Buyin house Seller not ready to move.

GDB2222

Oh, by the way, your vendors are not really looking to sell their house. They are looking to move. Same as you, really, and same as your buyers. Unless your vendors can tie up both ends of the deal, they don't want to sell. Same as you - you could move into rented for a while, then move into your vendors' place when they are ready to move out, but you obviously don't want to.

alm721

They're moving in with family so no rental involved. They also promised not to hold the sale up when we first made the offer as they hadn't even started looking. Does this not matter

GDB2222

alm721 wrote: »

They're moving in with family so no rental involved. They also promised not to hold the sale up when we first made the offer as they hadn't even started looking. Does this not matter

Clearly, if this is what they promised and it was part of the deal, they should stick to that. However, they may not recall that conversation in the same way you do.

Doozergirl

alm721 wrote: »

They're moving in with family so no rental involved. They also promised not to hold the sale up when we first made the offer as they hadn't even started looking. Does this not matter

The actual vendors and purchasers often have little control over when their solicitors or indeed, other people's solicitors or developers are ready. If, as you say, they promised to move asap and only started looking after they'd accepted your offer (best practice) then how could they genuinely know how long their own property would take to complete?

I'm afraid there is a ridiculous naievity about thinking that you have control over these things 'yes we'll all move x day' - it mostly doesn't work like that in any chain.

I agree entirely with GDB2222 that your buyers can probably move mid-month if they choose to - and nobody really needs to be inconvenienced financially if indeed you can all co-operate with each other. Most landlords I'm sure will accept a tenant moving mid-rent month anyway provided the correct notice and rent is given. The more time to find a new tenant, the better. A bit of time to move leisurely and clean the rental properly is a blessing.

Doozergirl

barnaby-bear wrote: »

It can be the case that FTBs are on fixed rental terms, we certainly had a LL who had served notice and was only willing to renew on another fixed term, so we had to move or tie in to another 6 months elsewhere. Also with rentals you are committed to units of months so don't want to rent and pay mortgage on two properties. Also a lot of people's mortgage offers have an expiry date or the clock on the fixed term is still running - that couple of months might be the difference between a completely different mortgage or none at all at the moment. PArt of the problem is lying vendors I've heard countless oh we're moving with family/into rental only for them to start lookign once the house is sold, then that place falls through and they start again.... people selign houses not used to rental say they will go into rental but don't realise many LLs don't take dogs/kids and rentals usually an initial 6 months fixed.

I knew that would be contentious. In my experience IRL and on this board, it's in the majority of cases the first time buyers pushing too hard. There is no reason here given other than the original agreement being 'when the FTBs are ready' which says nothing of mortgage offers or tight landlords, simply eager FTBs.

Ultimately, you can't have two parties agreeing on something without the third who are equally involved. The date simply cannot be set at the outset with any proper degree of certainty; perhaps it's only experience that teaches you that in order for people to end up happy that date needs to be flexible and agreed formally much nearer to the exchange date.

Yes, you do get lying vendors who say they will move in with family and I always tell people on this site never to believe that because no matter how well meaning someone is when they say that, it needs to be confirmed properly at the outset, not pulled out of the hat as a 'but you said' - we all know that people would really rather move once and so we should take that thought really seriously - here the OP is being pushed into moving early but instead of trying to find the flexibility from the FTB, they're pushing it all on to their vendor. That vendor is indeed moving in with family before their own house is even ready. That is nothing but accommodating and it would be fair for the others to wait for them rather than push (despite what was agreed actually).

Honestly, someone is not being flexible enough - that is the FTBs in this case because they are forcing two people at the moment to move when they are not ready. It doesn't have to be like that. Exchanging now and having the security of it happening should work if people are prepared to compromise. The OP knows how inconvenient it is to have to move twice but can't really see how that feels for their vendor?

alm721

Doozergirl wrote: »

here the OP is being pushed into moving early but instead of trying to find the flexibility from the FTB, they're pushing it all on to their vendor. That vendor is indeed moving in with family before their own house is even ready. That is nothing but accommodating and it would be fair for the others to wait for them rather than push (despite what was agreed actually).

I have no intention of make my buyers wait. I said I would move when they were ready and will honour that. To be honest in this market I think anyone would be an idiot not to! Aside from what I do with my buyers its not at all accomodating to go back on an agreement to complete as soon as we are able.

Honestly, someone is not being flexible enough - that is the FTBs in this case because they are forcing two people at the moment to move when they are not ready. It doesn't have to be like that. Exchanging now and having the security of it happening should work if people are prepared to compromise. The OP knows how inconvenient it is to have to move twice but can't really see how that feels for their vendor?

I can totally see how it feels for the vendor however unlike them I did not promise that I would not hold up the sale and then intend to do just that . Neither did I decide to buy a house that was not even built ! This was the vendor's desicion no-one elses! I guess the vendor would be happy If I tried to say that if they make us wait x weeks then as prices are falling would they be happy to reduce the price according? Probably not.

Doozergirl

You're being unreasonable if you think that house prices falling is a good reason for them to move out sooner rather than later. You chose to buy now and we're talking two weeks - you won't be seeing much difference in the market in that time. Buying sooner won't stop the House Price Index.

It's also unreasonable to lay blame at their feet for buying the house that they wanted! They hardly bought a new build just to spite you, nor did they sell you the house to pander to you. It's quite plain that you're as keen to move as your FTBs hence it suits you better to take their side than find out where their compromise is.

