Martins View On Using Mortgage Brokers...

sarahwebb79

I have been an Independent Mortgage Adviser for almost a year and worked for high street lenders for the past 6 years. Your right as far as direct deals are concerned as ive told a fair few clients recently that they were better off going direct..yes i know i wont get any commission but it is often best advice..I also get a lot of clients that want my help as cant be bothered to go looking around but in all fairness the network i belong to check our mortgage files and research often to make sure it is best advise. I do appreciate though that everyone has different opinions on the subject and it will always be a talking point

Tom_Kelly

I don't understand the comments from brokers that their clients can get better deals by going direct to lenders. Surely this isn’t true.

There was a period during the summer (remember that?) where lenders were offering lower headline rates but they were only available ‘over the counter’. This was the lenders attempt to regain the market share from brokers. This failed and in the main they revised their strategy. Lenders boardrooms despise brokers and want to go back to the days when they could charge what they wanted without worrying about nasty words like competitiveness.

However, those customers that went direct did not receive any advice on the products sold by the lenders and will not receive ongoing advice on the continued suitability and competitiveness of their mortgage and its associated by-products.

Statistics in 2007 showed that over 60% of the market used brokers and less than 40% went direct to lenders. I daresay most of the 60% valued their relationship with their broker and the other 40% felt that they could do things better themselves.

So stop worrying about the 40% who don’t appreciate what you do and the value that you bring and just concentrate upon looking after the 60%. I am sure that this is enough customers to keep good brokers busy for many years to come

mic200202

I have still seen some examples of dual pricing going on until very recently.Mostly, those type of clients who benefit are the 'perfect ones' who come in 3 payslips each,P60's no adverse,perfect credit history and big LTV's.These clients are few and far between as far as I can see. Had a client not too long ago who wanted a FADV with Nationwide.Husband is sub contractor.Nationwide took about 3mins to deck it through their direct line.I was able to place the case with Nationwide via the intermediaries route (but with a higher rate!!) since I knew the underwriting process and how to make sure the case was presented correctly (they treat sub contractors as employed) and get proof of income sorted.

I really don't think its possible for a mortgage to be non advised in todays market.

Wouldn't it be great if a client needed to get a cert to say they had been assessed by an independent broker before they applied for a mortgage (just the same as a property needs surveyed), for a small fee of course (!!) TCF in its most perfect form!!

dbarnes

magburner wrote: »

Rubbish!

People get better deals nowadays going direct to the lender:T

This may be true since the lender doesnt have to pay the broker a fee but I still think there is a place for brokers as many people dont have the time to go direct or to study the charts on money saving websites.

koexelek

Tom_Kelly wrote: »

So stop worrying about the 40% who don’t appreciate what you do and the value that you bring and just concentrate upon looking after the 60%. I am sure that this is enough customers to keep good brokers busy for many years to come

Sensible words Tom.

That is the philosophy I take.
You can't please all the people all the time

dunstonh

The figure for first time buyers using brokers was reported to be in excess of 80%. For FTBs the advantage of using a broker is knowledge and hand holding. At the moment the deals may not be the absolute best but they are not far off and getting the right type of deal and the service is important to more people than the minority that use the internet and know what they are doing.

rufus_t

Wow, where to start?

I guess by declaring my status. I've worked in financial services for around 12 years, largely in regulated advisory positions.

I have a list of qualifications 99% of IFA's and mortgage advisors won't have (I state this not to show off, but to say that I know what I'm talking about).

I'm currently working as a mortgage broker in the non regulated side of the business - i.e. BTL and commercial mortgages. This means whilst I have the knowledge, I'm NOT authorised to give advice on mortgages or other aspects of the financial services market and I cannot advise on residential mortgages.

I also charge a fee. I'll leave that debate for another time, but I'm comfortable with being paid for providing a good service.

Ok, now I've got that out of the way.

I am a regular with MSE on other boards and have only just stumbled across this thread and ended up spending the last couple of hours reading all the posts.

I'm a little saddened but not suprised by the contempt in which many people hold the professionals who work in my industry. Like any industry ours has its fair share of the good; bad and the ugly. It seems to me though that most of those who post on here - at least the ones that stick around - are adhering to the wider ethos of MSE and offering to help. It would be nice if this was remembered, and it went back to this premise, rather than continually doubting the motives of those who are providing assistance in an area that is for most of us the highest value purchase we will ever make. So if you've got a query, post it on here and I'm pretty sure you'll get a professional response without it costing you money.

Also for what its worth I don't see the problem in using the professional services of those who post on here, but my suggestions would be:

1. Choose someone with a long history of posting on this board - this shows that they are here to help and not just spamming for business.
2. If you get good service, say so. If you get poor service, say so. Word of mouth is still the best policeman in the business.
3. Bottom line, same as any business, do business with those who you can relate to and once you find an advisor you are comfortable with, stay with them.

cecmfs

What everyone looking for advice on this site has to remember is that it is not advice. Unless you have spoken directly with an Adviser, and had a terms of business and IDD/CIDD/Menu from the Adviser, this whole site if coffee house rumour. I have seen posts on this site that are clearly there to either con my fellow advisers (you'll note how I don'tuse the word broker as I give advice) or conspire to commit mortgage fraud with a lender.

Not that I wish to be shunned and thrown out of the cave, we charge fees. There I've said it. We are a small directly authorised IFA, I am the only mortgage adviser, we charge fees whether it is a purchase or remortgage.

