Money Moral Dilemma: Would you park free if it blocked wheelchair access?

kmcc666

Yes,
every car park and town centre has dedicated spaces for disabled drivers that should not be used by fit and healthy drivers anyway.

fingerspinner

Well I would have gone to the car park until a few weeks ago when, having done just that, I was walking past the vehicle with sign in the back only to see a very fit and healthy 30-35 year old jog up to it and get in.

When I challenged him he replied that it was his father who used the wheelchair but that he didn't get out very often nowadays. "But I can't take the sign down every time I come out, can I?" With that he drove off.

A case of one spoiling it for the many, or indicative of the increasing misuse of disabled signs? Judging by the number of extremely fit people parking in the disabled bays at my local ASDA, I think it's probably the latter.

Anyway I won't be parking elsewhere in future.

simmy600

I've not read all 17 pages of replies so I hope that I'm not repeating someone else.
The parking space is a free one not disabled so there is no legal problem with parking there.
The type of vehicle is not mentioned and so is open to debate. If it has a ramp inside that needs the space to open out and still give room to gain access with the disabled person in the wheel chair, then no-one would park so close.
Disabled people who drive usually need space at the side of their vehicle so they have room to get into the driving seat and then store their chair.
I have seen many people wheel themselves to the car, jump out of the chair, pick the chair off the ground loading it into the car and walk to the driver seat and get in. Some have a winch in the back to aid loading of the chair.
My advice is look at the type of vehicle and make an educated guess as to the ability of the driver.
My vehicle needs 3m of room behind it to load people onto it and if some awkward driver parked too close behind me they would suffer the consequences. But, this work vehicle is bright yellow with flashing blue lights and people tend to move out of the way without being asked!
Thank you.

SusanC_2

tara747 wrote: »

Thanks for the post, I hadn't realised about these buggy-seat combos (technology eh?).

Are the parent and child spaces wider where you live then? Here, they're all the same width as normal space, just closer to the store. So you would probably find it difficult to manoeuvre the car seat anyway.

If I had a child and a car seat and needed space either side of the car, I'd probably park further away as it's unlikely that there'd be anyone beside me! :rotfl:

I know you weren't addressing me but I'll answer anyway. Size of parent and child spaces varies from establishment to establishment. Where I am Tesco and Sainsbury's have extra wide one (Tesco has some near the entrance and some quite a way away, Sainsbury's they are all close to the entrance), Asda don't but they are placed so you don't have to cross any roads (and are further from the door) and Lidl are regular size but right by the door (so IMO copletely pointless). I don't use them at Asda because wherever you park there are zebra crossings so since they're not wide there's no point and I park further away or by a space where the car door opens onto the walkway (rather than the road) at Lidl. Parking further away does not always guarantee you'll have space and in my case the worst culprit was actually someone else with children.

Stampede_2

Bionic wrote: »

On a separate note is it illegal to park in a disabled space on private land eg a supermarket carpark or just inconsiderate?
I block them in, leave a camcorder in my car facing their car if Im in a hurry or just sit nearby when Im not.

Sadly not illegal under the law of the land - but I believe that penalties can be imposed by the land owner if they wish in the same way that they can issue fines for unauthorised parking?[/QUOTE]

To try and help: No it is not illegal if it is private land, such as a supermarket and no a private land owner can not fine you for unauthorised or in correct parking. What it amounts to are the contractural terms which you agree to when you enter the private land, and a breach of contract if you park other than how they say you can. The private land owner in effect claims that the breach and their 'losses' can be remidied if you pay the so called 'fine'. Whilst the supermarket can access the DVLC to find out the registered owner they have no right to demand you disclosed who the driver is or reply to them. You are perfectly entitled to ignore their penalty notices and call their bluff to see if they really want to take a County Court action for damages against you. Because of the legal niceties about what lawyers call the 'battle of the forms' and 'offers' and 'counter offers' you are starting to see more notices about the contract you supposedly enter into at the entrances to private car parks eg hospital and supermarkets.

