Tenancy agreement lost by tenant and letting agent in administration

StefanM

Hi. I'd really appreciate if anyone could help with this scenario: what is the position where a tenant has lost their copy of a tenancy agreement and the letting agent that issued the contract has gone into administration taking with it any trace of the contract?

Basically a new letting agent is now in place, but has no way of checking if the tenant is taking advantage of the situation by moving in a partner to their room and saying that it was part of their tenancy agreement - there are other provisions being claimed as well but if there is no tenancy agreement that can be shown from either side - what rights does the landlord have? Are they able to force the tenant to produce the contract, which they claim has been lost?

Basically this situation is effecting (and affecting!) other tenants in the property but at present there is no obvious solution.

Any advice graciously received!

Jowo_2

How long has the tenant been in the property?

It's fairly normal for tenants to want a partner to move in, either by changing the tenancy to a joint one or simply letting them occupy while the tenancy is in the original tenant's sole name. What's the problem in this case - is it because its a shared property rather than self-contained and the other tenant's resent the unwanted guest?

Is the tenant claiming it is a joint tenancy with the girlfriend or is he claiming he has permission for them to move in but the lost document is just in his sole name?

theartfullodger

Stefan:

You say agent has taken their copy of contract - did you (I assume you are Landlord??) have your copy of the tenancy?? If so & it is signed etc that should be sufficient...

However, moving forward... a couple of things... Tenancy agreements don't have to be written and it is usually accepted (by courts..) that if there is evidence of "occupation" (mail sent/received,, other documents such as inventory signed..) and payment, particularly regular (eg £450/month every 7th of month into your bank account from a particular source,... or receipts given) and fair evidence of a start date (eg someone else there up to mm/20yy...) then there is a tenancy... but what the terms are is unclear...

If you are the LL I suggest you offer the tenant a new agreement on the same terms (as far as you know) as the current deal & hope he signs - in fact maybe offer him a discount to get things all legal, signed-off, and very clear..).

Cheers!

Lodger

StefanM

The landlord believes that all rooms should have been let on a single occupancy basis (this is the basis that all other tenants have moved in on) but the previous letting agency may have mistakenly let it to them as a couple. Basically the claim is that the tenancy agreement allows them both to live there - I assume on a joint tenancy agreement, but there is obviously no proof of that being the arrangement. The landlord's new agent didn't even know there was a couple living there - or that they had a car (only 1 parking space available) - until informed by new tenants for other rooms who had been told that all rooms were single occupancy and that the drive was available to them. Tenant X however claims that they have sole use of the drive as part of this phantom tenancy agreement also.

My understanding is that the tenant has been there for over a year but there are no other tenants that have lived there long enough to confirm how long the "guest" has been resident.

Basically if neither side can prove the provisions set out in the original tenancy agreement, what is the default position?

I am not the landlord: I am one of the effected tenants.

Jowo_2

If you are a tenant that is affected by the poor behaviour of another tenant (in this case, moving in another person and hogging the car parking), then have you considered speaking with the other tenants and jointly approach the agency to ask them to serve him notice on the 'if he stays, we go basis' to spur them into action.

I believe, though hopefully this can be confirmed by others, then in the absence of a tenancy agreement, due to the length of time the tenant has been there, he holds a periodic tenancy agreement which means the landlord can serve 2 months notice on the tenant, timed to expire with the rental period. If he doesn't leave then, they have to go to court and get a possession order, and if he still doesn't go, they have to send in the bailiffs. Depending on his tenacity, it will be between 2 and 6 months to get him out.

Then the agents better hope that he doesn't magic up a fixed term agreement that is set to expire significantly in the future that would give him security of tenure in that period.

Fire_Fox

When my letting agent went into administration I was able to access the complete file for my property through the receivers. Can't you do this?

StefanM

There is an unfortunate situation within all of this in that I'm sure the landlord would love to have all single occupancy rooms but I'm fairly certain Tenant X is paying more than other tenants given that they moved in during a period where rental prices were much higher.

2 tenants have moved out in the past solely because of Tenant X but even with making that point and stating to the landlord that collectively we are unhappy with the situation, the LL wants to clarify the contractual situation as if X's tenancy is indeed a single occupancy agreement he can turf out the "guest" without any problems.

Unfortunately I also don't think I could get the other tenants to join an "if he stays, we go" approach as they are a lot more laissez faire as regards the situation. Personally I will be long gone in 3 months (when my minimum tenancy is up) should X still be in the property with his guest.

Basically things are cramped as they are - 6 bedrooms - so it doesn't help when people have permanent guests that they can't even prove have the right to live there!

Fire Fox: the new agent has said they've been unable to get a copy of the agreement from the receivers (perhaps symptomatic of why the agency went under in the first place).

Jowo_2

Sounds like the situation will persist and you would be better off moving somewhere else, particularly given the apathy of the other tenants.

The chances of the tenant turfing out their partner if they are defined as a guest is minimal - who on earth will voluntarily chuck out a girlfriend and double their household expenses?

Have you checked whether the property requires a HMO licence? It's only mandatory for properties of 5+ tenants composed of 2+ unrelated households where there is 3 habitable storeys but some local councils have brought in additional selective licensing.

StefanM

The tenancy agreement I signed specifically states that the tenants will not allow the property to become classed as an HMO. In terms of those criteria though it sounds like X is highly likely to cause the property to classed as an HMO (rooms are split across 3 floors, 7 tenants should the final room be filled and X + guest basically treat the ground floor like a ground floor flat - they have their own phone line, broadband + sky tv separate to the rest of the house, which in turn means we would need planning permission for a 2nd dish to serve the rest of the house).

I assume the house being classed as an HMO attracts more tax liabilities or more responsibilities for the LL?

Fire_Fox

StefanM wrote: »

Fire Fox: the new agent has said they've been unable to get a copy of the agreement from the receivers (perhaps symptomatic of why the agency went under in the first place).

I said can't the landlord get a copy of the tenancy agreement NOT the new letting agent. It may well be that the receivers will not release the documentation to just anyone for reasons of confidentiality.

StefanM

Sorry, that was me not being clear. The new "agent" works directly for the new LL and the LL is unable to get a copy from the receivers. Seems they won't release any paper work for quite some time yet as they are investigating something or other...