Are Bulls on MSE : EA's : BTLers : Other :

Graham_Devon

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

CML report 900,000 in negative equity of which approx 600,000 are in NE for less than 10k

CML also report there are 11.1 Million Mortgages, therefore 8.1% of mortgaged property is in Negative equity or roughly 4% of all home owners

http://www.cml.org.uk/cml/media/press/2285

http://www.cml.org.uk/cml/filegrab/Homeownerhousingequitythroughthedownturn.pdf?ref=6360

That one only runs to end of 2008.

The BOE states between 700,000 - 1.1 million.

Which doesnt include the 200,000 investment properties in neg equity.

What the CML also said in that report you linked to however, was that they estimate 5 million in negative equity by the end of 2009, which was estimated in Feb 2009.

Thrugelmir

tommy75 wrote: »

Yes but its only Mid 2004 average prices we are equal to now, so its only 2004-2007 that are in or are around negative equity and even so, its not going to be a huge amount (about 16% falls so far) unless its multiple homes.

Depends where property prices finally bottom out at.......

1echidna

Graham_Devon wrote: »

No, its not reasonable.

I don't hold brown responsible solely for the recession and never have. I have always said his disasterous policies have put us in a worse position.

To be fair, if the tories get in, I will be MORE bearish, as I believe the tories may actually make some tough decisions which will take us down further....but the key here is, we NEED to go down further if we are going to return to any sense.

I will never be bullish. Ever. At least I don't think. I have always been this way about things.

I believe strongly in people having the chance of a home and a life beyond work. I believe strongly that people should be able to enjoy life, aswell as work hard and pay their way.

I believe that the cost of houses and the cost of living in this country is stopping people from enjoying life and enjoying retirement. For those inbetweeners....those in the middle of having the safety of the benefits net, and being well off, retirement is a sad predicament. Living day to day is a sad predicament. I don't think it should be like this, and I do believe that bulls ramping markets and house prices in order to secure their own wealth is damaging to the nation as a whole.

I hae always said we need optimism just as much as pessimism. But the optimism I am seeing from the bulls, aswell as your first post on this thread, as I have said, is beyond dellusion.

It seems to me, SOME bull type personalities would sell their own mother into a home that they knew was going to lose value, so long as it keeps them on top.

I don't need to try to ramp markets to secure my wealth, not saying I want to lose some of, but as I have said somewhere before I am willing to grin and bear it if inflation eats away at my wealth if it help younger people and the country with its debts. My point was about the corrosive effect of lack of confidence. In any event my writing a few lines on this board is hardly going to have any effect in ramping markets as you put it. I too would love people in the UK to live better lives, just don't see that further falls in house prices which will decimate the banks balance sheets further and create further debts for the country is a good thing. Of course in an ideal world where lots of people were not unemployed and the banks did not have shot balance sheets it would be great if house prices were low.

IveSeenTheLight

Graham_Devon wrote: »

That one only runs to end of 2008.

The BOE states between 700,000 - 1.1 million.

Which doesnt include the 200,000 investment properties in neg equity.

What the CML also said in that report you linked to however, was that they estimate 5 million in negative equity by the end of 2009, which was estimated in Feb 2009.

Graham,

The CML did not estimate 5 million in NE by the year end.
They reported that GfK estimated that figure.
The CML also said that the estimation was implausible of being more accurate than the CML figures

Adj.1.implausible - having a quality that provokes disbelief; "gave the teacher an implausible excuse" incredible, unbelievable - beyond belief or understanding; "at incredible speed"; "the book's plot is simply incredible"
plausible - apparently reasonable and valid, and truthful; "a plausible excuse"
2.implausible - highly imaginative but unlikely; "a farfetched excuse"; "an implausible explanation" farfetched
unlikely - has little chance of being the case or coming about; "an unlikely story"; "an unlikely candidate for reelection"; "a butcher is unlikely to preach vegetarianism"


Why do you always seem to write things but not understand what they mean?
You would benefit by taking the time to understand and read the facts instead of quicky browsing something and putting your own interpretation onto it.

confused31_2

I think you can tell by the poll, most people that post on here regulary are estate agents, or something to do with housing so you can understand why they are trying to talk up the market.

