Online banking fraud due to rogues using cashback sites (my experiences)

Tara100

Hi all.

I 'm just posting to let you know my experiences regarding the above title.

On checking my online bank statement a couple of weeks ago, I spotted a new direct debit which I knew nothing about; this was for Virgin Money Home Insurance.
I called Virgin, and was told that someone living in a different county to me, had set up a DD using my bank account number. I asked how this could happen, as Barclays should have spotted that my account name, and that of the person setting up the DD didn't match. The reply was that as online DD requests are automated, there could have just been an account number error, and not to worry. Hmmmm.
Virgin refused to pay me back the £18.62 taken, and I had to go round the houses to get Barclays to stand by their 'Direct Debit Guarantee' and I eventually got the money credited back to my account. I was told by the Barclays staff member that a block was put on Virgin Home Insurance, and that they wouldn't be able to take further monies from me. I thought that was the end of that.........

Not so...Today, I see Virgin Home Insurance has taken another £18.62 from my account this month. (Thanks Barclays for not blocking Virgin!)
I was seething and called Virgin again, who put me in touch with RBOS fraud team. I was told by them, that a person living in a different county to me (which I won't name here) had not only set up this DD, but had set up another home insurance DD through Tesco! I had missed this when checking my account, but yes, nearly £28.00 had been taken by Tesco too!
Here's how it's done........In the words of the guy at the fraud team, it's done through cashback sites (I suppose where there's money to be made, there will always be a scammer) and apparantly, they get literally hundreds of calls a week from folks who have these false DD's set up on their accounts. The scammers try random bank account numbers, and eventually like with me, it's bingo and it's worked, hence them setting up a second Tesco DD. (the scammers are clocking up some very decent payouts from the cashback sites)
The guy at the fraud team said that the scammer will now know that their scheme has worked through my account, and that I have to get Barclays to 'put a marker' on my account so that no more DD's can be set up, even by me. He also added that banking fraud teams are working to get cashback sites closed in the future, as the fraud committed through them is large scale.

Anyway, if you are still awake after reading this, the moral of the story is: CHECK EVERY DD ENTRY ON YOUR BANK STATEMENT! and don't trust that your bank checks who is setting up online DD's, as they don't have to; they just need your bank account number.....Crazy but true! (My 'false' DD's were set up by a Mr ********, and my bank account is not a joint account, and I'm female

opinions4u

Thanks for the story.

Sometimes you have to take what a staff member at a bank says with a pinch of salt though:

He also added that banking fraud teams are working to get cashback sites closed in the future, as the fraud committed through them is large scale.

It's a bit like saying "We're trying to get ourselves shut down because we suffer loads of fraud".

Or "We're trying to get Virgin Media shut down because they accepted a fraudulent new customer".

Silly.

Tara100

If you think about it, of course fraud can easily be committed on cashback sites; you simply click on the merchants name (such as Virgin, tesco or whoever) then get directed to their site, make a false purchase (ie, set up a fake order) and bingo, so long as the order is processed (a payment comes out of a bank account) then the cashback, be it £30, £40 or £50 etc is awarded to the scammer. (They can't be very bright to do this, as the whole transaction is traceable, so long as the CB sites co-operate with fraud investigators)
Merchandisers have made blunders by signing up to CB sites, and now fraud bureauxs want to get the cashback sites closed for obvious reasons.

opinions4u
"We're trying to get Virgin Media shut down because they accepted a fraudulent new customer"
No, not at all; the mistakes have now been realised, and now companies want the consumer to buy direct from them rather than on cashback sites where fraud is commonly happening.
Yes, one could argue that the merchants will save money this way, but they will also lose a huge amount of custom by withdrawing 'the lure' of previous cashback offers.

michaels

Not really true - most cash back sites take a while to pay out to prevent users simply signing up for something then cancelling immediately etc so generally I suspect a couple of DDs will have to go through before a cashback payout is made - but with the move to on-line paper free banking I suspect if the DDs are for small amounts then some people might not notice them for a while - especially if they by chance happen to be for suppliers the victim already uses.

