depression

Tiff_2

Hi guys - I know it's late but here I am.
Haven't been avoiding my promise :rolleyes: - though I have subscribed to every MSE thread tonight and answered all posts even when I didn't know anything about the topic!:D lol- and I hope you're all still around and haven't nodded off.

Hi Rose, Mirolslav, Mrs. A, BettyBoop, Flis, Feeling Good, and the rest of the gang. i hope today has been kind to you and I'm wishing you all good things.

It seemed like a really good idea at the time :rolleyes: but suddenly NOT!!! But before our rose can get her wellies on, here i go ( holding nose & jumping in!:rotfl: ) - Tiff's bits and pieces.....

In truth I've been feeling very low over the last two weeks. I've read your stories of courage and hard times and have been inspired myself to keep going. It also distracts me from what I've been through and my problems. But things have been very hard lately.
I have wanted to reach out and say guys, I'm having a hard time - can you understand how I'm feeling? but never found the right time to post why. I guess the easiest way to do this is to summarise my experiences through bullet points ( and you thought War And Peace was long!!!;) ) I promise every word is true.

From...
8 years old - 16 years old: (1972-1980) I was:
- severely physically & mentally bullied at school certainly every week believe it or not - if not every day.
- ignored by my father - at 8 years old he pushed me to the floor when I tried to kiss him goodnight on the cheek, saying 'You're too old for that now.' Ironically to everyone around & to other people's kids he was the Dad I'd always wanted. he was a bully and selfish and all I ever wanted to do was make my Dad proud & to hear him say he loved me which he finally did in 2004- from 8 to 15 years old I was the victim (no other word for it) of a paedophile. I was 'groomed', bullied, blamed and threatened by this family friend. When I threatened to tell after trying to avoid him, he made me see it was all my fault and that no-one would believe me and that if I stopped being his 'friend', he would make friends with my sister (2 years younger than me) instead. Gosh i'm crying already & probably not making much sense.
- I had a bad fall and broke and dislocated every bone in my left arm and had 2 operations in a year. This left me even more of an outsider as I wasn't allowed in school due to the injury and the risk of further damage due to bullying.
- I was all set to take my O-Levels (ok , you got me Rose, I'm giving my age away - I'm 41 - will be 42 on Christmas Day) and started to take them. Even though he had never been to a parent's evening Dad had chosen all my options, including GCE's in German & French. I had been ill for a few weeks & it turned out to be glandular fever which is contagious & I wasn't well enough to sit my exams apart from the 3 I'd finished. I had it for 6 months.
- Dad threw me out - he was very strict and I 'm the eldest and at 15 I wasn't allowed to have boyfriends, wear makeup, have friends round or go out at night. mum disagreed & helped me have a few nights out at the disco (groan ) and when Dad found out he told me to get out. Social Services found me a rented room in a family home.

From 16 to 22 years old:
- needed to be earning money, out on my own and fell madly in love with the first person who told me he loved me at 16. Stupidly got married at 17 (always hoping for a fairy tale ) and was mentally abused. He wanted me to start a family with him and when I didn't get pregnant, he got me to go for gynae checks and various exams to find out why. Said it was all my fault. However the bar steward had forgotten to mention that he'd had a vasectomy - how sick is that? Completely destroyed what bit of confidence I'd gained. I was divorced by 17 and a half.
- At 18, i became very ill with my stomach and was told i had gallstones and that i'd have to have them and my gall bladder taken out. I was very young - usually middle-aged women they said get it - it was a very big operation then. I felt more ill and they reluctantly put me at the top of the surgical list and took me into hospital. I woke up 3 days later to see Mum at the end of the bed talking to a dr and my dad sitting at my bedside holding my hand. When he saw I was awake, he let go. I was told my appendix had been about to burst and if I hadn't had that surgery when I did, i could have been dead in a week.
- At 18, at the age of 45, Mum had the first of her 5 heart attacks and I was the one there to help her.
- I recovered and at 19 & 20 I was working in West Germany on a US Army base. I also had an abusive relationship there. I'd made plans to go home for my 21st birthday on Christmas day and Dad picked me up on the 21st. He stopped the car and told me that my darling cousin Darren had been killed 3 days before by a drunk driver. He was a lovely lad - was only 17. Needless to say, no celebrating for us - we were all devastated.
- at 22, back in Germany and I was the victim of an attempted rape. It went to court for trial, and i don't know how but I testified and then he changed his plea to guilty and was sentenced.
Guys, I just need to take a break just for a minute - put the kettle on x

