Budget row over 2K payout to scrap a car

Rochdale_Pioneers

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Its a car manufacturing industry. It isnt ours any more than Trident is a British nuclear deterrent.

Its ours in that it provides jobs to an army of people at the factories building the cars and the parts that go in them. Its ours in that we're the country where these companies invest their billions in the infrastructure. And its ours in that we're the country who receives the money for the 86% that are exported.

I can live without making the profits being made by Ford, Vauxhall, Toyota etc....

ruggedtoast

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Its ours in that it provides jobs to an army of people at the factories building the cars and the parts that go in them. Its ours in that we're the country where these companies invest their billions in the infrastructure. And its ours in that we're the country who receives the money for the 86% that are exported.

I can live without making the profits being made by Ford, Vauxhall, Toyota etc....

I dont think we're ever going to agree on this. The factories will stay open as long as the head offices of the various foreign manufacturers decide it cost efficient to do so. This scheme wont affect that much one way or the other, especially as only a small fraction of cars bought here are made here.

When the factories shut they will not leave any residual infrastructure or knowledge based assets behind. We wont be able to recover the lost output, innovate a new product, or export our own know how.

kennyboy66_2

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Its a car manufacturing industry. It isnt ours any more than Trident is a British nuclear deterrent.

The capability to design, engineer, and provide the robotics to produce a mass produced car vanished when the Chinese dismantled the last Rover factory and shipped it over to Beijing.

I despair of people thinking that it is hugely important who owns what companies.

English paper industry in the 16th Century was largely owned by French Huguenots.

It didn't matter then and it doesn't matter now.

Except, it does matter, in the sense that those nasty foreigners who are sucessful happen to bring capital, technology and know-how with them into this country.

If you don't like this you may be better off living in North Korea.

ruggedtoast

kennyboy66 wrote: »

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I despair of people thinking that it is hugely important who owns what companies.

English paper industry in the 16th Century was largely owned by French Huguenots.

It didn't matter then and it doesn't matter now.

Except, it does matter, in the sense that those nasty foreigners who are sucessful happen to bring capital, technology and know-how with them into this country.

If you don't like this you may be better off living in North Korea.

I dont especially care to be honest. The British car industry had a very long time to sort itself out and a lot of tax payers cash to do so. The argument for this was always that we couldnt lose the jobs. In the end, correctly, the taps were turned off and the industry failed because we made cars people didnt want to buy.

I dont see why we now have to start bailing out foreign firms for the same reason however.

Its about sustainability, and this isnt.

You wouldnt start paying your gardner £100 a day to mow your lawn because he says times are hard and he'll have to stop paying your son £5 a day in the summer holidays to mow someone elses. Would you?

itsnever2lateisit?

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Well they've done it albeit under pressure. Can't say I think it will work though.

It will work, another great piece of protectionism, protecting foreign jobs at the expense of our own. The factories in Germany/France/Spain/Poland/Japan/Italy will have additional sales in the UK, subsidised by the UK tax payer.

How about making it cheaper to employ here by reducing Ers NI and paying for it by increasing VAT to 20%, so that at least some more cash comes in from buying imports.

PS Not a tilt at Labour, cos the Tories do it too!

lostinrates

itsnever2lateisit? wrote: »

It will work, another great piece of protectionism, protecting foreign jobs at the expense of our own. The factories in Germany/France/Spain/Poland/Japan/Italy will have additional sales in the UK, subsidised by the UK tax payer.

How about making it cheaper to employ here by reducing Ers NI and paying for it by increasing VAT to 20%, so that at least some more cash comes in from buying imports.

PS Not a tilt at Labour, cos the Tories do it too!

At least in the list of countries above there are included EU countries whose factories can employ UK workers.

Snooze

bo_drinker wrote: »

So about 10 months of propping it up then Then what??

Imho it's all sound bites and hot air. I bet when all the figures are broken down, what you actually end up paying the dealer won't be any less that if you just sold your old banger privately and did some haggling.

I was reading another forum that was talking about this and they were all rubbing their hands together thinking of the money they could make out of it. Unfortunately for them, what they've failed to realise is that your trade-in motor must be taxed, insured and registered in your name for a minimum of 12 months and the scheme is only lasting for 10 months. Oh dear....

Rob

lostinrates

Snooze wrote: »

failed to realise is that your trade-in motor must be taxed, insured and registered in your name for a minimum of 12 months and the scheme is only lasting for 10 months. Oh dear....

Rob

The one's that are untaxed, un moted and uninsured, of course, are the cars (and the drivers) we shouldbe getting of the road the soonest. :mad:

itsnever2lateisit?

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Its a car manufacturing industry. It isnt ours any more than Trident is a British nuclear deterrent.

The capability to design, engineer, and provide the robotics to produce a mass produced car vanished when the Chinese dismantled the last Rover factory and shipped it over to Beijing.

Not that bit, the new Roewe 550/MG 6 was designed and engineered in the UK by Ricardo for SAIC, SAIC have since bought Ricardo and relocated them to Longbridge

itsnever2lateisit?

kennyboy66 wrote: »

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I despair of people thinking that it is hugely important who owns what companies.

English paper industry in the 16th Century was largely owned by French Huguenots.

It didn't matter then and it doesn't matter now.

Except, it does matter, in the sense that those nasty foreigners who are sucessful happen to bring capital, technology and know-how with them into this country.

If you don't like this you may be better off living in North Korea.

I doubt those Huguents repatriated the profit to France though!!

Same with the Flemish weavers that Edward III bought over, they were prevented from sending their profits abroad