Bionic

fingerspinner wrote: »

Well I would have gone to the car park until a few weeks ago when, having done just that, I was walking past the vehicle with sign in the back only to see a very fit and healthy 30-35 year old jog up to it and get in.

When I challenged him he replied that it was his father who used the wheelchair but that he didn't get out very often nowadays. "But I can't take the sign down every time I come out, can I?" With that he drove off.

A case of one spoiling it for the many, or indicative of the increasing misuse of disabled signs? Judging by the number of extremely fit people parking in the disabled bays at my local ASDA, I think it's probably the latter.

Anyway I won't be parking elsewhere in future.

So its not necessarily the disabled driver who's being inconsiderate then?

chriswatts

stevie_boy wrote: »

yes i would have you seen all the disabled badges where they can run a marathon when they get out of the car

There are rare illnesses that prevent people from standing still and getting out of cars but once their moving permit them to walk normally and thus they still need the disabled parking.

Although personally I'd like to see people have to be referred to a physiotherapist instead of a panel to judge their need for a blue badge as it seems in some cases when you reach retirement age with some doctors you get one automatically! Although in the case mentioned unless the person with the sticker is Andy from Little Britain I don't think it applies here!

Bionic

chriswatts wrote: »

There are rare illnesses that prevent people from standing still and getting out of cars but once their moving permit them to walk normally and thus they still need the disabled parking.

Although personally I'd like to see people have to be referred to a physiotherapist instead of a panel to judge their need for a blue badge as it seems in some cases when you reach retirement age with some doctors you get one automatically! Although in the case mentioned unless the person with the sticker is Andy from Little Britain I don't think it applies here!

Good point Chris - however having worked in several fields concerning 'assessment' I have reservations regarding the ability of one person or profession to make a 'REAL LIFE' assessment. I can remember being assessed by a single GP when I was 16 (in two calipers and using crutches). After falling up the 4 trial steps and tripping several times over his carpet I was informed that I was 'not disabled enough!' to qualify for £5 a year help with 'getting around!'

It is completely true that some disabled people can walk/stagger 50 yards - however their perspiration, aspiration and sheer fatigue of doing it bear no comparison to someone who we would refer to as a fit able-bodied person. The same consideration applies to many elderly people as well.

I am not wildly adrift when I say that there are figures taken from gait analysis and treadmill assessment demonstrating for example that a single leg amputee can expend as much as 40-50% more energy/effort to cover the same ground as an AB and calipered polios as much as 70%.

By now of course they are quite possibly 'uncomfortably wet' as well as breathing heavily - not to mention the possible damage to stump skin and strapped legs.

For these and other reasons too numerous to mention here I believe that assessments should be based on 'real life' situations such as working, shopping, leisure etc and not a hurried half hour in a surgery or gym although the latter could be an essential part of critical assessment. Especially in weeding out the con men.

Occasionally, the assessee may be in the fortunate position of having an Occupational Therapist in on the examination. OT's are far more concerned with adapting people to daily life after illness/injury and are qualified to assess needs against the 'big picture'. (No I am not an OT.)

Obviously my comments will seem limited to some physical disabilities but as you rightly say there are many people out there whose disability we don't have a clue about and they are probably the ones who receive greatest criticism on the assumption that there can't be anything wrong with them if they are seen walking.

joansheng

I am disabled and a wheelchair user. Someone parking across the back of my car would leave me stuck until they returned. I have a powered hoist in my boot to get the wheelchair in and out and the boom needs to swing out to do so. I manage on my own and am usually alone.

Can I make a plea that unless you are disabled that you don't park in disabled bays? I am in constant pain and can only walk very short distances. It may be easy for the able bodied to say "I'm just running in for my paper, lottery ticket, etc." But what they are really saying is "I'm a selfish P**** who doesn't give a **** that you will have to walk a good deal further in severe pain." Please, please don't do it.

Rant over

Magic-Ian

spaggit wrote: »

i am usually quite reserved bout these kind of issue's however disabled people do get right up my nose,:cool:

Lets hope that you never becone disabled. I think I now know where I would like to park, and it aint in a disabled bay.:mad: