_Slaphead wrote: »

There are more lower paid workers in the private sector

Of course there are, there are more private sector workers & the public sector has contracted out most of its low/un-skilled work to the private sector

Old_Slaphead wrote: »

no public sector worker is being paid that low!

no public sector worker?

Old_Slaphead

Andy_L wrote: »

no public sector worker?

Do you know of any?

Bootski

Old_Slaphead wrote: »

Do you know of any?

I knew of loads of overpaid workers, mostly middle management - not frontline staff, who've been laid off and

& GOOD! GOOD! GOOD!:D:D:D