83 yo gran has bought a £1295 Kirby vac!

vertical_fool

hazey31 wrote: »

Just had to logon to say what a lovely grandchild you are for helping your Gran sorting all this out. She's very lucky to have you.

Thanks for your reply Hazey31. She's been taken advantage of and I felt sickened when I found out so a member of the family would have to have looked into it really
as my gran just wants it all to go away really which is why there annoying me so much by contacting her again.

Regards

Vertical

pinkshoes

I also want to say well done for helping your Gran with this, and hope she gets a full refund and apology. No vacuum is worth that amount!

I know someone who used to work for Kirby... They were told to use persuasion tactics, and stay as long as possible in the person's house to make the feel guilty if they didn't buy. In fact, this person got such enormous commission from selling, they dropped out of Uni to do it for a couple of years. Financially I see why they did it, but morally I let them know I felt it was disgusting! Some people have no problem putting money before morals... (I am no longer in contact with this person!!)

julie1075

Sorry to say I did the appointment cold calling for these some 20 years ago. The were selling at £800 a piece then and the salesman got £300 of that in commission. Also they could sell them for less if the customer haggled - then the salesman basically lost his commision. One thing I would like to say to vertical fool, please check that your gran hasn't signed up to a loan agreement, as that's how they usually sell them. I'd hate for her to be losing money every month out of her pension. Hope you get it sorted xx

vertical_fool

pinkshoes wrote: »

I also want to say well done for helping your Gran with this, and hope she gets a full refund and apology. No vacuum is worth that amount!

I know someone who used to work for Kirby... They were told to use persuasion tactics, and stay as long as possible in the person's house to make the feel guilty if they didn't buy. In fact, this person got such enormous commission from selling, they dropped out of Uni to do it for a couple of years. Financially I see why they did it, but morally I let them know I felt it was disgusting! Some people have no problem putting money before morals... (I am no longer in contact with this person!!)

Hi pinkshoes, I can understand the tactics and most of them seem pretty obvious to me. My gran however has been gullable all her life, her dad and her sister have apparently played tricks on her since she was a child! So she doesn't see the tactics, she feels very guity about the whole thing aswell. There tactic of name dropping has really got to her because she's worried it will create problems with them?! because she thinks that the salesman knows them because of the way he's mentioned them. She's a salesmans dream when she's not well certainly in early January.

She says she's usually good with salesmen but this one has sort of by passed this from her point of view because she was under the impression (either from the friend that mentioned it/recommended it or just my grans interpretation of what was said) it was for a free carpet cleaning so was happy to have him round. I think she would have had a defence mechanism if it was a situation with a salesman at the boundary of her front door.

I think aswell she's felt sorry for him doing it for free, she's probably been glad of the company. She was driving last summer and had a hectic social life so now her social life has been crippled. She's heard he's starting his "own business" and she 's probably thought well good for you and spending time with me and cleaning my carpets for free! If he'd have tried to leave without trying to sell her something she'd probably have given him some money anyway for the doing the carpet!

LinasPilibaitisisbatman

a lot of this is what the OP thinks rather than proven fact

It is not illegal for a salesman to try and sell a vacumn cleaner, or for an OAP to buy one

As far as I see you have two causes of argument if true

1) Unfair pressure
2) Unable to contract

From what you have posted neither would be satisfied in a legal court.

Lady_K

I think there might be a law though about door to door selling to people over the age of around 75, not sure of the ins and outs but if thats the case it wont matter about the above

vertical_fool

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

a lot of this is what the OP thinks rather than proven fact.

It's a bit difficult to have proven facts as it wasn't recorded in anyway. The only facts that I can provide are that my gran had an appointment in regards to her mental health condition in January cancelled when they became aware of her recent illness caused by a allergic reaction to an antibiotic given to her during the summer. This seriously affected her liver, so she was barely eating and drinking for over 4 months maybe even 5. She was diagnosed as dehydrated so lots of reasons to confuse her.