From 22 - 36 years old:
- At 22, I found a penfriend in US Air Force based in England. I returned home at 23 and after another year I knew I had really fallen in love and we married when I was 25 years old. At 26, I was pregnant & had a son. I was very excited as he was due between Xmas Day - New Year's Day. However, he didn't want to come out and I was induced into labour on February 12th. He was born by emergency c-section on Valentine's Day and i was awake for the surgery.
-At 27, my darling aunty (Mum's sister) died 2 weeks after being diagnosed with breast cancer at 52. Grew up round the corner from her. Due to heavy snow in Suffolk I was the only one who wasn't with her when she died. She was buried on my son's 1st birthday God love her.

ARE YOU ALL STILL THERE?!

- At 29, posted with DH back to the USA to a base in Nevada. Worked for American Red Cross on base doing casework. Hubby resigned after 13 years in Air Force and got a golden handshake (part of Bush Snr's cutbacks). Moved to Virginia where it was strangely cooler after living in the desert
Neither of us could get work - out in the boondocks, savings used up so my son and I returned to England & hubby moved up to New York City where his family was. (They were all British but emigrated when hubby was 7). We waited 2 years for him to have saved enough to bring us back.
- After working our way up the ladder work wise, hubby became ill - rushed into hospital where he was diagnosed with cancer and we were told he wasn't going to make it. As a last ditch attempt to save him, they tried an experimental horse serum (!!! true I swear) and it saved his life.
-I landed a job as a Customer Service Manager working for the man who owned the whole 2,000,000 sq. ft. shopping mall. I helped settle problems between merchant stores and complaining customers, ran a service centre and hosted and set up various PR events. Best job I'd ever had - nearly didn't take it cos I didn't think I was good enough. One night I was on night manager duty (I often worked 14 hour days) in the security office when a call came in - a 16 year old who had been fired from his job had come back to his work and shot the manager in the head. And we were in a decent part of New York! It was horrifying. Amazingly, the lady recovered although couldn't work again.
- 2 months later, I and another staff member were held hostage. I shouldn't even have been at work - my temp was 100 degrees and I had laryngitis but it was so close to Xmas and we were very busy. I managed to get her out. I was very calm and peaceful and i knew I was going to die. After several hours, as I was being strangled, the police got in. My attacker only got a year because I didn't actually die and there was no weapon involved. I was devastated. Diagnosed with PTSD and became agrophobic too. 2 weeks into the New Year 1997 and with a great reference, my bosses kindly sacked me because I'd been off work for a month, had no health insurance & couldn't say when I would be back!

- 1997 - returned home to UK with our family staying at my family's house. After 3 of us in one bedroom, we were finally offered a house on an awful estate in November. I couldn't work, was still agrophobic and couldn't seem to get any help.
-1998 - Hubby's lovely mum died suddenly. He went back to New York for funeral and we were left with a debt of over £2000. He was very depressed for the next 14 months and became abusive and aggressive to me and son. One day in the car theatened to drive into wall and kill us all.
After 14 years together, via CAB & police, son and I went into a shelter. Divorce followed. Had to take the 1st place the councils offers you & they put us next door to a drug dealer, who'd already had his throat cut and whose customers kept knocking on my door. After everything we'd been through, I became very depressed and afraid. By the way, my son has always loved to sing, dance and act and growing up in USA didn't know about football - so to the neighbourhood kids, he must be gay. Plus he was mixed race. He was seriously bullied. We got a move on medical social grounds. We moved in on September 11th. Those poor, poor people. Were worried about US family but thank God no-one involved - few days later a plane crashed a few streets away from their house but not due to terrorism.

-Son started senior school - was beaten, abused and threatened continuously. He was even beaten with a lead pipe. This kid wouldn't let him walk on pavement on path up to his own house. We were still not far from where we'd lived before. Was assaulted over 40 times in 5 weeks. Moved house and school again - much better area.
- After al he'd been though with bullies, son became depressed at 13. He wouldn't make eye contact with anyone and would sit under the stairs at school and cry. He self-harmed in school. I was still very ill and my health was worse - started to become allergic to things and then diagnosed with acute asthma (always over-achieving!:o ) and my agrophobia was worse.

