Will Gordon Brown send UK economy over the edge?

Graham_Devon

By artificial I mean just what I said. Changing legislation which means people have to go on a course to keep their beneifts. The trainers are then needed to provide those courses.

To anyone else not on beneifts, the courses are discouraged through very high costs. I'm sure we have all had local training course leaflets, some of the courses costing in excess of £200 if you are not on benefits, £5 refundable if you are.

Also, grants to companies to take on staff they don't really need, but if they take them on, they will get a bonus sum of money from us lot.

The thing with stimulus is it can create a growing economy, as seen in america, who are now in growth. However, just after the growth starts, they start taking away the stimulus.

General Motors see a 45% decline in sales because stimulus has ended.

A 45% decrease in sales means unemployment for some of those people employed by General Motors.

So, they have hung on to their jobs for a year while stimulus is in play, only to find themselves unemployed when stimulus is cut. Now calls for more stimulus to keep those same people in jobs. So, lets say they do offer more stimulus, car sales go up, few people keep their jobs. Then stimulus has to be cut later....back to sqaure one.

amcluesent

Any talk of 'stimulus' with even more debt after Clown's wrecking of England is risible.

His lamentable record is one of massive increases in public spending, public debt and off balance-sheet liabilities during years when there was real economic growth.

Socialists never thought to fix the roof when the sun was shining by creating a sovereign wealth fund! Instead we've had 10 years of drift and dither in energy supplies, roads infrastructure, unreformed NHS, hidden unemployment and 800,000 numpties added to the public sector payroll. But now Town Clerks can command £250,000 salaries and go at 50 with a pension pot worth £1M!

Britain's lost £ 3 TRILLION in wasted 'investment' (actually spending of course) and now the crash, thanks to Clown.

Britain is the same as near bankrupt corner shop where every penny earned already goes to pay the loans, and the money coming in keeps falling.

IMF here we come!

dopester

Graham_Devon wrote: »

A 45% decrease in sales means unemployment for some of those people employed by General Motors.

It also interferes with other businesses and the entire rebalancing involved with the necessary bust.

There may be emerging competitors and beneficial structural changes (in the long run). Labour and all government should stay the hell out. New ways of doing things, emerging new parts of the economy which should be nurtured rather than spending so much on old world stuff which already has worldwide overcapacity, surplus and lots of competition.

Also businesses picking up assets from others and restructuring them to new profitable use. Instead you'd rather try desperately to throw money at saving the old boom ways.

You know.. do you remember anything about private enterprise? Stuff which doesn't rely on public spending money. Where people get ahead with what they know and what they can do? Rather than relying entirely on what the state can do for you. The sick effects of a Labour government now seeing everyone turn to them.. what can nanny state do for me?

I've got to laugh about those fretting about cutting back public spending. It grew to ridiculous levels under Labour... not saving in the good years, just spend it and borrow more. Rebalacing is required with public spending no matter if you think it will cause jobs which rely on it to be shed.

worldtraveller

amcluesent wrote: »

But now Town Clerks can command £250,000 salaries and go at 50 with a pension pot worth £1M!

If town clerks were on £250,000 salaries, which I somehow doubt :rolleyes: , their "pension pot" would actually be worth nearer £4M.

Mind you, a quick Google tells me that Hereford City Council offered around £40,000 per annum for theirs, so, based on a full civil service career, they could expect to have a "pension pot" worth around £600,000 if retiring today. Not bad for a personal contribution rate of maybe 1.5% of salary. :xmassign:

leveller2911

Oh come on you lot, get a grip.

We can't be in that much doo-doo as our net contribution to the EU next year will rise from around £4.7 billion to £6.5 billion .We must be rolling in dosh ,or else why are we giving more money????



One of our prospective parliamentary candidates in the area, Conservative Amber Rudd has brought a house in Hastings....theres commitment for you.............

Oh she,s said she is "keeping her pad in Earls court ,just in case".................they don't change do they? and she hasn't even got in yet....:rolleyes:

CLAPTON

Graham_Devon wrote: »

By artificial I mean just what I said. Changing legislation which means people have to go on a course to keep their beneifts. The trainers are then needed to provide those courses.

