Unfair redundancy?

mikee31

I would appreciate the forum's help and advice with the following as I am unsure as to whether the matter can be taken further if I wanted to challenge.

At the end of August a number of staff in the company I work for were notified of possible redundancy. In order to try and save certain positions some offers of reduced working hours and salary were put forward.

In order to save some of the more senior technical staff a suggestion by management was that all those in management and senior technical staff positions would take a pay cut and reduce working hours, even those who weren't selected for possible redundancy.

This was agreed by all those concerned and a letter was issued by the company so that those who were to take a pay cut/reduction in hours could sign and return to confirm their agreement within 5 working days. The letter did not state that this was 'in principle' or 'subject to agreement'.

However, before the 5 working days had expired, staff were informed that the agreement offered could no longer happen as the company board had refused it. Therefore, the redundancy procedures were to remain. A letter was then given out to those affected whereby we each found out who was selected for redundancy which was based on a scoring criteria.

Unfortunately for me I am one of the unlucky ones and will shortly have my redundancy formally notified. My gripe however is the turnaround of being offered the chance to retain my position, albeit with a reduced salary/working week, and then having that taken away. Talk about get your hopes up only for them to be cruelly snatched away!

It may just be 'sour grapes' but I am aggrieved at the way we (me, my family, colleagues) have been messed about (to put it lightly!).

Any thoughts on whether this was done fairly? Would there be any grounds for taking it further?

woody01

Although it was poor decision making to make the 'possibility' public, and the timing was poor also, there certainly isn't from what you have told us, anything unfair or requiring legal intervention.

McKneff

Sorry you lost your job, but as woody01 says there really isnt anything you can do. I hope you find work soon.

money_money_6

Sorry to hear about your situation.

Sometimes I wish company's should be more sensitive in what they say versus what they do.

I've experienced something similar whereby the company I was with said that despite the economy they were still giving out bonuses. Then the following week they started to lay people off. Wierd.

Anyway, just wanted to say that you're not the only one that has been slightly misled and I totally understand your emotional roller-coaster.

Hope you find work soon

jazzyman01

Have they given a reason? Consultation regarding redundancy is about discussing alternatives to redundancy. This you did and had it agreed with the people running the consultation.
They must give a reason why it is being rejected after all, your solution saved them money but retained the skills.

mikee31

jazzyman01 wrote: »

Have they given a reason? Consultation regarding redundancy is about discussing alternatives to redundancy. This you did and had it agreed with the people running the consultation.
They must give a reason why it is being rejected after all, your solution saved them money but retained the skills.

Only in that the 'board' did not feel that it was a viable solution in the long term, preferring to make the redundancies as a more permanent solution.

However, as you say the offer would have helped to retain the skills (which would be benficial in the event of work picking up) and would have presumably been an almost immediate cost saving as oppose to paying out for notice periods, redundancy payouts, unused holiday, etc.

Thanks for everyones advice and support.

al_hunter

I too may have a problem with regards unfair redundancy.

On Tuesday 8th September all employees of the company I work for were sent a memo discussing a proposed 10% pay cut and the possibility of redundancy - not to any specific parties it should be noted, this was sent to everyone in the company. It was stated that it would be optional and a further agreement would be issued. On 14th September the agreement was issued. I was sent a letter by post on 14th September stating "If as a result of that review compulsory redundancies are required, those affected will be
individually advised by Friday 25th September" - so again, not specific to any persons involved.


I had no further communications with the company with regards my potential redundancy. On Monday 21st September I was taken ill with food poisoning and subsequently was off sick until I returned to work on Friday 25th September. At approx. 1.30pm I was called into our Commercial Directors office and told I would be made redundant and asked to work my four weeks notice with a view to leaving the company on Friday 23rd October.


Doing some brief research on the internet it seems there should be a notice period and consultations - is this correct? Can anyone clarify on the legal position and whether I have any claim against the organisation I am currently employed by? Could it be claimed that the letter sent on 14th September was my notice of redundancy, even though it was also issued by email to every employee of the organisation?


FYI, I've only worked for the company as such since Jan 1st but was transferred under TUPE employment law twice before then so my contract dates back to 8th August 2005.

