Saving energy - turning things off at the plug

amberklene

As a current service engineer in the electronics industry...
Regulations on energy consumption of equipment in standby are tough. Someone stated that a lot of energy can be lost in the power supply - rubbish. Most appliances such as modern CTVs have in some cases seperate power supplies for standby so they are able to meet the new mandatory energy standards. If the appliance has a power switch to isolate it from the mains when not in use - then use it - for safety and energy consumption. Keep the cost in perspective - we dont loose sleep over the fridge and freezer being left on do we?. If its a VCR/SKY box/bedside clock leave it on. PSU failures can increase for these products when cycled on and off repeatedly, mainly due to poor design frankly. SKY+ have Hard disk drives I have heard arguments for both sides of the coin for reduced life expectancy when these are being cycled on/off. Personally in a SKY+/freeview STB I would not bother unplugging it, aerial distribution is disrupted, you may be in breach of contract, user guides and software updates can be missed etc. The PC is a different story and unless 'mission critical' power it off when not in use totally. Lastly if readers main concerns were for increasing life expectancy - the killer is poor cooling - the top of the vcr etc. is not the place to store all your DVD collection and the Radio Times, or worse still a place for the cat to sleep.. (when the timer kicks in - it makes the cat jump anyway) Nor is it a good idea to stack them one on top of the other for the same reason.

Wig

Cardew wrote:

This information is typical of the mis-information put out to 'scare' consumers by vested interests.

No it's accurate average user information IMO.

I would dispute strongly that those figures are 'typical' - they are a huge over-estimation of the costs.

I wouldn't

An appliance using 1 Watt left on 24/7 365 days a year will consume 8.76 kWh which is roughly 70 pence per year.

Actually for most people who don't have E7 the cost would be between 97p to £1.36 with the average user being about £1 (don't fall for marketing gimmicks like 2 tiered pricing look at the bill as a whole)

Take TVs as an example. Virtually all modern sets(last 10 years or so) have a standby consumption of less than 1 Watt - later models much less.

sounds like misinformation from you, where's your proof? My experience, brand new LCD TV standby 7w. Sky box standby 17w. (dont't turn it off though). Most of 'my' equipment does not have the standby figure in the manual, because it's either old so they never used to give this info, or it's newish and they still don't give the info - Force box, philips dvd recorder. So there is no way for me to refute you by giving accurate figures without buying a power monitor. But my guess is each one is about 5 watts...........I just checked philips specs online for one of their dvdr they say less than 5w they can't even be bothered to give an accurate figure! but if it is 4w that is £4. and my telephone is 3w giving £3 which is again close to what they quoted (£5).

My 32 inch Sony has a standby consumption of 0.6 watts. The DVD and stereo surround sound(Sony DAV -S800 with 5 speakers & woofer) takes 1.5 Watts and the VCR(Sony SLV-SE810G) 1.2 Watts. These are about 6 years old.

Most people do not have new stuff, most people do not have Sony, most people have equipment with standbys way over those figures.

As for the LCD displays on my Microwave, Washing Machine and Cooker - I can't even measure the power they use on standby. Even huge commercial LCD displays have a tiny wattage.

the w m/c was only quoted at £2 per year so that's about 1.7 watts which is probably accurate for w m/c which have a standby function.

Those 'typical' figures might have applied to 1960's appliances but are certainly not typical of today's appliances.

Proove it. I'm sure the energy saving trust can proove their figures.

Look at the manufacturers specifications on the internet for verification.

Again most people don't have new stuff so looking for new products is relatively a waste of time. Plus not many manufacturers are complying with the "less than 1w" best practice. It's not mandatory.

deanos

Even if an appliance uses 1w in standby if everyone turned an appliance off it would add up to ermm loads or electricity and greenhouse gasses not being produced, just because it costs 70p to run over a year dosent mean you should not turn it off , if you dont use it turn it off !

Cardew

Wig,
Not your finest post IMO, and you are just clutching at straws to be argumentative.

Not much point in going through 'blow by blow' comments on your post, however to take just one - the cost of 1 Watt for 24/7 to the average consumer.

Everyone uses their first tier of electricity prices on 'essential' consumption. So the additional cost of electricity for standby consumption can be realistically calculated at the second tier price. i.e. Any savings for switching off standby would be saved from tier 2 electricity.

I used the figure of 70p for 8.76kWh which prices a kWh at 8p a kWh. (I pay 7.157p incl VAT) However if you wanted to include a pro rata proportion of tier 2(11.907p for me) it would still be less than 8p. Your 97p to £1.36 prices a kWh at 11.07p to 15.52p. BG's standard tariff for their highest charging area is 10.242p(and BG are far from the cheapest) So how do you arrive at your figures?

