A Tradesmans rant

marleyboy

whitegoods_engineer wrote: »

Maybe you don't care. If ignorance is bliss then well done! What you SHOULD appreciate is that in choosing the cheapest tradesman, you make that choice based upon solely one factor - Price.

I attend daily to customers who have gone out and bought washing machines for £150 (or even less) and then complain that it has broken down after 12 months! They tell me that their 'old' washing machine lasted for 12 years and that the new one is rubbish!

They don't seem to make the logical link between something which just about does a basic job for £150 or something which is engineered, researched and built to a level of quality and durability and sold for a realistic price.

Sure you can always find somebody prepared to either rob themselves or do a rubbish job by seeking out the cheapest but then thats the mentality of those who buy Chinese washing machines and expect a Rolls Royce kind of service and reliability.

You probably have the mind of a person who believes that tradesman A, solely because he charges more than tradesman B must be ripping you off because one is 'cheaper' than the other.

Just because you don't give a hoot about any factors which may affect the 'price' shows a lack of reasoning and an inability to assess the pros and cons of one tradesman versus another.

You seem to have a formula in your head which states CHEAPEST=BEST, FULL STOP!

Well, if thats your blinkered view, good luck!

I dont claim it to be ignorant one bit, when i go to a shop to buy Coffee, I dont think to myself how much does the Jar, Label, Transportation, Grinding etc, etc cost. I simply say to myself "How much is this jar" Does that make me ignorant to the production of coffee? Not one bit.

It seems your blinkered view is that I should worry about all that is involved in that. it might help if you try reading my previous posts on this matter, ultimatley as I said previously, I would go for thwe cheapest quote at the best possible deal both for Proffessionalism AND cost.

Obviously any normal person, would go for the BEST DEAL. If I can get a Rolls Royce for the price of a Mini, I would be as foolish as you to turn it down and think "naah, I will pay Rolls Royce Price for it"

At No point have I accused SE tradesmen as ripping me off, thats your own biased blinkered view. I speak as a customer, who wants the best deal, not the first Jackass who gives me a price from out of thin air.

Please do show me where I said Cheapest would be the best deal, or keep your blinkered opinions firmly to yourself. (obviously your attitude would cost you MY custom).

I question what is the best deal OVERALL, taking every factor into consideration, certainly not someone with your unproffessional opinion on the cost.

Anybody would, if Proffesional self employed tradesman "A" qoutes me £1000 against Proffessional Tradesman "B" quote of £999. Both offering the same standard of proffessional service, I would be a fool to say "I will go for A", simply because "A" says "Im ignorant to his overheads", because he has to drive that extra mile to do the job.

As a customer, that wouldnt be my problem, all I care about is having the best possible job done at the lowest possible cost. If thats some kind of formula, well heck it works well for me.

thechippy

Wow,

Been away for a bit working away and the comments have doubled.
Some very interesting comments, thanks for your input everyone (good, or bad!)

Anyway, the point I was trying to make (perhaps not very well), was not that most people are unwilling to pay my charges, as the vast majority are and I’m very busy atm. It was more that I don’t understand why some feel that their profession is worth maybe 40/100k p/a for example, but mine is not? (see first post)
I’ve had many years of training, built up my skills and charge what I feel is fair for the quality of work and after sales that I provide.

I agree with Marley and others, that it’s nature to try and obtain the best price, as long as the quality is perceived as being equal. I would always reiterate though, “at least beware of the cheapest price”.

It’s a tough call for the client, as I’ve said before. Cheap is not necessarily going to be the worst job and the most expensive, not necessarily the best. Just use your instincts!

I simply give the client a quote for the job. If they accept, that’s great. If they want to use someone cheaper, that’s fine as well. Their choice - no sour grapes!

nwph

Interesting thread ,some of the comments are very amusing ,i own a small htg business that employs people ,it can be hardwork running a small company or one man band but i would never ever go back to being an employee .Too much golf to play.