If anyone can help it would be greatly appreciated. This has come at the worst possible time for me - I'm 3 months into a 30 year mortgage and will finish work one week before my 25th birthday. I also work in the construction industry so finding new employment is doubly hard.

jazzyman01

Al - you need to give more information. Were you the only person affected? Were you the only person doing that particular role? What will happen to your tasks/duties?

Where less than 20 posts to me made redundant there is no legal timeline for consultation. However, that said it needs to be "meaningful". What has happened to you does not follow that requirement. You should have been placed at risk and had consultation meetings with the opportunity of having a representative with you at the meetings.

They may well try and state that as they issued a letter saying pay cut/possible redundancy is complying with the legal requirements. It does not.

If redundant then you would be entitled to max 4 weeks redundancy pay (any service under the age of 21 is 1/2 weeks pay). Given your age you may only get 3.5 weeks. If statutory this will be capped at £380 per week. This payment would be tax free. Any outstanding holiday pay would also be owed but is taxable.

al_hunter

jazzyman01 wrote: »

Al - you need to give more information. Were you the only person affected? Were you the only person doing that particular role? What will happen to your tasks/duties?

Where less than 20 posts to me made redundant there is no legal timeline for consultation. However, that said it needs to be "meaningful". What has happened to you does not follow that requirement. You should have been placed at risk and had consultation meetings with the opportunity of having a representative with you at the meetings.

They may well try and state that as they issued a letter saying pay cut/possible redundancy is complying with the legal requirements. It does not.

If redundant then you would be entitled to max 4 weeks redundancy pay (any service under the age of 21 is 1/2 weeks pay). Given your age you may only get 3.5 weeks. If statutory this will be capped at £380 per week. This payment would be tax free. Any outstanding holiday pay would also be owed but is taxable.

Thanks for the quick response JazzyMan - no, I wasn't the only one affected in the company. I don't know exact numbers, but I would guess there are more than 20 made redundant - I know of at least 6 or 7 others, but will try to find out exactly how many were made redundant this afternoon.

I have been asked to work a 4 week notice period to 23rd October and have been told I will receive in the region of £1,140.00 redundancy payout, which looks about in line with the "one weeks pay for every working year" i.e. 4 years from 8th August 2005. One of my biggest problems is that I currently have a company car. If I don't get a job by 23rd October I'm going to struggle to get to any interviews.

I should also note there are about 12 of us in the company who do the same thing - Quantity Surveyors. As far as I'm aware, none of us have received any kind of formal warning of redundancy amongst the quantity surveyors - the general opinion at the back end of the week ending 18th September was that if you hadn't been spoken to about redundancy you were safe. That was the feeling in the office.

al_hunter

Can anyone help on this? Is it worth seeking some legal advice?

Having done some further research, more than 20 in the organisation have been made redundant. Can anyone clarify if there is a difference between voluntary redundancy and compulsory and also whether weekly paid operatives would be viewed differently to salaried office staff?

As far as I'm aware two other quantity surveyors have been made redundant. Unfortunately I've not been told "officially" that they've been made redundant and I don't know either well enough to approach to ask if they've been consulted or forewarned of this in some way, but I have a feeling they won't have been - just as I wasn't. Does anyone think I have grounds for a claim?

Just to clarify the points quickly:

I've been offered £1,140.00 (3 x £380.00) for 4 years work (Aug 05 - Oct 09, however I was under 21 until 30/10/05)

I wasn't consulted or forewarned I was at risk of redundancy - the last communication I had with the company prior to being made redundant was an internal memo sent round asking employees to sign an agreement to a 10% pay cut and ask for any voluntary redundancies (memo was issued on 14/9 asking for voluntary to be submitted by 18/9) and mentioning that those who were to be made redundant would be notified by 25/9 but specifically noting that each of us would be consulted separately

There are more than 20 of us in the organisation being made redundant, but only 3 in my particular profession.

getmore4less

Talk to ACAS, the company is not following the proper process.

20+ they need to do 30days(allthough this can be shorter with agreement) group consultations.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/RedundancyAndLeavingYourJob/Redundancy/DG_10029835
take note of protective orders and
the need for the employer to notify

You count service backwards from the leaving date

If 3 from your "pool" of 12 are being made redundant there should be selection criterea and scoring to select those to be made redundant and this should be part of te consultation.