It's time to start being the expeditor here and stop playing the hard done-by. Are you going to tell us what you've decided to do to try to rectify the situation? Is there a way around this - I really think you should be looking in your buyer's direction.

Conversely, would you have still gone ahead with the purchase if your vendor had said initially that they wanted an extra two weeks? What would be more important to you - the house or your buyers wishes? Common sense could have avoided this. You've put yourself there by expecting something of someone else that you wouldn't want to do yourself. Do as you would be done unto springs to mind.

Anyway, we're talking about two weeks which for the length of this debate is ridiculous! Franky, it isn't a delay, it is par for the course when you have a chain that takes everyone *properly* into account. I've had to sort out a discrepancy of four months before and I can tell you it wasn't pleasant after 7 months of already waiting! I had to take responsibility for both parts of that chain; I could not expect the top to cope with the demands at the bottom of a 'chain' when the sale and the purchase are two separate transactions. Out of 40 odd transactions that was the only one that has ever gone wrong; I've managed every single one with good negotiating skills, keeping communication open, predicting problems and being able to see everyone's point of view.

I should never have sold that house at that point. We ended up renting for 20 months and moved house four times simply because of that scenario when we could have kept that house. That is proper inconvenience.

alm721

Doozergirl wrote: »

You're being unreasonable if you think that house prices falling is a good reason for them to move out sooner rather than later. You chose to buy now and we're talking two weeks - you won't be seeing much difference in the market in that time. Buying sooner won't stop the House Price Index.

It's also unreasonable to lay blame at their feet for buying the house that they wanted! They hardly bought a new build just to spite you, nor did they sell you the house to pander to you. It's quite plain that you're as keen to move as your FTBs hence it suits you better to take their side than find out where their compromise is.

It's time to start being the expeditor here and stop playing the hard done-by. Are you going to tell us what you've decided to do to try to rectify the situation? Is there a way around this - I really think you should be looking in your buyer's direction.

Conversely, would you have still gone ahead with the purchase if your vendor had said initially that they wanted an extra two weeks? What would be more important to you - the house or your buyers wishes? Common sense could have avoided this. You've put yourself there by expecting something of someone else that you wouldn't want to do yourself. Do as you would be done unto springs to mind.

Anyway, we're talking about two weeks which for the length of this debate is ridiculous! Franky, it isn't a delay, it is par for the course when you have a chain that takes everyone *properly* into account. I've had to sort out a discrepancy of four months before and I can tell you it wasn't pleasant after 7 months of already waiting! I had to take responsibility for both parts of that chain; I could not expect the top to cope with the demands at the bottom of a 'chain' when the sale and the purchase are two separate transactions. Out of 40 odd transactions that was the only one that has ever gone wrong; I've managed every single one with good negotiating skills, keeping communication open, predicting problems and being able to see everyone's point of view.

I should never have sold that house at that point. We ended up renting for 20 months and moved house four times simply because of that scenario when we could have kept that house. That is proper inconvenience.

Assuming the market is falling at 1% per month (which seems on the low side tbh) a 2 week delay amounts to a little over £2000 so not an insignificant amount. However, that aside it is of course entirly up to them what or when they buyand I can't see how there is 'any blame' involved, but when we initally made an offer we were assured that they had not even started looking and were planning to move in with family and then rent and therefore they wanted to complete as soon as we could!

You are quite right in your assumption that we want to move as soon as our buyers, I think my posts made that pretty clear. With regards to would we still have bought if we knew the buyers wanted two weeks more then yes we would but I would have expected this to have been mentioned weeks ago. This date has been on the table as a 'suggested date' for over a month. Its only now there seems to be a problem.

With regards to what we will do if they won't move. We will move out as we promised and deal with it! What else can we do. I am not prepared to risk losing our buyer. I did state I'm not going to make empty threats, in fact I only posted to ask for some advice but you seem to be getting very het up about it all

I'm guessing that with over 40 transactions you're either an EA or a property investor who seems to have had a problem with one of your sales, maybe thats why you're coming across as very bitter .

Either way I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, maybe assuming people will stick to what they've said is just too much to expect these days?
Anyway thanks for taking the time to reply.

alm721

Doozergirl wrote: »

You've put yourself there by expecting something of someone else that you wouldn't want to do yourself. Do as you would be done unto springs to mind.

To be fair I'm not expecting anything of someone else that I wouldn't do myself. We said we would move as soon as our buyers were ready. Our vendors said they would move as soon as we were ready. We are sticking to this, our vendors are not, simple as!

Doozergirl

I'm not het up in the slightest. I just don't agree with you. That's allowed. If I'd realised you came here under the pretense of asking for advice for us to get this far down the thread to find out that you are doing absolutely nothing about it and in fact just wanted to have a whinge, I'd have allowed you to do so without posting here myself.

I think it's ridiculous that you can't do anything with your buyer for the sake of two weeks.

My business is doing just fine thanks. I know what I'm doing. I've nothing to be bitter about. I'd thank you for refraining from personal insults. You asked a question, I answered it.

I just shared a trying time for us with you to help put things in perspective for you. I've also seen it that many times that I know that mostly it can be dealt with without anyone being properly inconvenienced - waiting two weeks shouldn't count as much as being made homeless which is what your buyers are doing to you.