-Son was helped so mch by school - placed on Gifted & Talented Register. At 14, he opted to take GCSE Dance on top of the normal amount of GCSE's -1st time local college had offered it - 2 years crammed into 1 and in 2004 came out with an Aa grade!:T I was so proud. He had never had a lesson in his life due to cost & transport. He'd also taken a computer course on top too at the college. He was bullied by not just the other 10 students but also by the Tutor. He was suspended, but not the teacher, while they investigated and then 3 students were caught out with their stories & admitted it and confirmed son's story about the tutor, who suddenly resigned.
-Also in 2005, he was made prefect. He had the guts to go back into that computer class and face those animals and sit his exams and in August got told he'd got 3 distinctions, 1 merit and 1 pass. he also got Aa in Drama, 2b's , 3c's, 3 e's & 1 F in maths but he's resitting that. So he got 7 A-c passes and has been accepted into Stratford - upon - Avon College to study Performing Arts. He is loving it and so deserves it.
Apart from PTSD, Agoraphobia, depression, severe IBS, ever increasing allergies, & acute asthma, I started to get pain in my left knee in early 2005. waited a while then went to drs who sent me to specialist who told me I've got arthritis - started walking with a stick in summer 2005 and by Christmas 2005 it was in both legs, hips and neck and I was using crutches and occasionally wheelchair in supermarkets. Can't have physio because of the inflammation in all my joints and can't take the anti-inflammatory meds because they have dairy products in them & I'd become allergic to dairy stuff (bye bye chocolate ) - can only take paracetamol for pain. Took me a year to get a decision by DLA overturned for me to get higher rates. I was on the low rates but they said they wouldn't increase because as I could use my hands to use crutches, I was mobile!!! They never even got in touch with my dr! I've been told I can't have hip or knee replacements until i'm around 60 as they can only do the operation once or twice and the parts they use only last about 10+ years. So fairly quickly heading for a wheelchair. I'm sorry but I'd rather be walking at 41 than 61 if I had to choose.:mad:

-In November 2005, son got lead role in am-dram production of FAME - THE MUSICAL - he got amazing reviews - it was fantastic.
My Dad had developed gall stones and need surgery at that time and was only given 50% chance of surviving the anaesthetic because he had heart and lung problems. he survived the surgery and he was put into ICU for recovery before they were going to move him to a normal ward. He was bright and cheery, out of bed, eating and waiting for a bed on the normal wards to be free. he was so proud of my son. Five days later Dad was rushed back to theatre. In the first operation, they had nicked his bowel and he had developed septacaemia and peritonitis. They cleaned him out but he had also caught an unknown bug that they couldn't identify (not MRSA) and he had a high temp and they put him on a ventilator to give his body a rest to recover. then during physiotherapy, his feeding tube was dislodged and it went into his abdominal area - he could have drowned. the nurses didn't even notice till much later. My precious Dad died suddenly on 2nd December 2005. We buried him 5 days before Christmas - felt like my world had been emptied. The Coroner recorded a verdict in May of Death by Misadventure.

I was also diagnosed in May 2006 with carpal tunnel syndrome in both arms, needing surgery or I won't be able to use my hands - they go numb. August 2006 DLA overturned their decision and I got a year's disability back pay.

In June 2006, my sister was diagnosed with epilepsy and also had a breakdown through debts and stress so i tried to handle her financial problems.

I was told 2 weeks ago that i need to have a hysterectomy bringing the total of future operations to 7. My mum's been in sheltered housing now for a year - she's terminally ill. She was rushed into hospital a week ago - home now. So I've got the anniversary of the hostage situation in December as well as my Dad dying a year ago.

I have no friends - living abroad for years then coming home with agrophobia does that for you!:rolleyes: And I'm the one everybody drops their problems onto in the family.
I'm so very sorry for the length of this post - you did ask Rosie - but i don't know what I did wrong to deserve all this and I'm tired because I'm constantly fighting. I know it's wrong but I've felt a bit sorry for myself the last 2 weeks and I'm hanging on for my son who is LOVING Stratford College - even though it's 90 mins travelling each way every day and we're up at 5a.m.
I've told him I'm trying to make him as independant as possible so he doesn't have to rely on my poor efforts, though I do all i can. I love him so much and he deserves a good life.
Sorry about all this guys. i wanted you to know that I only post advice on things I experience myself. This is a pathetic post - I feel really embarrassed - I do apologize guys. It's just that I'm so proud of the way you're all fighting and I wanted to talk to people who could understand why I have depression and know what it's like. Again I'm very sorry for all this.
I'll be too ashamed to come back on post tomorrow.:o

But apart from all this, I'm fine!:D
Don't worry, I'll get my act together and I'll be a boucy happy Tiff again tomorrow. I've got a lot to be grateful for - lot of people here been through much worse I'm sure.
Just thank God I've only given you the short version!!!:rotfl:
Bless you all and wishing you much love
Always,
Tiff. x

Tiff_2

Bloody hell Miroslav - how did you know what I looked like?! Are you psychic?
let's talk lottery numbers....

