Tenancy query

Dora_the_Explorer_5

If he's 32 then he should be able to take care of himself by now

Hypothetically, a 32 year old is old enough to be both a father and grandfather, and should certainly be mature enough to be responsible for his own life.

Yes, my brother is able bodied and able to work but he has had a few personal problems in the past which I don't want to go into.

He's not unique, many, many people have problems in their past. The point is they are in the past and we all have to live in the present.

I think he expects them to not move and stay to support him financially, which isn't possible or certainly won't be possible for more than a few more years but he doesn't seem to see it that way.

If you truly think this is the case then it appears he is prepared to abuse them financially and emotionally. Something that needs to be taken extremely seriously.

Family dynamics are different for every family. Pragmatically, your parents business is their business - to do with what they like as they are unable to continue in it. Your brother is responsible for sorting out his own accommodation.
If he has been paying £10 all in for everything you mention, he's been taking advantage of his parents.
He should be supporting your parents during this difficult time, not adding to their worries.
Some families carry out their responsibilities to each other in different ways, but it's hard to see what contribution your brother makes. Offer any help you are able to, but the best help you can give him is to make him take responsibility for his own life and perhaps the only way that will happen is if the help you give him is in the form of advice and information.

Noozan

He just plods along and to be honest, he doesn't have it in him to run the business. My parents are not very business minded nor financially savvy and I have to siphon money from their account on a regular basis so that there's money to pay tax bills at intervals through the year. I can only access their personal account online, not the business acount so I can;t see what state it is currentl in but they have been charged a fortune in bank fees from being overdrawn or bills not getting paid on time as they just don't have any idea. They write cheques out of the account when there's insufficient funds because they get a bank statement saying there was £x at x date and can't grasp the idea that funds have been in or out since the date the statement was printed. Every year, I have to sort out paperwork for the accountant (when I'm 600 miles away!) and they are terrible for losing invoices and receipts etc.

Everything my parents own is tied up in the business; it is the only financial security they have so I can't see how they can move but not sell up. They have very little pension provision, so the lump sum from the business will provide them with a little security.

Why oh why can't we just choose our famliy?

Edit: Hm, just reread my post and I mean my parents lose the paperwork, not their accountant!!

lynzpower

I hadnt seen that this is a retirement accomodation. I doubt your brother would EVER be able to live there, given his age.

UNless your brother is able to provide care and provision for them in thier old age & earn enough to keep them, staying on cornwall isnt an option.

BobProperty

I think you have already addressed one of my thoughts, which was that this relative may turn to one of you for support and accommodation.
What does he actually do as far as the business is concerned? Would it be possible to sell the business to someone who would take him on and allow him to continue living in the flat?

Noozan

lynzpower wrote:

I hadnt seen that this is a retirement accomodation. I doubt your brother would EVER be able to live there, given his age.

UNless your brother is able to provide care and provision for them in thier old age & earn enough to keep them, staying on cornwall isnt an option.

Just to clarify, the current house in Cornwall is a 3 bed house suitable for a family; the place they are applying for in Fife is retirement accommodation.

My brother has difficulty providing and caring for himself, never mind taking care of my parents!

Noozan

Dora_the_Explorer wrote:

...then it appears he is prepared to abuse them financially and emotionally. Something that needs to be taken extremely seriously.

Family dynamics are different for every family. Pragmatically, your parents business is their business - to do with what they like as they are unable to continue in it. Your brother is responsible for sorting out his own accommodation.
If he has been paying £10 all in for everything you mention, he's been taking advantage of his parents.
He should be supporting your parents during this difficult time, not adding to their worries.
Some families carry out their responsibilities to each other in different ways, but it's hard to see what contribution your brother makes. Offer any help you are able to, but the best help you can give him is to make him take responsibility for his own life and perhaps the only way that will happen is if the help you give him is in the form of advice and information.

Yes, he is taking advantage of them and it's partly their fault for letting him do so for so long. I also agree that he should be taking responsibility for himself anf his own life but I can't make him and my parents won't make him as far as I can see. As long everything is handed to him on a plate, it won;t change. There's no incentive for him to change.

I am trying to be as supportive as I can and have offered hima wealth of information but nothing seems to be sinking in.

Noozan

BobProperty wrote:

I think you have already addressed one of my thoughts, which was that this relative may turn to one of you for support and accommodation.
What does he actually do as far as the business is concerned? Would it be possible to sell the business to someone who would take him on and allow him to continue living in the flat?

I will help and support him as much as I can but I'm not willing to financially support him because if I start; I can see it never ending. I'm also not willing to house him for the same reason.

He takes counter orders and also cooks in the business. We have two speculative enquiries as to whether we would be willing to sell; it has not been advertised yet. It would be unlikely that whoever bought it would keep him on, on the same terms. He takes days off (paid( as and when he feels like it, is late on a regular basis and can sometimes be rude and abrupt to customers (!). I would imagine that whoever did buy it would probably want to choose their own staff anyway and the flat would be required to house the staff. This is quite common for chinese businesses though - staff have accommodation provided for them.

Noozan

Going back to the original post; is there any way/possibility that he could be added legitimately to the council tenancy with my parents so that when they give it up, he could either stay on or ask for a transfer?

BobProperty

Noozan wrote:

I will help and support him as much as I can but I'm not willing to financially support him because if I start; I can see it never ending. I'm also not willing to house him for the same reason.

That's what I thought. Perfectly reasonable on your behalf.

Noozan wrote:

He takes counter orders and also cooks in the business. We have two speculative enquiries as to whether we would be willing to sell; it has not been advertised yet. It would be unlikely that whoever bought it would keep him on, on the same terms. He takes days off (paid( as and when he feels like it, is late on a regular basis and can sometimes be rude and abrupt to customers (!). I would imagine that whoever did buy it would probably want to choose their own staff anyway and the flat would be required to house the staff. This is quite common for chinese businesses though - staff have accommodation provided for them.

Again this is what I was concerned about. This is a "family" sized business? so the new owners will either already have staff or will want to hire their own. As has been said, he's had it too comfortably and will have difficulty changing his ways.
Regarding getting him on the tenancy, I think Lynz knows more than I do, but I would agree that this could just look like an attempt to get him into a council house and I doubt the council housing department will agree.

Dora_the_Explorer_5

Noozan wrote:

Going back to the original post; is there any way/possibility that he could be added legitimately to the council tenancy with my parents so that when they give it up, he could either stay on or ask for a transfer?

I think you've answered your question yourself in your OP below -

I wondered if my brother could add his name to my parents' tenancy (it's currently just in my dad's name) and told him to ask the council if this was possible. He enquired at the council and told them (quite correctly) that he was living in private rented accommodation and they told him it wasn't possible to add his name. A few weeks later, he wrote a letter on behalf of my dad saying that "his son who was currently living with him would like to add his name to the tenancy" and received a reply back saying that only spouses could be added and that his son had previously contacted them and said he lived elsewhere