However if, for the sake of argument, we concede that £1 is a figure for some, it hardly 'alters the price of fish' does it? 70p or £1 a year in savings!!It is also pertinent to point out that, as a TV is often in use some hours each day, the saving would be even less.

I wonder what brand new model LCD TV has a standby consumption of 7 watts? care to tell us the make and model?

I have just bought a 32" Medion LCD TV MD 31134(from Aldi) and that has a standby consumption of less than 1 Watt.
I suspect my consumption is more typical than yours.

I also have an old 28 inch Panasonic TV(TX-28CK1) with a standby consumption of 0.9 Watts.

I have been very specific on quoting models and their consumption and yet you make very general statements stating my figures are atypical, manufacturers not complying etc. Perhaps you could proove(sic) some of your statements.

Cardew

deanos wrote:

Even if an appliance uses 1w in standby if everyone turned an appliance off it would add up to ermm loads or electricity and greenhouse gasses not being produced, just because it costs 70p to run over a year dosent mean you should not turn it off , if you dont use it turn it off !

As Yukko explained succinctly in the post above

The environmental brand names have been pushing quite hard with stuff like this recently. The usual one is that if everyone turned off their TV at night we could get rid of a power station. Of course this is complete rubbish, power supply capacity is driven by peak demand not by how much power we use when we are asleep, which is why economy 7 electricity is cheaper at night, it needs to be used.

However more importantly, and at the risk of upsetting another contributor, it is not for you to tell me or others what we should do.

I don’t tell you not to have a PC, not to be connected to the internet, and waste resources in that fashion; that is your choice!

I leave my TV on standby because I want to and can afford the few pence a year it costs; that is my choice!

Wig

Cardew,

How I arrived at my figures, go to an energyswitch comparison site
choose electricity, choose all tarriffs and all payment methods type in 3000 kwh consumption. You will see the approx cheapest is Ebico @ about £298 the most expensive is around £468

Gives price per kwh from 11p to 15.6p taking everything as a whole. However I concede that you are right the amount of consumption even if saved would only for most people affect their tier 2 consumption. but for Ebico users it makes no difference you save what you save.

It is an Evesham 37" LCD TV
I cannot quote specifics in the main because I like most people don't have new stuff, and even in the new stuff they don't always tell you stand by or, if they do, they generalise like Philips do.

I believe myself to be no worse than you, you quote with alledged certainty that appliance these days have low standbys, with no evidence other than your own examples. I alledge that most appliances in use today are higher than you think, and those that are new are also not necessarily less than 1w with no evidence other than the Energy savings trusts figures and my own examples.

I just think that when I see you telling people "that standby talk is rubbish" with no real evidence or statistics, that I should point out that it could easily be true.

gavhen

deanos wrote:

Even if an appliance uses 1w in standby if everyone turned an appliance off it would add up to ermm loads or electricity and greenhouse gasses not being produced, just because it costs 70p to run over a year dosent mean you should not turn it off , if you dont use it turn it off !

well done deanos, everyone else seems to have missed the more important point here - whilst this is a money saving website i'd hope that people may be able to see beyond just the effect on their wallet!!

if this advice was followed in all the households and businesses across the country then the collective effect on the amount of energy consumed would surely be large enough to make it worthwhile environmentally, even if heaven forbid you individually dont gain that much finnancially.

deanos

Yes thats the point i was trying to make, its about planet saving not money saving every little bit helps no matter how small.

Cardew

deanos wrote:

Yes thats the point i was trying to make, its about planet saving not money saving every little bit helps no matter how small.

This is a money saving website and this forum is Green and ethical Money saving I was simply quantifying how much money is saved by not using standby.

If your reasoning is to be followed, everyone should get rid of TVs, computers, internet, DVDs etc . Where do you stop? Don't have a bath but shower, don't go on foreign holidays, no car, etc etc

To be perfectly serious, how do you justify a computer and the internet and posting hundreds of times on this forum, yet can be critical of someone 'wasting' a few pence per year by leaving their TV on standby.

Incidentally on the principle that electrical energy converts to heat, my massive 0.6 watt of standby energy helps warm my house and thus is not wasted for most of the year.

Also I believe it harms most electrical devices to be switched on and off literally thousands of times a year. Indeed if your argument is to be followed why have a standby facility? or even an on/off switch? when you can switch on and off at the wall. Come to that, why have a remote control? That 'wastes' 2 x AAA batteries in mine.

The 'Green Police' preaching their politically correct, self-righteous nonsense fail to appreciate we live in the 21st century.

deanos

I didnt say get rid of anything i said if its not in use then switch it off to save electricity, simple really if everyone in the workd did this then just think how much electricity would be saved and greenhouse gas and money saved.