Tiff_2

rose07 wrote:

ah tiff i see you have escaped my grasp again, near yet soo far. lol
i was wondering if you could tell me more bout PTSD? i got told by a councellor when i was telling her all things happening.
what is cognitive therapy? think i have spelt that one right.
ok too many questions
i really hope you ok hun, keep posting and take care :A
xxx

If I'm still allowed to post will tell you about Cognitive Behavioural Therapy - known as CBT - & PTSD tomorrow- fantastic therapy - hard work -worth it
I didn't dodge you angel ;)as you will see from the length of my post, it took so long to type.
Type it? You should try living it!!! :rotfl:

Dora_the_Explorer_5

This is the webiste for online DIY Cognitive Behaviour Therapy, it's supported by the NHS and gives an idea what CBT is all about. It contains a DIY CBT programme, which is useful for those who live in an area where there is an extremely long wait for CBT. HTH

http://www.livinglifetothefull.com/elearning/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid

rose07

hi tiff
soz i dozed off last night. awful i know. lol

thanks for sharing your story, (your a wonderful thing)
no more running away now.

ok firstly you struck a nerve with me tiff, i can relate to quite a few things you have said. and all i can say is you should be very proud of yourself you have came through it all and are still here. :T
(me i tried numerous times to end things which is a bit weak as its taking the easy way out).:o

i have been feeling really low myself in the last little while, but your post has made me feel like im not alone on a few things and lifted me up a little. so thanks. and yeah i can understand a little of how you are feeling (not all but a little), with this thread it is great, obviously not great why this thread is here, but greeeat that we can all hold on and keep going together, and that means all of us. (i notice a few have been slacking;))

oke doke, this may be long. . . .

tiff how do you feel now you have told us all those things?

i was bullied for the way i looked when i was at school, sometimes the mental abuse can hurt more than the physical for me, as if someone hits me then its over its done with but if someone says something about me it hits me alot harder(im a sensitive soul).
as i have said i can relate to a few things you have said and i want to say you are not alone.
i was abused by my uncle when i was younger he called it playing games!!!!:mad: , once we learn that its the people that do these things that have the problem not us, they are the ones that sink to such a low standard that they feel they need to put down, and treat people vulnerable than themselves with no respect.
this guy that groomed you etc..., is what i would call a fu**ed up *****. (ok so cant quite say the name here but people like that deserve no thoughts, so wont say anymore on him!!!)
not only did i have to cope with the bullying at school through primary and secondary school, but when i came home, i would get abuse of my mum, she can be very controlling and irrational. when i was little she would always get angry and hit us, we wouldnt know what to do, numerous times i would hear her shouting at my dad and i would hide in my room far to scared as to what would happen, i remember one time we were all sat down to a meal and my mum, threw a plate at my sister just because she wouldnt eat. (what kind of message is that to send to a young child?)
i know what you mean about strict parents tiff my mum was soo strict, as you may be able to tell? i wasnt allowed BFs back here or anything like that.
i still aint!!!, now im back with my parents after being at uni, and things havent changed she is still irrational, controlling and very very angry (i think she has manic depression but doesnt want to admit it). you may wonder why im back in such a bad environment for my depression and myself. but i have no where else to go. i also have a princess to consider i missed out 3 years of her life whilst at uni and have regreted it as she has aged soo much and i wasnt there for her. i do feel awful about this but she is a clever thing.
(ok need to stop typing about me mum that is upsetting me, (i can never understand why people close to us always seem to be the ones that hurt us most???)

i became very ill through school and college and then it continued on till university, (there is numerous things but not going to go into all it), one of them is to do with my feet, i used to be such an atheletic thing i played football did atheletics and cycling etc... now i am finding it hard to walk, i have something wrong with my toes and im waiting on an operation to change it, but i have seen a chiropodist and he said if it doesnt get sorted soon i will not be able to walk (devastating ), but there is a waiting list and i just have to wait.

