Windows Vista

fgaughan

thewizard wrote:

I have noticed alot of people talking about it so I thought I would start a whole topic about it. If you dont already know about it, Windows Vista will be Microsoft's Next release of Windows.
Some of the new key features are:

• One version for 32 and 64 bit CPU's
• Capable computers will benefit from "Areo Glass" providing 3D graphics for day to day use like opening files etc.
• Tighter Security! Incredible new features to improve security that even Linux will be a little scared of.
• Desktop Sidebar
• Internet Explorer 7 which is also available for XP (currently in Beta 2)
  http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/ie7/default.mspx
• More advanced networking features
• New backup features and improvements to System Restore
• Completely redesigned Windows Explorer
• Some features like an updates to the Alt+Tab program switching, it is now similar to Mac's Expose (a little useless)
• Redesigned Start Menu and Taskbar
• Better Search Feature
• And alot more

BTW: I am not working for Microsoft although you would think it from what I just wrote. :eek:

If you want more information on Windows Vista the URL is:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/default.aspx

Something else you might notice is that their are not just Home and Porfessional versions, I think there are 3 Home versions and 2 Professional/Business/Enterprise versions

Looking on this list i cant see anything new. people have all this already!!
Seem like microsoft copying Macs aswell as Linux.

moomintroll_3

thewizard wrote:

All mac users are the same, no offence but Windows Vista will be alot more advanced that any current Version of Mac released to date. Mac is a good operating system, but for what it is designed for, Publishing, I would not reccomend Mac to any beginner computer user and would always point people towrads windows.
Windows Vista will be in my eyes a new generation of computers, much like the Playstatoin 3 will be the next generation of Games Console.

BTW: waiting for SP1 to come out could be a bit of a big mistake because it took Microsoft about two years to release SP2 after SP1 so you might be waiting some time.

Well, THAT was unnecessary! "All mac users are the same", did you even read what I wrote? I'm technology agnostic - I use the best technology for the purpose whether it happens to be Windows, OSX, Linux, Solaris, Exchange, Exim, ENDI/MQ, SFTP etc etc etc. Believe me, for home computing OSX is *WAY* ahead of anything MS have out right now. That may change with Vista (as I believe I said) but I doubt it.

I would never, up to less than 12 months ago, have entertained a mac at home. Then I used one. To say they're only good for publishing is complete and total BS. You sound like you've never used OSX as if you had you'd understand just what a pleasure it is after Windows.

And for the record, I work with windows all day and don't have any real issues. I simply prefer the mac and think it is a much more advanced system than anything MS have out now and, from the tech previews I've seen, anything they're likely to have out when Vista comes around.

And I stand by what I said, I would NEVER install a .0 release of pretty much anything. Neither would any of the computing firms I've worked for. The last place I worked as a contractor (a top 4 bank) was still using NT4 and was only just starting a migration programme to XP. Where I work now (cannot disclose) has only just finished an XP migration.

So, please don't assume I'm some sort of Apple fanboy because I'm not. If MS come up with the goods I'll go back to Windows - right now OSX is ahead of XP so that's what I'll use.

I really do hate it when people make glib comments like that.

fgaughan

thewizard wrote:

All mac users are the same, no offence but Windows Vista will be alot more advanced that any current Version of Mac released to date..

Canyou name 1? advanced what? tell me whats vista will have that MAc doesn't?

And no i dont have a mac but id love one :-)

thewizard

it seems alot of you disagree with what i posted, but I just guess I am a hard core PC user. The first computer I used was in my school, its was a fairly recent (at the time) Mac, it was ok to use but a little confusing. Whem my parents first bought me a computer which ran Windows 98, i just fell in love with the OS, alot of you have said Macs are a breathe of fresh air, but for me it was the other way round, my PC was a breathe of fresh air. OK if I had to I would use a Mac but otherwise id choose a pc. I based my claim "All Mac users are the same" on what a group of my friends, who are all Mac users say to me.
Like on here we have disgussions over what OS is better, and everytime each of them comes out with the same comments. And my claim Macs are made for publishing, is because that was the original aim of the Mac.
I am not basing my claims on nothing, I have used old and new versions of Macs and in MY OWN PERSONAL OPINION believe that Macs are better. I will be getting the next release of Windows when it gets released but although some of you may disagree I am not stupid and therefore will not be installing it on any of my current systems. I will be getting myself a nice new shiny PC, I need one any way, so I might aswell wait for Vista.
Macs aren't as secure as SOME people think they are, the first two worms were discovered for Macs early last month, although this is a minute amount compared to Windows, like I said earlier, Windows is a more popular OS and therefore is a larger target for Malware.
As for a feature Mac doesn't have (please correct me if I am wrong) but I believe that Mac doesn't have the capabilities of 3D graphics (I mean ones that require a 3D graphics card for) in the main OS its self.

I know some people will disagree with me here but I know I may not sound like it but I am always open to ideas.

wolfman

I can see your point wizard, and agree on both sides of the argument.

OSX is great, a brilliant out of the box solution. And yes, it is an ideal platform for graphical work, flash etc...

Windows is great too, a lot of people will nag about it, but at the end of the day it does work very well considering, as you say, how heavily it is targeted.

I'm a programmer (Java, .Net) so am biased towards PC archictecture (Windows and Linux). Windows does require some education in order to use it properly/safely, which some people may argue shouldn't be the case, but in technology it is. Scammers/phishers etc... will do whatever they can to get round protection, no operating system is "safe", a certain amount of user knowledge will always be required.

