Blow for sickness benefit claimants

carolt

cattie wrote: »

It might be true that they are claiming benefits for these things, but not true that obesity, alchohol or drug addiction problems brings you a higher benefit payout than other sick or disabled people.

I don't think anyone claimed they got a higher payout than "other sick or disabled people". It's the fact that you chose to put "other" in that sentence, as if choosing to eat too much put you in the same category as someone who was blind, say.

There are loads of cures for obesity - of which eating less is by far the simplest and cheapest.

I can see no reason why someone who chooses to spend my money on making themselves unhealthy should be given MORE dole money than someone else who was equally unemployed, but eating a healthy balanced diet.

They should actually get less - to force them to spend less on food.

I disagree that greed is an illness.

geoffky

baileysbattlebus wrote: »

I only know 3 people who don't work because of ill health

One had a major heart problem a few years ago - I don't know what, if anything he receives from the state - he is well provided for by insurance and his medical retirement pension.

The other 2 have MS, one is a girl the same age as my daughter (29), I have known her since she was 7, she has 2 young children - under 5. She was diagnosed at 24 - after the birth of her first child - she probably shouldn't have had the second. She does get money from the state. Some days she is not too bad and able to look after herself and the children and on other days she is bed bound and sometimes hospitalised - there is no way on this earth she could work - or rather no one on this earth would employ her. She would have so much time off it would be untrue - and as time goes on it will get worse. But on a good day she could go and be assessed as fit for work. Where do you draw the line.

The other is a man I have known for about 20 years - he has never worked as long as I have known him. He used to be like my daughters friend, good days and bad days - when he would be able to drive and walk unaided - now it is bad days and worse days. He is occasionally able to walk with sticks - but really is wheelchair bound. He would never pass an assessment for work - unless breathing is the only criteria.

My worry, like DSM is that the wrong people will be targeted. Fraudsters will more than likely be experts at these medicals. Genuine people probably aren't.

ask your daughters friend to look up aspartame on the web ....many ms suffers have found this to be the devil...just a thought..

sallycanwait

geoffky wrote: »

ask your daughters friend to look up aspartame on the web ....many ms suffers have found this to be the devil...just a thought..

Yes i have read this about aspartame to.

Rochdale_Pioneers

There are three classes of Disability claimants:

1. The genuinely unemployable. Long term ill health makes them incapable
2. The potentially employable. Long term medical condition means they can work, but not all the time guaranteed. Could be given a job IF an employer could be found
3. The utterly employable. Ow, my arm I can't work etc

Happily the majority of claimants appear to fall into group 3. We have to be clear that the other two are NOT scroungers and deserve sympathy not loathing.

lostinrates

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

There are three classes of Disability claimants:

1. The genuinely unemployable. Long term ill health makes them incapable
2. The potentially employable. Long term medical condition means they can work, but not all the time guaranteed. Could be given a job IF an employer could be found
3. The utterly employable. Ow, my arm I can't work etc

Happily the majority of claimants appear to fall into group 3. We have to be clear that the other two are NOT scroungers and deserve sympathy not loathing.

I'm being thick (or unemployable) what is the difference between genuinely and utterly?

FWIW: sympathy is free and (almost) boundless....bet, well, yes,sympathy is free.

screamer

Thank you to Rochdale Pineers for clearing this up. I am currently on DLA and Incapacity benefit for, amongst other things, Tonic Clonic Epilepsy, and I have a friend who claims the same as I do, and gets the same as I do to the penny, for depression which she was advised to do by the social services (her childminder reported her for abuse and neglect of her 2 children) She was recently employed full time but lost her job due to gross negligence. She is NOT a single mum, her husband works full time and they claim every benefit under the sun. It's sickening how some people who can work make up every excuse not to and those that can't wish they could. I was distraught when I lost my job and I'm virtually unemployable now. It's about time someone sorted the wasters from the genuinely ill people. I'd rather suffer with depression than have seizures any day of the week. And yes I can say that, I was treated for depresson for 15 years before finally pulling myself together. Until I moved in with my boyfriend I couldn't afford food for myself, this woman spends £10 a week on food for her family of 4 but spends £12 a day on cigarettes!