at 22, back in Germany and I was the victim of an attempted rape. It went to court for trial, and i don't know how but I testified and then he changed his plea to guilty and was sentenced.
ok i have picked this bit out for a reason. . . .. . . .wait for it.
before i went to uni, i was a totally different person to what i am now. i was a young, vulnerable thing, in a new world. strong but weak at the same time,
(trying not to cry here.........)
ok i never say much about this as im still trying to get through it.
i was enjoying my first few weeks of uni soo much as it not only meant i had my independence but my freedom from home, it meant sooo much to be there and to meet new people from different backgrounds.
but one night out turned into the worst night of my life. . . . . . .
i was out with friends it was great, we got back to the flat at bout 1? well late. we sat up smoking and drinking, talking and i fell asleep, my mates put me in bed and tucked me in, i woke up not knowing where i was, it was about 3 in the morning, i went to the kitchen i was still drunk as could tell i wasnt alright, i was very ill ( i think my drink had been spiked!!!) ok so next thing im walking out of my flat (i lived in student accomodation in a block of flats), i sat on a step and burst into tears (dont ask me why guess alot just got to me), anyway some south african students came up the steps they were all guys, they started talking to me, and coaxed me into thier flat, i was still pretty disorientated at this time.
we end up in someones room, they get me to make rollies for them, but i didnt really know how .
then they gave me a drink of coke, i had a few sips and realised that it didnt taste like coke. next thing i know im on a bed with one guy holding me down and another ( well use your imaginations).
i felt soo trapped and vulnerable, i was helpless, there were also two guys blocking the exit, i was in shock and couldnt move couldnt talk, i tried to shout but nothing came out.
now somehow i got out of there i dont know how call it fighting spirit, i ran as fast i could up to my flat and shut the door, i was shaking in shock couldnt move but managed to ring one of my flat mates she came straight out, i was crying (a right state).
she brought me into the living room, and asked me what had happened, i could barely talk i was a shaking and in such shock. i managed to tell her (little did i know that two of my other flat mates overheard and went and got security), next thing i know the poilce are at the door, security, and resident tutor, i then end up having to tell my story over and over, by this time its about 4 in th morning.
i had to strip as they wanted my clothes for evidence, i had to sign every bag to say it was mine, was awful i felt like i was dreaming. i was soo shattered. (pause for break, all emotional all of a sudden)
i will tell you the one image that stick in my mind, the four guys that hurt me, getting taken away by the police , each with four police around them, was awful, i felt guilty, like it was my fault, and that i was the one to blame.
since then my life hasnt quite been the same, after the incident i had to go to hospital for tests and things, was horrible. i think the worst thing from all of it though is they got off, got to walk. :mad: :mad: :mad: , even though i was told that all was in my favour as it were, they had the evidence they even managed to get confessions and my flat mates even said they would be witnesses. but for some reason it all fell through.
it all makes me soo angry as that means they are still out there hurting someone, and everything i went through seems for nothing.
this is how i got my PTSD tiff
i have to say though, that whilst at uni i met some great people, which included my tutors and many close friends, and if they werent there to keep an eye on me dont know where id be. (hey we all need someone).

ok nuff bout me, but there you know one of my deepest darkest secrets, recently i have used my creative side to express how i feel, i did a project on what happened and it was whilst i was researching i found that of all rapes in the uk, only a small percentage something like 5% go to court which is just awful, what about the other 95%? i have no closure on this but what i can do is help others and be stronger from the experience. i am certainly not the same person who started uni. i am alot more careful, i have not been with a guy in 3 years, (mainly due to the fact havent been able to trust again yet).
but im getting there, there are some nice people out there, and i believe what will be will be.

ok back to you tiff. . . . .

what was the US like for you, cant quite imagine how the army base in west germany was either?

its awful when we loose the people we love tiff as it can hit us hard, but the people that i have lost will always be in my heart, they may not be here with me, but as long as they are with me then they are still here.
i lost my nana in 1998, that hit me hard, but the thing that keeps me going is that the family say that they see her in me. she was a remarkable lady, she suffered in soo many ways but she kept going and i have great respect for anyone that does keep going, as even though depression and all the things you said you suffer with tiff, you still keep chugging on, its amazing the amount of people i meet on here that show such strength, its a truly wonderful thing, shows determination.