Also with regard to not trying any .0 releases, that depends upon your line of work. NT4 and banks were mentioned (not entirely sure about the NT4 reference), yet in some areas of technology you need to be using the latest software, sometimes even in beta form. In fact I've done work for Natwest, and they use .Net v2.0 which is very recent. Obviously if you're a large business the risk isn't worth it until at least SP1, but for most people it should be fine, especially if you want to push ahead.

thewizard

My point exactly, at least some people agree with me here. Although in some cases I do not always push forwards witht he latest technology, I to am a programmer but I write in Visual Basic but I have for the mean time decided to stick with VB6 instead of migrating to VB .Net, but it is all down to user preference and the users needs. For what I make, moving to VB .Net would not be a worth while move, but in my eyes moving to Vista would be. The same as I will be migrating to Office 2007 when that is released as I cant wait for the built in PDF support and the unified XML format file types.

Edit: although I am looking for a Beta version of office to see what it is like, my friend has it and he says it is very good!

wolfman

fgaughan wrote:

Canyou name 1? advanced what? tell me whats vista will have that MAc doesn't?

- Better file management
- An inbuilt, more universal form of PDF based on xml.
- Better networking and networking support.
- Embedded RSS
- More sophisticated security (it has to be due to all the malware)
- Better hardware support

You'll find a few things, I think such as SpotLight, Apple "stole" from Microsoft. Apple were just the first to ship it. Remember Longhorn/Vista has been in the pipeline since around 2002. I guess Microsoft are their own enemy in that sense as being second to market never looks good.

Apple show greater care for their user base by releasing new apps/updates/add-ons quickly and also listening to what the user wants. But then again MS don't charge x amount to upgrade the OS each year. It's always six of one and half a dozen of the other.

moomintroll_3

thewizard wrote:

Macs aren't as secure as SOME people think they are, the first two worms were discovered for Macs early last month, although this is a minute amount compared to Windows, like I said earlier, Windows is a more popular OS and therefore is a larger target for Malware.
As for a feature Mac doesn't have (please correct me if I am wrong) but I believe that Mac doesn't have the capabilities of 3D graphics (I mean ones that require a 3D graphics card for) in the main OS its self.

I know some people will disagree with me here but I know I may not sound like it but I am always open to ideas.

Macs are more secure than Windows at the moment, I don't buy the 'security by obscurity' argument though...

AFAIK, Leap-A was a problem in the last few weeks but that was totally over-hyped as it was more of a proof-of-concept than a real worm (it couldn't spread via the internet and relied on users being stupid enough to put in their administrator password when supposedly only opening a jpg).

The other one was a real problem but again, if you weren't logged on as admin then it couldn't do anything. In OSX, you can authenticate as an admin to do things on the fly so you don't need your day-to-day account to be admin, just another account on the mac you can temporarily authenticate to when required (effectively the same as sudo in linux but for the GUI).

Personally, I run ClamXav which checks everything I download. Don't really feel the need to but might as well be prepared as a word doc from a PC user could come with a dodgy word macro which would work.

As for 3D graphics, OpenGL has been built-in for a long long long time. As from OSX 10.4 we also got Core Image which I guess is the equivalent of DirectX - see here.

As for disagreeing - isn't that what discussion is all about? ;-)

thewizard

wolfman wrote:

- Better file management
- An inbuilt, more universal form of PDF based on xml.
- Better networking and networking support.
- Embedded RSS
- More sophisticated security (it has to be due to all the malware)
- Better hardware support

Yes the Worms weren't a very large problem but like you said it is the concept that virus promgrammers now have the ability to write worms for the Mac. As for what you just said, the features wolfman said they aren't in Macs, but macs are really (or I havent seen them) used for a large LAN, I have only ever seen Windows, thats why they need the better networking and suppport, but others like Embedded RSS, I can see that in the next Mac release, whcih you will have to pay for :P.
And if Windows was sop bad then why has Microsoft made Virtual PC for Macs

moomintroll_3

thewizard wrote:

Yes the Worms weren't a very large problem but like you said it is the concept that virus promgrammers now have the ability to write worms for the Mac. As for what you just said, the features wolfman said they aren't in Macs, but macs are really (or I havent seen them) used for a large LAN, I have only ever seen Windows, thats why they need the better networking and suppport, but others like Embedded RSS, I can see that in the next Mac release, whcih you will have to pay for :P.
And if Windows was sop bad then why has Microsoft made Virtual PC for Macs

Now you're just trying to wind me up! ;-)

I get that the worms were concepts to prove a point - believe it not, I'm not stupid. The one thing that the worms relied on was the user being logged on as admin. One relied on a user being stupid enough to put in their admin password when it was supposedly only a jpg and the other did whatever it did in the user's own space - it couldn't get to the system to do something nasty like 'rm -rf /'.

I've seen macs as part of large LAN's - fully integrated with Active Directory. It's not even an issue.

Embedded RSS - not even sure what this is meant to mean. RSS is built-in to Safari and has been for months.

MS bought the company that wrote Virtual PC. As for running Windows on a Mac - not something that appeals to me.

I've already said I'll use whichever technology is best when it comes around but I'm not convinced by Vista yet. You have your opinion and I have mine (technology agnostic, I'll use what I think is best). Can't we leave it at that? :P

G