Solar Power - always a scam??

Cardew

BFG wrote: »

Many thanks, if people go back and look at my original posting [that started this thread off], they'll see that's the the very question I was posing ie its the lying scamming companies....

So in summary,

Solar sales companies ARE 100% lying, thieving scamming scum

Do your sums and you'll see....

DO NOT buy solar just YET

But absolutely 100% DO buy solar WHEN it is cost effective to do so

I would take issue with just one point - i.e. the 100% lying.

I actually came across one firm that made accurate realistic claims. I contacted them and was told that on the solar HW systems they had fitted they calculated that the output would be between 800kWh and 1,100kWh a year depending on location in UK.

So at present fuel prices the annual savings could be as low £25 and £110. That of course is leaving out any maintenance costs - pump, electronics, plumbing, cleaning etc.

daytona600_2

payback on solar electric pv systems in the uk
depending on size and uk location and fixed or trackers is generally
7 to 10 years
systems will work for 25 years or longer
say 10 years pay back
then 15 years or more revenue for selling power to the grid
system will actually pay for itself 2 to 3 times over lifecycle of the system
and is maintenance free , adds value to house , lowers emmissions etc

36.5 pence per kilowatt over 25 years is a good LONG term investment
far better than investing in stocks or banks

what is the uks average electricity bill over 25 years
say average per ofgem of £1000 per year is £25k at todays prices

spend £10k on 3kw system and will generate £20k plus over lifespan



QUOTE=BFG;25508577]What a load of sentimental emotional codswallop, opinions dressed as fact and guessing and rehashing vague statements........

No wonder people get ripped off by solar sales companies when you've got spammers and scammers like daytona600 running around with selective memories and the total inability to answer two simple questions......

"what payback periods do you tell you victims, sorry customers, that can expect [without the 'compare it to the interest on money in a savings account' sleight of hand], and

"what do you tell them about...so that they can make a properly informed decision?"[/QUOTE]

BFG_2

daytona...it would possibly help to understand your postings if you learnt how to 'quote' properly [press the big QUOTE button at the bottom of the post you want to quote from.]

HTH

BFG_2

daytona600 wrote: »

payback on solar electric pv systems in the uk
depending on size and uk location and fixed or trackers is generally
7 to 10 years
systems will work for 25 years or longer
say 10 years pay back
then 15 years or more revenue for selling power to the grid
system will actually pay for itself 2 to 3 times over lifecycle of the system
and is maintenance free , adds value to house , lowers emmissions etc

36.5 pence per kilowatt over 25 years is a good LONG term investment
far better than investing in stocks or banks

what is the uks average electricity bill over 25 years
say average per ofgem of £1000 per year is £25k at todays prices

spend £10k on 3kw system and will generate £20k plus over lifespan

So what you mean is you bamboozle them with vague stats and compare to a savings acct with a bank [happlily ignoring the loss of capital]....

In summary, and true to form lying, misleading, blurring, confusing and scamming

mech_2

daytona600 wrote: »

payback on solar electric pv systems in the uk
depending on size and uk location and fixed or trackers is generally
7 to 10 years
systems will work for 25 years or longer
say 10 years pay back
then 15 years or more revenue for selling power to the grid
system will actually pay for itself 2 to 3 times over lifecycle of the system
and is maintenance free , adds value to house , lowers emmissions etc

36.5 pence per kilowatt over 25 years is a good LONG term investment
far better than investing in stocks or banks

You can't be serious. Putting £10,000 in a bank account would earn you interest from day 1. Putting £10,000 into solar takes you 10 years to break even (allegedly 10, though I think it's doubtful). And then any further returns on the investment are based on this incentive still being in place after those 10 years.

what is the uks average electricity bill over 25 years
say average per ofgem of £1000 per year is £25k at todays prices

spend £10k on 3kw system and will generate £20k plus over lifespan

Sorry, where does Ofgem say an average electricity bill is £1000? They don't. It's more like half of that.