tiff i find it hard that you have no friends? do you work? maybe that a silli question.? well you got me hun, and i see how many people you help on here you are a good friend to many and help any way you can, always ready with advice and places to look at. you do have friends hun, and hey you may even get to meet me one day if my brother is going to warwick i will be visiting him (you lucky devil you)

hows your health at the mo? bearing up? it all sounds like alot for you to handle, but you are doing it and this is the main thing.
your son sounds wonderful, battled the bullies, now at college/uni, he is a fighter and wont be put down, very creative and strong, and you know who he gets that off tiff?

we may not be able to change the past but we can change the future, we can look at past experiences learn from them and then no get into the bad side of things, as long as we all learn from mistakes and become stronger from it then nothing can knock us down as we will always be ourselves.

hope all this has made some sense to you??
have bee ntyping a while, and now my mum is home and she is shouting so better go face the music.

tiff i am glad you posted made me feel like im not alone. and im sure there are plenty out there that feel the same
much love to you tiff
take care
xxx

lol. and you thought you could type lots.

Miroslav

Flip! You too post long!

Here's hoping the rest of your lives bring alot more happiness and success!

I've felt fairly low today, no real reason, just one of them days. Off shopping at 6pm, so may buy myself a Cream Doughnut to cheer myself up

Miroslav

Tiff wrote:

Bloody hell Miroslav - how did you know what I looked like?! Are you psychic?
let's talk lottery numbers....

Stay away from me with the eyebrow's :rotfl: I'll have nightmares :rotfl:

Lottery Numbers

09, 10, 12, 21, 38, 44

Tiff_2

Hey Rosie, thank you for posting. Before I go on, Hi to everyone bettyboop, slayerx, Mrs.A., flis, feeling good, miroslav and everyone here. I hope today was kind to you all.

First, I am so sorry for my post last night. If I upset or offended anyone, that wasn't my intention. I don't know really what came over me but before I knew it, I'd told a lot more than I'd meant to. It's a good Martin MSE doesn't charge by the word! And I didn't put all of it either!:rolleyes:
I felt really ashamed after and quite low today - I wouldn't have been surprised if you'd totally ignored me... that's the reaction I expect and I would understand if you'd all rather I didn't post again. You always wonder what people will think of you.

Thank you Rosie for posting & sharing. You've got me crying again,- bless you - for all of us. It lets out the pain a little but some of my tears are of relief because it helps to know that I'm not the only one who's had some hard times. I was always the one people came to with their problems - I was out on my own so I put on the smile that never quite reaches your eyes and showed the world how strong I was.
I think I said, I'm 41 now and I've kept this paedophile a secret from my family for 25 years. I eventually wrote a letter because I needed people to know what had happened and I didn't want to carry around my 'dirty, little secret' and I sent it to my Dad, my brother & my sister. They all begged me not to tell Mum for she is so ill and I haven't. I wish I hadn't been such a cowardly young girl - I wish I'd told - thought at the time that it's my own shame, I made him feel like this I can keep a secret forever, no-one ever has to know. But the pain hurts inside like an ulcer and it grows.
Worse decision of my life because God knows how many others he may have assaulted and I think about that all the time. And he's dead many a year ago now. So there's no justice except to hope that Karma will somehow work it's magic on his soul.
Hang on a minute... if Karma's involved, what the heck did I do in a previous life to deserve all this?!:rolleyes:
Anyway just wanted to say sorry to you all.
Miroslav - Slayerx - it's ok - we're not men haters - you can come out and post - it's safe angel! lol:rotfl:
Kind of upset right now so I'm off. I'll be under the table if anyone wants me!;)
I hope you don't think any the less of me. Will stop by briefly later.
Be kind to yourselves.
Much Love Always,
Tiff x

Miroslav

Tiff wrote:

Miroslav - Slayerx - it's ok - we're not men haters - you can come out and post - it's safe angel! lol:rotfl:

It's okay, my opinion of women is quite low, but i'm always open to surprises

My opinion of men is even lower, so..........:rotfl:

No need to apolgise for writing all that either

Tiff_2

Miroslav wrote:

Stay away from me with the eyebrow's :rotfl: I'll have nightmares :rotfl:

Lottery Numbers

09, 10, 12, 21, 38, 44

Those numbers are going on a ticket on Friday - don't tell anyone else!;)
Maybe the game wasn't such a great idea :rolleyes: I've got more than a dusting of the Fern Britten's but you're ok with the Norman Lamont eyebrows - I haven't got them - it's his legs that I've got!!!:rotfl: Bless you x