I mean by the poll, most of us know estate agents are always on here being bullish even if they say they are not estate agents, and thats why when i voted there was only three votes for estate agents.:cool:

Most post's about mortgages, people come in with the response go and see a broker or a adviser.( are these post's actually from financial advisers and brokers trying to get more work for their industry????

I suspect yes.

Likewise anyone who wants to rent their own house out without a letting agent, is told they shouldnt as its not worth the risks( are these post's by letting agents trying to get more work for their futures??

i suspect yes

And the same with estate agents, who i will never use again, but like the other two above, anyone who suggest not using a estate agent gets told you are better using a agent( are these people telling them to use agents, actually esate gents???

i suspect yes.

Its human nature that anyone who relies on their income for the hosuing market to be doing well, will tell you it is, and will also pursuade people to use them, i just think the way things are now people can make their own minds up.

You may have btl landlords talk the market up but to be honest whatever they say its not going to make any difference, if they have bit off more than they can chew in recent years they are certainly doomed.

1echidna

confused31 wrote: »

I think you can tell by the poll, most people that post on here regulary are estate agents, or something to do with housing so you can understand why they are trying to talk up the market.

I mean by the poll, most of us know estate agents are always on here being bullish even if they say they are not estate agents, and thats why when i voted there was only three votes for estate agents.:cool:

Most post's about mortgages, people come in with the response go and see a broker or a adviser.( are these post's actually from financial advisers and brokers trying to get more work for their industry????

I suspect yes.

Likewise anyone who wants to rent their own house out without a letting agent, is told they shouldnt as its not worth the risks( are these post's by letting agents trying to get more work for their futures??

i suspect yes

And the same with estate agents, who i will never use again, but like the other two above, anyone who suggest not using a estate agent gets told you are better using a agent( are these people telling them to use agents, actually esate gents???

i suspect yes.

Its human nature that anyone who relies on their income for the hosuing market to be doing well, will tell you it is, and will also pursuade people to use them, i just think the way things are now people can make their own minds up.

You may have btl landlords talk the market up but to be honest whatever they say its not going to make any difference, if they have bit off more than they can chew in recent years they are certainly doomed.

I am really surprised how many people here are BTLers. Actually though I think that far more people here seem to think there will be further steep falls in house prices rather than a stabilisation of the market. Makes one wonder why the BTLers are not selling up? Perhaps they think the prospects for property are bad but even worse than alternative places for their money? Or is it simple inertia, not wanting the hassle, or not being able to sell because of negative equity or tenants in place? This may be more a place to get an accurate balance of different view points than the press etc as powerful vested interest do not bother with this type of backwater.

confused31_2

1echidna wrote: »

I am really surprised how many people here are BTLers. Actually though I think that far more people here seem to think there will be further steep falls in house prices rather than a stabilisation of the market. Makes one wonder why the BTLers are not selling up? Perhaps they think the prospects for property are bad but even worse than alternative places for their money? Or is it simple inertia, not wanting the hassle, or not being able to sell because of negative equity or tenants in place? This may be more a place to get an accurate balance of different view points than the press etc as powerful vested interest do not bother with this type of backwater.

I think a lot of btlers are getting good profits at the moment, its when the rates go up they will be in a mess.

Spiv_2

tommy75 wrote: »

I think most, if not all 'bulls' on this forum are involved in Buy to Let or are Estate Agents. What do you think?

There are about 20 posters on this board at anyone time. It's not exactly going to move markets is it?

ginandtonic1988

confused31 wrote: »

Its human nature that anyone who relies on their income for the hosuing market to be doing well, will tell you it is, and will also pursuade people to use them

I work for a Property Lawyers New Build department and I most certainly am not telling anyone of the sort. I keep my views to my self, if my employers new what I was thinking about the housing market they would be horrified......

I would hate to pursuade anyone to buy a house for my own gains especially if it all went horribly wrong.

tommy75

Spiv wrote: »

There are about 20 posters on this board at anyone time. It's not exactly going to move markets is it?

No it isn't. Only VI such as BTL or EA would post here everyday telling people there is not a better time to buy. Just making a point.