To anyone else not on beneifts, the courses are discouraged through very high costs. I'm sure we have all had local training course leaflets, some of the courses costing in excess of £200 if you are not on benefits, £5 refundable if you are.

Also, grants to companies to take on staff they don't really need, but if they take them on, they will get a bonus sum of money from us lot.

The thing with stimulus is it can create a growing economy, as seen in america, who are now in growth. However, just after the growth starts, they start taking away the stimulus.

General Motors see a 45% decline in sales because stimulus has ended.

A 45% decrease in sales means unemployment for some of those people employed by General Motors.

So, they have hung on to their jobs for a year while stimulus is in play, only to find themselves unemployed when stimulus is cut. Now calls for more stimulus to keep those same people in jobs. So, lets say they do offer more stimulus, car sales go up, few people keep their jobs. Then stimulus has to be cut later....back to sqaure one.

The economy has alwys been managed either to stimulate the economy or to damp it down (well by always I mean since about mid 1930s ).
Whats different this time is the massvie scale of QE compared to previous times.
Personally I think the UK way of stimulus, largely based on QE is more likely to have a longer lasting effect than the industry targeting like in the US and Germany.
The purpose of the stimilus is precisely to allow 'natural' growth to take over from the artificial bit without causing a long lasting depression.
I would suspect that the cost of the training schemes were peanuts in relation to the other QE costs and was largely the typical gesture politics as it looks as if the government is doing something.

vivatifosi

Don't know if anyone else picked up from a story from Fri/Sat (it only made the Mail), but Darling has admitted that the "environmental tax" that he has levied on airlines from today is actually nothing of the sort, and is aimed at paying for the bailed out banks. Nothing like kicking an industry when its down:

As Alistair Darling acknowledged in Newcastle this week, the airline industry and travellers are being penalised to help pay for the enormous cost of rescuing rotten banks. 'We need to raise money to pay for some of things we have done ... Northern Rock has cost a lot of money.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/article-1224195/COMMENT-ALEX-BRUMMER-Rocky-flight-green-taxes.html

The sooner this bunch of liars is out on its ear the better.

Afriend_2

vivatifosi wrote: »

Don't know if anyone else picked up from a story from Fri/Sat (it only made the Mail), but Darling has admitted that the "environmental tax" that he has levied on airlines from today is actually nothing of the sort, and is aimed at paying for the bailed out banks. Nothing like kicking an industry when its down:

As Alistair Darling acknowledged in Newcastle this week, the airline industry and travellers are being penalised to help pay for the enormous cost of rescuing rotten banks. 'We need to raise money to pay for some of things we have done ... Northern Rock has cost a lot of money.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/article-1224195/COMMENT-ALEX-BRUMMER-Rocky-flight-green-taxes.html

The sooner this bunch of liars is out on its ear the better.

To be replaced by another bunch of liars..
Labour can't govern, Tories favour the rich, we are all screwed..

Mr_Mumble

An interesting report by HSBC’s Karen Ward last week pointed out that a number of the assumptions built into that £175bn deficit projection (low share prices, high unemployment) now look overly pessimistic, and that, in fact, the government could undershoot this by a significant amount, perhaps “only” borrowing £153bn.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/edmundconway/100001403/britains-secret-weapon-against-a-fiscal-crisis/

Gordon & Alistair could use the 'lower' deficit this year to promise a splurge. But, the Treasury's £175bn deficit announced in the budget was intentionally conservative as to plan for the worst case scenario. It would be perverse for Brown to use the Treasury's wise planning as an excuse to continue on his spendthrift way.

MiserlyMartin

leveller2911 wrote: »

Oh come on you lot, get a grip.

We can't be in that much doo-doo as our net contribution to the EU next year will rise from around £4.7 billion to £6.5 billion .We must be rolling in dosh ,or else why are we giving more money????

Has this got anything to do with Blair throwing away Maggies EU rebate she won us, or is that factored in already in your figures? If not then its just the EU crippling us at the worst time imaginable.