We do not hard sell on any insurance products, although we recommend on all types from Life to CIC, PHI to ASU (not singly premium), we quote and discuss professionally. We are whole of market.

We quote professionaly on B&C as well, whole of market again.

I'm proud of the firm I'm with and the work we do for our clients. Our offices are filled with thank you cards from delighted customers. We have never had a complaiont upheld against for us one reason, we do things properly. Yes there are cowboys out there, but they are only cowboys because they are allowed to be by consumers and regulators.

When posters on this site go to a lawyer, they expect to pay, same with accountants, surveyors, architects, consultants etc because they are providing a professional service. Why should IFA's be any different, we sit exams, and have to maintain a rigorous CPD. We provide reports to the client of a far more professional qaulity than I have seen lately from a solicitor lately.

We are professionals, and the sooner posters realise this, the better. The IFA community is sick and tired of being blamed for hard selling etc. What you have to realise is that Martin Lewis is not god. A good journalist - yes, not not an adviser. Good for free vouchers and 0% finance, not a 75% BTL over a shop built 4 years ago with a sitting tenant.

Most of the people giving their "wisdom" on here should stop as they are misleading those who are most in need of our help. In point of fact, now is the time when you need us more, as the products themselves are more complicated. Of course you could always go into a bank, or Topshop as they should now be called as they are basically just shops now, and get truly ripped off by needy salespeople who are only desparate for points for their target for the month, whose only philosophy is to throw as much crap business at the wall and see what sticks to it. They are who you should be moaning about. Not honest hard workiong professionals, who have a conscience. I have actually told clients they would be better direct, but they wanted me to handle it so were prepared for a marginally higher rate.

Then again, as most of you are bandwagon jumpers, loyalty will not be in your spell checker. Rant over.

rufus_t

Cecmfs

Some interesting points and SOME fair ones, but far more sweeping generalisations.

If you are going to throw stones, then name names; cite the posts that you say are, "clearly there to either con my fellow advisers....... or conspire to commit mortgage fraud with a lender."

Sweeping generalisations and wild accusations - back this up or shut up. If you are proclaiming yourself as the last honest ADVISER on the planet, which seems the case, then out the offenders - or you could just continue to rant.

Oh, and just because it is not advice, much of the information contained here is factual and helpful information. I believe most people go to great lengths to point out that they are not offering advice but rather are providing information.

Lastly, you seem to think that 'broker' is a dirty word. Broker's also offer a professional service and need to have the same level of knowledge as an adviser to do the job correctly. I have a great deal of respect for many financial advisers, but my 7 year old can hand over a business card and read an IDD, and if this is what you think is the most important requirement of being an adviser, I think you should start by examining yourself before attacking those who have been offering help on this board for a long time before you turned up.

cecmfs

Rufus,
"If you are going to throw stones, then name names; cite the posts that you say are, "clearly there to either con my fellow advisers....... or conspire to commit mortgage fraud with a lender." There are numerous post on the site, but I will back up with exact usernames if that is what is required, stating go see a broker then go direct to the lender. There was also one 2/3 weeks back with a FTB with a 20% deposit who a retired adviser or broker told to get a BTL on, again when i have time i will search through the forum for this (is it just me or it always slow?).
As far as topshop banks go, how about a client in a Halifax branch tellign the adviser that she wasn't going to live in the property and rent it out, which they couldn't do. Client wasn't referred, even to BOFS or BM, but done anyway. Or clients, both young teachers, forced into ASU by an RBS staff member. I don't know about the rest of the UK, but teachers in Scotland get 6 months full pay, and 6 months half, they have little need for ASU, but this was never brought to their attention.

I am not against the term broker, technically I am one as I only do mortgages whereas 4 other advisers in the firm handle the other sectors. I have always preferred to view our fraterntity as advisers, as most would associate brokers with small car insurance and GI brokers, just a personal thing, potatoe potato. I'm pretty sure I am not the only (will we settle for mortgage expert as a middle ground) honest one out there, reading an IDD and explaining the terms of it and TOB to clients satisfaction and understanding are 2 different things. Of course it can just be thrown at the cleint and tell them to read it later, an even younger chimp can do that. When I came back into the industry in 2001, I had to do observed (video taped) interviews, when i learned how to explain TOB etc correctly. I augmented this after M Day by bringing the CIDD into it as well. As I explained to a new start, I know how to explain TOB and CIDD one way, and that is the correct way, with every client.

Strangely enough, we have the same amount of experince in the industry as you, coming back into it 7 years ago, even more weirdly enough I also have a 7 year old daughter!

My post was not meant to upset my fellow brethern, more to make people aware of the real thoughts of qualified and authorised brokers (there I've said it). How factual and helpful the information given on here would be is impossible to gauge, again you and I need to complete a KYC (ours is over 30 pages long) before we can give a recommendation, but "opinions" from other are brought about much speedier - did they have 30 pages of information from the person looking for help. In the future, if the help given on here was not that good, who will be blamed then?

I have been registered for some time, and the few posts I did comment on were thanked. I did want to try and help those who seemed desparate with a nugget here and there, but when posts began about how to screw brokers, I felt that it was unwise to continue offering help to a community that was not grateful for it. I can understand your initial points, but upon clarification, would hope that you and I are singing from the same hymn sheet.