Actually I find none of your figures credible.

Cardew

BFG wrote: »

In summary, and true to form lying, misleading, blurring, confusing and scamming

Stop beating about the bush - do you believe Daytona or not!

The frightening thing is that some people actually believe that claptrap and are conned out of £thousands!

What a way to make a living!

Mcfi5dhc

BFG wrote: »

Solar sales companies ARE 100% lying, thieving scamming scum

I'd just like to say that the people who installed my solar PV system were absolute gents. They certainly were not liars, thieves, scammers or scum. Their may be some around there, but it is offensive to tar everyone with the same brush.

They were either spot on with their financial figures or were overly conservative (in my favour). Never at any point did they say I'd have a rapid payback - indeed, I installed these well before talk of Feed-In-Tariffs appeared.

Feed-In-Tariffs (if brought in as proposed - we'll find out in a fortnight or so) are designed to kick start the solar industry. Prices will fall in installation, and as such the feed-in-tariff will drop. There is no skill in choosing the right time - just gut feeling. I've not regretted my decision for one second - whether I qualify for the FIT tariff or not will not change this.

BFG_2

Mcfi5dhc wrote: »

I'd just like to say that the people who installed my solar PV system were absolute gents. They certainly were not liars, thieves, scammers or scum. Their may be some around there, but it is offensive to tar everyone with the same brush.

They were either spot on with their financial figures or were overly conservative (in my favour). Never at any point did they say I'd have a rapid payback - indeed, I installed these well before talk of Feed-In-Tariffs appeared.

Feed-In-Tariffs (if brought in as proposed - we'll find out in a fortnight or so) are designed to kick start the solar industry. Prices will fall in installation, and as such the feed-in-tariff will drop. There is no skill in choosing the right time - just gut feeling. I've not regretted my decision for one second - whether I qualify for the FIT tariff or not will not change this.

I'm pleased that you're happy with your solar set-up, you're presumably one of the very lucky ones [who went in knowing that it was not a sensible thing to do from an economic POV].

Most buyers are never told the truth wrt payback, etc. They are promised 'free heating for ever' or 'reduces your bills by 85%', etc.

So I'll modify my posting to accomodate your experience.....

So in summary,

Solar sales companies ARE 100% lying, thieving, scamming scum [except the one firm that did mcfisdh's system]

Do your sums and you'll see....

DO NOT buy solar just YET [unless you can afford £5-10k and are happy to invest in something that doesn't make any economic sense whatsoever]

But absolutely 100% DO buy solar WHEN it is cost effective to do so

Hope this clarifies things and gives a more balanced take on the matter.

Mcfi5dhc

A better modification would have been:

BFG wrote: »

Solar sceptics in MSE Forums ARE sometimes wrong!

Do your sums and you'll see....

DO NOT buy solar just YET [wait two weeks for the goverment to finalise the Feed-In-Tariffs, then do your own sums in whichever way you are comfortable with]

But absolutely 100% DO go and view someones house that has solar panels and get their view on it. Get at least 3 quotes from installers, and make sure they are accredited by Low Carbon Buildings Programme

Hope this clarifies things and gives a more balanced take on the matter.

BFG_2

Ah, now that's very sneaky...modifying someone's 'quote'....I like it [what fun to be had]!!!!

On a more serious note, are you really suggesting that the feed in tariffs will make solar cost effective??

I thought the MOAS [mother of all spreadhseets] showed it still had a 10yr+ payback??

I'd therefore suggest that 'solar sceptic' hasn't been wrong so far. [BTW I'm not sceptical about solar [it works, it's just not cost effective], but I'm definitely sceptical about the cowboy firms that lie and scam innocent punters.]

FACT:- No-one on any of the solar threads has shown solar to be even approaching a sensible investment.

I repeat : No-one on any of the solar threads has shown solar to be even approaching a sensible investment [Maybe you'd like to do it for us??].

Now, which bit of that is sceptical??