I feel bad for being a claimant, especially when some days you can't tell I have anything wrong with me, but this woman and every other sponge in this country makes me angry!!!

screamer

lostinrates, do you think my friend (or ex friend rather) is utterly unemployable, or genuinely unemployable? The difference between me and my friend is that I'm down in the dumps because I have a serious illness that affects my quality of life on a daily basis yet my friend's biggest problem is "what do I do, I'm out of fags and the shop is closed!"

That's the difference between utterly unemployable and genuinely!! The utterlies don't want to work and have no pride in themselves, whereas the genuines crave the ability to go out there and earn money to enjoy themselves!!

lostinrates

screamer wrote: »

lostinrates, do you think my friend (or ex friend rather) is utterly unemployable, or genuinely unemployable? The difference between me and my friend is that I'm down in the dumps because I have a serious illness that affects my quality of life on a daily basis yet my friend's biggest problem is "what do I do, I'm out of fags and the shop is closed!"

That's the difference between utterly unemployable and genuinely!! The utterlies don't want to work and have no pride in themselves, whereas the genuines crave the ability to go out there and earn money to enjoy themselves!!

Ah, I see, thank you.

The ''utterlies'' in this (real life) example are only unemployable whilst supported to be so in that case, no?

Fwiw there are people who are ''employable'' who might notbe best suited to themor our society to be working IMO, genuine carers amoung them.

mr.broderick

screamer wrote: »

Thank you to Rochdale Pineers for clearing this up. I am currently on DLA and Incapacity benefit for, amongst other things, Tonic Clonic Epilepsy, and I have a friend who claims the same as I do, and gets the same as I do to the penny, for depression which she was advised to do by the social services (her childminder reported her for abuse and neglect of her 2 children) She was recently employed full time but lost her job due to gross negligence. She is NOT a single mum, her husband works full time and they claim every benefit under the sun. It's sickening how some people who can work make up every excuse not to and those that can't wish they could. I was distraught when I lost my job and I'm virtually unemployable now. It's about time someone sorted the wasters from the genuinely ill people. I'd rather suffer with depression than have seizures any day of the week. And yes I can say that, I was treated for depresson for 15 years before finally pulling myself together. Until I moved in with my boyfriend I couldn't afford food for myself, this woman spends £10 a week on food for her family of 4 but spends £12 a day on cigarettes!

I feel bad for being a claimant, especially when some days you can't tell I have anything wrong with me, but this woman and every other sponge in this country makes me angry!!!

I would have thought that if you had been depressed for 15 years it wouldn't be a case of just pulling yourself together.
I was depressed just a few weeks ago. I stumbled across sky sports news and discovered cristiano ronaldo had signed for real madrid. I suffered a rollercoaster of emotions, depression at him leaving us, excited at what we would do with the £80 million pounds we were going to receive for him and the anger that someone would want to leave my club for non financial reasons.
I actually logged on to mse to take my mind off things and i came across an interesting thread about a chap who had tried to use the 2 for 1 voucher at pizza express. He was a siamese twin and the voucher was refused. My depression lifted.

Rochdale_Pioneers

lostinrates wrote: »

I'm being thick (or unemployable) what is the difference between genuinely and utterly?

FWIW: sympathy is free and (almost) boundless....bet, well, yes,sympathy is free.

I said genuinely unemployable and utterly employable. You can't expect people whose physical/mental condition makes them incapable of work to go and work. At the other end of the spectrum are who appear to be workshy - hiding behind what I'm sure is a genuine - but relatively mild condition. They could work, but have a convenient excuse not to.

I know people at both ends, I know of people in the middle who are potentially employable if someone sympathetic is prepared to use their skills when fit and accept that sometimes they won't be - their health means they are unfit some of the time.

Frankly this subject really hacks me off. If someone wants to sit on their !!!! and scrounge thats bad enough. To go sick and imperil the benefits - and sole incomes - of the genuinely ill who really need it, thats just selfish.