Letting Staff Go?

NorthernRed

Hi Guys,

Just some advice please, have a member of staff and it just isn't working out, usual problems poor time keeping, random days off, always on their mobile etc. Anyway they haven't been with me for a year yet, am i right in thinking i can just let they go without having to give too many reasons. The web sites i can find suggest once they have been with me a year things change.

Cheers

NR

Horace

Do you have a disciplinary policy in place?

I would be asking why they are always on their mobile and about their tardiness - I think they should be given an opportunity to change their ways though, they may have a genuine reason.

However when they have been there 12 months - circumstances do change and it is more difficult to get rid of them. Have a look at the ACAS website as they should be able to give some information there https://www.acas.org.uk

NorthernRed

Thanks Horace, we do a have a disclipinary procedure it just isn't working. We have given them many friendly warnings about phone use, last week i gave them a verbal warning as the day before they had spent 87minutes on personal calls. They took the warning as i can't use the company phone so every 10min they were on their mobile, we are only a small company and this member of staff is taking up so much of my time, just think its time they moved on, but i know they have taken past employee to tribuals so want to make sure we are cover if it goes down that route.

bargainbetty

I work in office management and have a bit of experience with this.

Firstly, is this person within their probationary period? If so, you have no problems at all. You call them into a meeting room, and explain to them that you are not keeping them on. They have failed to prove that they are right for the role and your company. Explain to them about the phone usage and general conduct, and tell them that you cannot have a staff member who fails to do their job, as it falls onto others which is not fair. Give them the notice prescribed in their contract, and escort them off the premises that day.

If it is over probation, but under 12 months it is different. If you have a disciplinary procedure,you must stick to it. You have done the friendly warning, you say you have done the verbal warning.

Organise a meeting, and make sure you have someone there to takes notes and act as a witness. Give the person 48 hours notice of the meeting in writing, and include the fact that the meeting may result in further warnings or their dismissal. Explain to them the problems that you have with their conduct and actions, and why it is not acceptable. Advise them that you are considering further action against them, which may depend on their explanation for their behaviour. Allow them to explain, and note their comments. Give them a required course of action (no personal calls, do the jobs etc) and tell them you feel the need to assess their workload. Agree reasonable behaviours.

If they succeed and turnit around, you save on recruitment fees. If they slip back into their old ways, you book a second meeting, same drill on the letter, and you can fire them in the knowledge that they cannot say they did not know what they were doing wrong. PM me if you want any other help, but I hope this gets it started.

LittleVoice

bargainbetty wrote: »

Firstly, is this person within their probationary period? If so, you have no problems at all. You call them into a meeting room, and explain to them that you are not keeping them on. They have failed to prove that they are right for the role and your company.

Please can someone point me to legislation which defines "probationary period" and says that people in probationary periods are not entitled to equal treatment with others with under one year's service?

RobertoMoir

NorthernRed wrote: »

Thanks Horace, we do a have a disclipinary procedure it just isn't working. We have given them many friendly warnings about phone use, last week i gave them a verbal warning as the day before they had spent 87minutes on personal calls.

Then surely the next step in the disciplinary procedure is to give them written warnings and so-on and if they fail to improve this is your route to dismissing them all ok. Why do you say this is not working?

Don't take this the wrong way, but if you're running a business you really should be getting legal advice on this sort of stuff. If you decide if and how to fire someone based on the majority opinion (or worse, the opinion that just so happens to validate what you want to do) from a website, that's a good route to dropping yourself/your company in it.

RobertoMoir

LittleVoice wrote: »

Please can someone point me to legislation which defines "probationary period" and says that people in probationary periods are not entitled to equal treatment with others with under one year's service?

Not sure about legislation (not sure any is required) but I'm sure you know its a common part of most employment contracts.
http://www.i-resign.com/uk/inwork/probation.asp

Debt_Free_Chick

Have you actually started with your own disciplinary procedure yet?

If not, then the ACAS Code of Practice became mandatory from 6 April 2009. You need to review your disciplinary procedure and ensure that it's consistent with the Code (actually implementing the Code as it is might be the easiest way).

If you've already taken action under your own disciplinary procedure and that started before 6 April, you are not bound by the new Code of Practice, but should continue with your own procedure. It depends on where you are and what action you've taken so far but this flowchart should help.

You could simply let the member of staff go, provided you are confident that they would not bring a claim under one of the discrimination regs or claim that you are preventing them from exercising one of their statutory rights. Advice these days is to follow the same procedure, even for someone with less than one year's service as this gives you protection if you do end up in tribunal!

You seem to be procrastinating, which is the worst thing you can do, so go through the disciplinary process.

LittleVoice

RobertoMoir wrote: »

Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleVoice
Please can someone point me to legislation which defines "probationary period" and says that people in probationary periods are not entitled to equal treatment with others with under one year's service?

Not sure about legislation (not sure any is required) but I'm sure you know its a common part of most employment contracts.
http://www.i-resign.com/uk/inwork/probation.asp

My original question was prompted by bargainbetty suggesting that if the staff member was in a probationary period they didn't need to follow the disciplinary procedure which would otherwise apply.

I don't believe there is such legislation and the suggestion was misleading.

BTW the page to which you link includes "In some cases, there may be an asymmetry in the notice required by either side. For example, you may have to give your employer a week's notice, while they are only obliged to tell you the day before, or vice-versa." Given that probationary periods can last two or more months, it is important to note that if the employee has completed one month's continuous service, they are entitled to one week's notice. For i-resign to suggest that this statutory minimum entitlement might be reduced to a day is somewhat misleading.

RobertoMoir

LittleVoice wrote: »

My original question was prompted by bargainbetty suggesting that if the staff member was in a probationary period they didn't need to follow the disciplinary procedure which would otherwise apply.

I don't believe there is such legislation and the suggestion was misleading.

You're right, there isn't any legislation that allows this, what would happen, I think, is that the employer would simply choose not to ratify the employee's employment, which (should be) is covered in the terms related to probationary periods in the contract they have.

I very much agree with you that probationary periods are not an excuse to treat people in a cavalier manner, and I also agree with DFC's point about procrastinating not being very helpful. I read somewhere (i-resign, i think actually) a comment that I also very much agree with on probationary periods which is that the end result of probation should not be a surprise to the employee.

Of course this is all supposition on our part - we don't know this guy is still in their probationary period do we?

In any case, the OP can't "just let people go without many reasons", he does have to be able to prove the dismissal wasn't "unfair" or discriminatory in certain terms regardless of how long someone has worked there, if I remember rightly.

Really we're coming back to DFC's point about the best thing to do being to follow disciplinary procedure and not hang about dithering about it either.

LittleVoice

RobertoMoir wrote: »

In any case, the OP can't "just let people go without many reasons", he does have to be able to prove the dismissal wasn't "unfair" or discriminatory in certain terms regardless of how long someone has worked there, if I remember rightly.
.

The right not to be unfairly dismissed basically kicks in after twelve months' service, though you are right to think that illegal "discrimation" reasons don't require that amount of service.

However, there is also the concept of "Wrongful dismissal" which doesn't have a minimum service qualification. In general terms it is when someone is dismissed but not in accordance with their contract - like not having the correct amount of notice or not having the disciplinary procedures followed correctly in accordance with their contract.