Would you want my job cut?

Sir_Humphrey

AnthonyUK wrote: »

...because if you do that then they will only come into the UK illegally through the blackmarket and be sold onto the public via criminalgangs and roguetraders etc. Also because the origin of the illegal blackmarket knock off fireworks would be unknown, the quality/safety/reliability and performance could well be poor and/or potentially dangerous ie flimsy loose rocket sticks/leaky cases/loose fuses/dangerous occurences/flight/movement etc which means they probably won't have been tested to any safety standards/regulations and they could VERY WELL seriously injure or kill the person setting them off and/or using them. Industrial display grade fireworks and pyrotechnics(not intended for use by the general public)caused the tragedy in the Netherlands;domestic BS7114 compliant indoor garden and display fireworks for use by the consumer wouldn't have caused this sort of devastation and damage. Generally as a rule, if you follow the instructions carefully on BS7114 consumer fireworks and adhere to the safety distances etc on the label and heed the warnings on the pack/selection box, then you and your guests generally won't come to any harm at all. Only misuse of a firework causes an injury like not burying them/securing them before you light or blatant abuse of a firework causes injury ie throwing/putting thru letterboxes etc.

Fireworks can mean 12 inch calibre display shells. Some hooky fireworks contain quarry blasting explosives. They need regulating. People here can argue that they don't, but don't expect to be taken seriously by me.

Generali

Is it just me or does the OP look like a story about regulatory failure if it is about regulation at all?

Sir H - Are you saying that British Government regulation of firework storage is so far ahead of the Dutch that nothing like this could happen in the UK?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article659190.ece

Two firefighters were killed and several others injured yesterday in a series of explosions at a fireworks warehouse. The blasts were heard at least five miles away. Surrounding properties shook and debris rained down over a large area as fire engulfed the building outside Ringmer, near Lewes, East Sussex. A mushroom cloud could be seen high above the warehouse as police, ten fire crews and six ambulances arrived to tackle the blaze, which worsened throughout the afternoon. Last night fireworks were still exploding at the factory, around which a 220-yard (200m) exclusion cordon was imposed.

AnthonyUK

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Fireworks can mean 12 inch calibre display shells. Some hooky fireworks contain quarry blasting explosives. They need regulating. People here can argue that they don't, but don't expect to be taken seriously by me.

Domestic consumer fireworks in the UK complying with BS7114 shouldn't be banned or outlawed;they're generally safe if used properly and if instructions and safety distances are followed and warnings on the packaging are heeded.

Sir_Humphrey

AnthonyUK wrote: »

Domestic consumer fireworks in the UK complying with BS7114 shouldn't be banned or outlawed;they're generally safe if used properly and if instructions and safety distances are followed and warnings on the packaging are heeded.

I never said they should be.

I think Generali needs to re-read Nicholas Taleb. It is impossible to know how many fires have been prevented by regulations, but it does not mean that lives have not been saved and fires prevented. You cannot stop all bad things from happening, but that does not mean that stopping some of them is not worthwhile. I am sure you are smart enough not to take things for granted.

Fireworks are just one part of my work, which covers a very large range of dangerous items, some of which are far more dangerous.

lostinrates

AnthonyUK wrote: »

...because if you do that then they will only come into the UK illegally through the blackmarket and be sold onto the public via criminalgangs and roguetraders etc. Also because the origin of the illegal blackmarket knock off fireworks would be unknown, the quality/safety/reliability and performance could well be poor and/or potentially dangerous ie flimsy loose rocket sticks/leaky cases/loose fuses/dangerous occurences/flight/movement etc which means they probably won't have been tested to any safety standards/regulations and they could VERY WELL seriously injure or kill the person setting them off and/or using them. Industrial display grade fireworks and pyrotechnics(not intended for use by the general public)caused the tragedy in the Netherlands;domestic BS7114 compliant indoor garden and display fireworks for use by the consumer wouldn't have caused this sort of devastation and damage. Generally as a rule, if you follow the instructions carefully on BS7114 consumer fireworks and adhere to the safety distances etc on the label and heed the warnings on the pack/selection box, then you and your guests generally won't come to any harm at all. Only misuse of a firework causes an injury like not burying them/securing them before you light or blatant abuse of a firework causes injury ie throwing/putting thru letterboxes etc.

I agree....but then one could apply that argument to firearms and a plethora of other things illegal, or illegally held, in UK.

lostinrates

AnthonyUK wrote: »

Domestic consumer fireworks in the UK complying with BS7114 shouldn't be banned or outlawed;they're generally safe if used properly and if instructions and safety distances are followed and warnings on the packaging are heeded.

I love watching fireworks, I really do, I think they are beautiful, but whilst if properly used and construct I agree they acceoptable risk to the people using them I have been in tricky, and indeed dangerous, situations with my livestock due to other people using fireworks, hence my slightly killjoy attitude towards fireworks. The problem with fireworks, is that the don't just share there impact with the people using and enjoying them. While its ok to brace yourself on key evenings like, Guy Fawkes night, New Year and Chinese NY, we have random and unexpected fireworks fairly often here.

Cannon_Fodder

chewmylegoff wrote: »

can't we just put you and all the other public sector workers in the fireworks factory and light the fuse. gets rid of the problem and its solution. two birds with one stone and all that.

Problem is, the paperwork...

You need a risk assessment in triplicate before HSE/Civil Servants are allowed to get off their chairs and go to the photocopier to put their risk assessment into triplicate.

ILW

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

I never said they should be.


Fireworks are just one part of my work, which covers a very large range of dangerous items, some of which are far more dangerous.

I think you are James Bond.

Generali

[quote=Sir_Humphrey;20135447I_think_Generali_needs_to_re-read_Nicholas_Taleb.__It_is_impossible_to_know_how_many_fires_have_been_prevented_by_regulations,_but_it_does_not_mean_that_lives_have_not_been_saved_and_fires_prevented._[/quote]

Ok. But paying to prevent fires means cancers left untreated. I don't know how many lives have been saved but also I guess you don't know how many were lost.

Sir_Humphrey

Generali wrote: »

Ok. But paying to prevent fires means cancers left untreated. I don't know how many lives have been saved but also I guess you don't know how many were lost.

Or you could raise taxes for rich people and do both perhaps? You also ignore the fact that preventing accidents also reduces the amount the NHS spends on A&E, accident rehab, skin grafts etc. Also incapacity benefit.