Yes there is a recession ,and there are local people to me doing boiler swaps for £600 but you have to look for other opportunities and diversify your business.I have never ever given a customer a set daily rate ,every job has a price with various factors affecting that price .

Lol to the guy with £14 magnetic van stickers .:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

You sound like the next richard branson or should that be steptoe ,if you can run your business on that low rate are you sure you don't turn up to the job in a horse and cart ,i'm sure a new set of horse shoes are alot cheaper than bridgestones. :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

What about the guy who employed a builder who couldn't drive rofl .:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

The chancers will be gone by the time this recession ends and there will be serious coin to earn ,no one can sustain and grow a business on £180 a day let alone some of the silly low rates such as £100 a day ,thats not really a business is it .

Business is about making money nothing else ,anyone can be a busy fool.

stagsman

If your good at your job you wouldn't need advertising you would use word of mouth.

heretolearn_2

I feel for Mr Chippy (I know this is an old thread). We too get people saying we charge too much (although we are careful to keep our fee mid-range), fine, they can go somewhere else then. But some people expect to get top-rate services for bargain-basement prices, and that annoys me. They come to us moaning about their current accountants, but still want us to win their business by 'beating their price'. What planet do they live on? they want to pay less and get something better?

I deal with them by saying that whatever you buy, you want cheap, good and fast. Unfortunately, you can only ever get two of those in the same place.

You might find cheap and good - but the service won't be great.
You might find cheap and fast - but the quality won't be great
You want good and fast? - ok, but it won't be cheap!

marleyboy

heretolearn wrote: »

I feel for Mr Chippy (I know this is an old thread). We too get people saying we charge too much (although we are careful to keep our fee mid-range), fine, they can go somewhere else then. But some people expect to get top-rate services for bargain-basement prices, and that annoys me.

I think you will find EVERYONE wants a top rate service at the lowest possible price, I really do not think people "expect" it. And like you say if people think you charge too much, they WILL go somewhere else. generally they DO!

If I think ANYONE is charging too much, I would go elsewhere (its called being pennywise - its quite common), if I think someones prices are reasonable I may choose to do business with them over and above anyone who's charges are "cheaper" than their own. As cheap does not necessarily mean best. But not before I weigh up all the Pro's and Con's of either Company to decide which "overall" deal is the best.

If a price is just too much, one would have to be pretty "gullible" to pay for it. If a price is reasonable for the job (both professional and quality) then it should be easy enough for a company to justify the extra cost. If a price seems just "too good to be true", one might "reasonably" wonder what the catch is.

Getting annoyed over peoples choices (because they opt for a cheaper service thats more in line with their own budget) is no way to secure a deal, you have to sell yourself with "why" they should pay slightly more. "we offer a five year parts\labour guarantee" or "our products are constructed and built to a professional standard on top of the personal and friendly service we offer". Simply saying "yeah well they might be cheaper because they are rubbish" or "well fine, go somewhere else then!" really isn't gong to do you any favours, especially if its on a "word of mouth" basis.

People inevitably look for a cheaper deal with the best possible perks, from shopping in either Asda or Tesco for identical items, to choosing which package deal to book for their holidays. Things like this should be encouraged, especially during a recession.

Every company will undoubtedly say "were the best", yet it does not need reminding that in this day and age of "rival competition" they are not the only company offering the same kind of professional service to the customer. Whether or not they are cheaper or more expensive than the other, its a dog eat dog World out there when it comes to securing a deal with a customer who normally likes to "shop around" first.

heretolearn_2

"yeah well they might be cheaper because they are rubbish" or "well fine, go somewhere else then!" we don't actually say that to prospects :-)

