How to help a delusional friend?

Paisley_3

Hi everyone. I've been reading this board for a few months and I just firstly want to say what great people you all are. You're all optimistic, realistic, sensible! If only the subject(s) of my post could be the same!

Ok some of you might recognise me from my other posts if not here's a little background. I live with my OH and we are both in full time employment. We know a guy who graduated from uni 18 months ago (me and my partner graduated 2 years ago). He has started a very ill-fated 'business venture'. He's totally dellusional - he calls himself the 'managing director', he hands out little business cards..you get the idea. He is actually in partnership with a guy who doesn't seem to do much and works in a chip shop. The business is writing bespoke software for companies. After an 18 month drought of work (one or two 'cash in hand' jobs which he spent on rubbish) and getting up to his limit on at least 2 cc's and his overdraft (at least £4,000 in my estimate not counting student loans) he and his girlfriend started being really odd with us. Putting us down but yet copying what we did. We were friends for ages and ages with them and we didn't just want to drop them, but after the way they started to use us then be rude to us, and the disgraceful way he treats her -she works about 10 hours a week in a pet shop, she pays the rent, bills, buys the food etc - when they are in a shop she'll say 'can I buy a bar of chocolate' and he's say 'no!' (it's HER money!) then he'll make her buy him an icecream! - we really made an effort to avoid them. I mean, she was a different person - he wouldn't let her buy new clothes/have a haircut etc - I felt deeply sorry for her. We're going to Goa in August and all she says is 'I wish I could go on holiday' with a sad voice. I felt so bad for her I considered buying her a top and giving it to her saying it didn't fit me, just to cheer her up.

Until yesterday!

I spoke to her yesterday (over the phone) and she said she's just got in from the office. I said 'what office' (remember she works in a shop) and it turns out SHE's now opted not to get a full time job (she left education last week) and is starting a flipping wedding planning company - not to be rude but she is seriously dyslexic (nothing wrong with this but her 'professional' letters and ads are atrocious) and terrible at organising things (and is only 20 and has never been married/to a wedding!!) - she's now working nights in the pet store and spending her days in the rented office across the hall from her boyfriend! Doing nothing, and not getting paid.

I went off on one a little bit and reminded her that with outgoings of £500 a month and only £160 a month coming in how on earth are they supposed to live? I begged her to get a job, I offered to help her find the right one, part time even, just so she won't end up deeply in debt or bankrupt. She said she'll think about it in a few months. Scarily, she sounds just like her OH - she used to be so sensible with money (on the brink of being flipping tight but if you gotta be you gotta be!) and now she's all 'in 2 years I will be making twice what I could be/what you are' - I can't get her to see reason. You don't start a business from debt. You get a job.

I'm even more worried about her boyfriend. I don't see them much any more at all and I speak to them maybe once a twice a week on yahoo messenger and he's told me he has a 'job on' paying £1000 over 8 weeks with £1000 payable on completion (he won't say doing what other than 'a website'). Firstly £2000 is rubbish for 8 weeks work - considering it's split 2 ways and then some for the taxman, some for the float etc. But there is the thing. He opened a business bank account, paid the deposit in then promptly put a large chunk of it (if not it all) into his current account! You cannot do that!

Is all hope lost for these delusional people? Should I really block them off messenger and ignore them in the street, or simply watch them mess their lives up and potentially face legal action? How can anyone be so blinkered?

(Apologies for another huge post by the way!!)

**purpleprincess**

I don't think you can help someone that doesn't want to be helped hun.

Paisley_3

How can someone be so delusional and callous that they are not only bringing themselves down, they are bringing down the person they've been leeching off for almost two years

It's sad - and at 25 he should so know better.

southernscouser

Unforutnately some people have to learn from their own mistakes!

By all means advice them to do business plans and all the rest of it but you can't do anything than give your opinion. If they listen to your advice but still go ahead fair enough. But if they are too ignorant to even listen to your opinion/advice then leave them to get on with it! :rolleyes:

Paisley_3

Will he get in trouble for putting money from the business account into his personal one and not paying a penny in tax?

**purpleprincess**

Paisley wrote:

How can someone be so delusional and callous that they are not only bringing themselves down, they are bringing down the person they've been leeching off for almost two years

It's sad - and at 25 he should so know better.

Some people just are hun!! No rhyme or reason for it. You can't make someone do something they don't want to do.

Thing is there are situations where people are 35, 45, 55, 65 and even 75 that should know better!! I don't think it matters what age you are, some people are just permanently fixed in cloud cuckoo land!!

And the best thing with these people is just nod when they tell you their hare-brained schemes! You can't do anything more, you'll only stress yourself out and where's the good in that!

Hope it all turns out ok xx

**purpleprincess**

Paisley wrote:

Will he get in trouble for putting money from the business account into his personal one and not paying a penny in tax?

If he does he does I suppose

Thriftylady

I see how frustrating this is, but I think you just have to grit your teeth and let them get on with it.

My sister is exactly the same, and her useless (ex) husband spent 15 years wasting money and getting into debt, and then set up a stupid business which there was no market for in our area, getting them further into debt. But, in the years she was with him, my sister became more and more like him, and from someone who worked for her living and supported herself, she turned into a 'poor me, world owes me a living' scrounger, who now lives on benefits (and no, I'm not having a go at people on benefits, but I know my sister, and she could work if she could be bothered to) and has been bailed out countless times by various family members, myself included. Its heartbreaking to see this in someone you care about, and I love my sister dearly, but the more you try to bail someone like this out, the less they will stand on their own two feet.

Paisley_3

**purpleprincess** wrote:

Some people just are hun!! No rhyme or reason for it. You can't make someone do something they don't want to do.

Thing is there are situations where people are 35, 45, 55, 65 and even 75 that should know better!! I don't think it matters what age you are, some people are just permanently fixed in cloud cuckoo land!!

And the best thing with these people is just nod when they tell you their hare-brained schemes! You can't do anything more, you'll only stress yourself out and where's the good in that!

Hope it all turns out ok xx

Oh you're right! I am very stressed - I almost feel like I have to worry on their behalf. I'm not loaded by any means but I am sensible with money (as most of us on here are). I feel like I'd feel if a member of my own family was in debt with their head in the sand. I thought I could make him have a 'lightbulb moment' but as lots have said before you can't. It's been 18 months now and I feel terrible for them regardless - putting a pint of milk on a credit card and being so uncharacteristically nasty whenever I mention anything he can't afford (and I don't rub it in either )

Do you think for some people debt makes you believe in the near impossible - he seems to think like a wannabe lottery winner, hoping for a cash windfall with little to no work.

nomoneytoday

Only she can make the decision. By all means offer advice, support and be there if it doesn't work out.

Who knows, maybe the wedding business might work out if she gives it a go?

All it needs is one (spellchecked) brochure in the right place, one booking that went well and then word of mouth will build the business...

jessicamb

Paisley wrote:

Will he get in trouble for putting money from the business account into his personal one and not paying a penny in tax?

Almost undoubtedly - the Inland Revenue like to see books balance!

Not much you can do though - they need to realise their own problems. Its hard but you need to step back and let them get on with things. Sounds harsh and I dont mean to be but they are obviously not bothered and I think its just likely to end in arguments.