Tara100 wrote: »

If you think about it, of course fraud can easily be committed on cashback sites; you simply click on the merchants name (such as Virgin, tesco or whoever) then get directed to their site, make a false purchase (ie, set up a fake order) and bingo, so long as the order is processed (a payment comes out of a bank account) then the cashback, be it £30, £40 or £50 etc is awarded to the scammer. (They can't be very bright to do this, as the whole transaction is traceable, so long as the CB sites co-operate with fraud investigators)
Merchandisers have made blunders by signing up to CB sites, and now fraud bureauxs want to get the cashback sites closed for obvious reasons.

opinions4u
"We're trying to get Virgin Media shut down because they accepted a fraudulent new customer"
No, not at all; the mistakes have now been realised, and now companies want the consumer to buy direct from them rather than on cashback sites where fraud is commonly happening.
Yes, one could argue that the merchants will save money this way, but they will also lose a huge amount of custom by withdrawing 'the lure' of previous cashback offers.

Jeanghost

I was a bit concerned to find fraud is being committed through cashback sites.

I phoned Barcaycard JUST to confirm that I had received my card and the person on the phone 'kept on'and I ended up agreeing to take out id fraud cover. I have not used my credit card for a long time but have not got around to cancelling it. Anyway I changed my mind and decided to cancel the fraud cover as it cost £70 and was through Experian. I was asked several times why I had decided to cancel, I said that I did not have to give a reason.

Anyway there must be better way to take id fraud cover.

My husband and I are both pensioners, our mortgage is paid and we do not intend to take out any loans in the future.

Paul_Varjak

Jeanghost...

I have added ID fraud cover to my home policy. It costs under £16 per year with AXA insurance and, if you make a claim, it does not affect the no claims discount of your contents or building insurance.

Tara100

Hi Jean

Your bank covers you when such things happen (as long as you haven't' given out your banking details to anyone other than trusted merchants)
Barclays paid me back the same day for the 1st frauldulent DD, and after speaking with them today, they assured me that within two working days, the other two payments will be refunded.

Try not to worry; it appears that using the Cashback sites is safe enough, it's the folks out there who happen to guess at our bank account numbers and get them right, that causes the problems.

Tara100

Michaels

I'm sorry, but this isn't true:
Not really true - most cash back sites take a while to pay out to prevent users simply signing up for something then cancelling immediately etc

TopCashBack more often than not, actually track transactions within 2-3 days. I do use their site, and have witnessed this for myself many times.

(In case someone thinks my bank details were accessed there, I'll state now that is impossible, as I am paid into my paypal account, and the only info TCB have is my e-mail address to action my payments)

Paul_Varjak

Tara100...

Interesting but disconcerting to know that the failure to verify name/address/account numbers match also applies to direct debits. It certainly happens on many internet debit/credit transactions as I learned just 3 weeks ago!

I was told by my card issuer that the biggest fraud at the moment is generating the 16 digit card number, expiry date and CVV number. I suspect it may be even easier to generate valid bank account numbers for fraudulent DD transactions.

I have always logged onto my bank accounts each day to check for fraud, but never thought to check for fraudulent DD setups before. At least with a DD, it may well be showing on your account some days before money is actually taken.

One thing you say is that your bank can stop the setup of Direct debits. I know I did once once ask my own bank about this after Tiscali (whose DD I cancelled) then set it up again without my permission! But my bank said it was not possible to stop DDs being set up!

Anyway, because of your experience, I will be even more vigilant in future!

Paul_Varjak

Tara100 wrote: »

Michaels

I'm sorry, but this isn't true:
Not really true - most cash back sites take a while to pay out to prevent users simply signing up for something then cancelling immediately etc

TopCashBack more often than not, actually track transactions within 2-3 days. I do use their site, and have witnessed this for myself many times.

(In case someone thinks my bank details were accessed there, I'll state now that is impossible, as I am paid into my paypal account, and the only info TCB have is my e-mail address to action my payments)

Sorry Tara100, but tracking and paying out are completely different Tracking is just the first of many steps - and may only take a few days. Paying out is the final step and often takes months!

Tara100

Hi Paul

It was the guy at the RBOS Fraud Dept who told me that he had a set up with his NatWest account, so that if he wants to start a new DD, he has to be sent an actual mandate that has to be signed and returned.
I asked Barclays to do the same, and they just went one better and now will refuse all new DD requests. If I want to begin a new one, I have to request that the block is temporarily lifted, and then restarted.

I hope this helps