I don't get annoyed when people only have a certain budget and need to go somewhere cheaper, that's understandable, or make their choice for another reason altogether. We always advise people to look around at more than one firm and find the one that suits them for their requirements, budget, and very importantly, they need accountants they like and trust and feel they can work with. We want new clients who we match up with, not ones we can't make happy for whatever reason.
I just get annoyed (privately, not with the prospective client) when people don't accept that they sometimes have to pay a bit more to get what they want in way of quality/service i.e. it's quite common to get people looking to upgrade from using a one-man band home-based accoutant as they are disatisfied because they can't always get hold of him, the accountant would go on holiday and be unavailable, and when the accountant was out with another client obviously couldn't answer his phone etc. Their needs have changed and they want full access whenever needed during office hours. OK, so they need to use a firm of more than one person, so something like us with office, several accountants, 2 partners plus full time reception/admin staff. So absolutely no problem getting to talk to someone whenever he wanted.
But sometimes they still expect to be able to pay the same or even lower fees. Fair enough, of course we can explain everything nicely and let them make their decision. Most will still use us. Others, well we wish them well and quite often they return to us in a couple of years.
But some people react really oddly and just don't live in the real world. Negotiating is one thing but when someone sits there and just repeats that they will only go somewhere cheaper than their current (poor service) accountant you have to wonder. How they think a proper business could possibly operate more cheaply than someone working from their spare bedroom is beyond me. They want the better service, but refuse to see there's a gap between what they want and what they want to spend. You rarely get better by cutting what you are paying....

There sometimes such a disconnect between their hopes and reality. Like walking into a BMW showroom and saying 'oh but you've got to match the price I paid for a Skoda'
:-)

Oh and there's the people who say 'do this work for me now free/at a really low price (so low we'd make a considerable loss) and then I'll use you again next year. so you'll be gaining business! (no we won't, we'll be losing money. It's not like they're testing us out before moving a big business to us, they are always the people who can't afford to pay £200!)

My boss actually had someone literally go down on her knees and start begging once - he was so embarassed he ended up saying yes to the ridiculous fee she wanted and we lost loads of money on that job. Good grief.

Having said all that, most of our clients are lovely and appreciate what we do for them. If they didn't think we offered good value, of course they would take their business elsewhere, and rightly so.

jdturk

Most of the tradespeople on here who moan about people wanting cheaper prices for labour are ultimately hyprocritical because how many people here go and buy their produce at the local supermarket where they could get the same product from an independant but pay a higher price.

How many of you would be saying the independant wasn't competitive or their price isn't reasonable?

The principle is the same

marleyboy

Ultimately, there still exists companies that will charge way over the odds, then there are companies who charge just as much, offering just as good a quality AND service, but still go off on holidays etc. Then there are the honest companies that DO offer a good level of service, of quality and on time that DO charge a reasonable fee.

Just because a company charges more, does not mean they are any better than the alternatives. I would agree if you want a cowboy job, pay the cowboy rates.

To use a car showroom analogy, I can imagine walking into a BMW showroom pointing to the a desired car and quoting a cheaper price for the same speck vehicle being offered at the showroom down the road.

One might assume if they cannot price match, that they might just offer an additional service to tempt me with, else logic would tell me to go to the other showroom to make a deal.

I cannot imagine a brand new BMW costing the same as a brand new Skoda, but were that the case, I wouldnt buy a Skoda but might just buy the BMW from the showroom offering it for the same price as a Skoda rather than pay BMW's price.

A customer in general, will take service, quality and timescale into consideration, but top of anyones list will be the total cost, whether its cheap, reasonable, fair, expensive or extortionate, will determine the customers choice.

If a 4ltr pot of Matt Silk Peach Dulux Paint costs £10 at B&Q £8 at Wickes or £2 at Daves Decor Store, I would be less inclined to pop to B&Q simply because they offer it with a better "thank you" and a wider greeting smile. I am sure every builder in the trade, will get the best quality materials at the cheapest possible price to do the job, however professional they are.

No different to any of their customers.

sookipeaspud

I hear what you say Maryeboy and I agree.

You make your choices on a number of points when making a finanal decision.


Thanks