After she bought it. She hid it from everybody. Fact. And maybe from herself aswell Maybe because she was embarrashesed about it but I think its because it would be a serious reason for people to question her sanity, which if you knew her and her financial position and how thrifty she is, sometimes I'm horrified at what I find in her fridge.

I suppose its fact about the salesman telling my grans friend she bought one and for how much hence breaking the Data Protection Act, she'd be happy to state it in court anyway.

The postcode on the order form and invoice isn't correct, she's lived there for over twenty years. Odd don't you think?

The salesman hadn't signed the invoice or order form either.

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

It is not illegal for a salesman to try and sell a vacumn cleaner, or for an OAP to buy one.

No it's not but personally I find it very distasteful, certainly in this case although video evidence would be fantastic.

In my opinion these salesman enter peoples homes with a premeditated challenge to a) convince people that they need/want these products and b) to manipulate the situation in order to maximise their profit.This situation is worsened as it encourages people to take advantage and encourages people who are happy to take advantage into that industry.

If she was happy anout buying it she wouldn't have hid it!? If she'd have understood/realised she had 14 days to return it she could have returned it probably if she told someone about it!

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

As far as I see you have two causes of argument if true

1) Unfair pressure
2) Unable to contract

From what you have posted neither would be satisfied in a legal court.

I disagree and I'm sure the evidence would be sufficient to not even progress to court however that won't be necessary as its in the process of being refunded.

Regards

Vertical

vertical_fool

Lady_K wrote: »

I think there might be a law though about door to door selling to people over the age of around 75, not sure of the ins and outs but if thats the case it wont matter about the above

Hi Lady_K. That sound interesting, I'll have to look into that however they said tehy were going to collect Monday a.m. I arrived at 8:45 they phoned around 9:15 to say they' be there after 6.

They collected at around 5:45 and the supposed engineer handed over the cheque. So hopefully that'll be the last of Kirby for my gran at least.

Regards

Vertical

lynx10

In February, my mother - 89 at the time - received the personal delivery of a 'Nissan Micra' prize draw card, promoted by KDA Winners.com (www.kdawinners.com), with Elite Systems (E.M.) Ltd noted on the reverse, at a Lincoln address.

The only emphasis verbally was the free opportunity to win a car, but in small print on the prize draw card it said:

"In addition to the main draw, cards will also be selected daily and the holder invited to receive a gift for watching, along with your partner, a demonstration of a Complete Homecare System. To be carried out at a time suitable for both of you in the comfort and convenience of your own home,
OR This offer is made as part of our free Carpet Shampoo Program where any one carpet of your choice is shampooed free of charge for your views and opinions about a Complete Homecare System."

She (and an immdediate neighbour, and probably everyone else in the street) was subsequently telephoned to say that she had ‘won a free carpet cleaning’. An appointment was made, but the representative failed to show and it was cancelled by my mother. Regardless of the cancellation, someone turned up in person, after the appointment time, and wishing to carry out the 'free cleaning'. This was declined. The business telephoned her again, and she agreed to another appointment.

The demonstration duly took place and it transpired that the 'Complete Homecare System' was the Kirby Sentria vacuum cleaner, at a special offer price of £825, or alternatively, £395 down-payment plus £12/week instalments for 24 weeks. She indicated that she wanted to think about the offers but, after further investigations by myself, decided against.

So:

* The telephone calls from the company and the sales visit were persistent, e.g., see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirby_Company#Sales_practices_2

* The company representative left no sales literature (e.g., specifications, prices, company details) nor any material outlining her consumer rights over purchases following unsolicited sales visits.

* The company name traces to Company Reg. 05582964, with directors showing Lincoln addresses, and whose latest filed accounts are to October 2006 and thus overdue. These accounts showed a deficit in net assets in excess of £5,000 (including tax and national insurance liabilities), and a paid up share capital of only £2. They currently have 'Proposal to Strike off' recorded against them.

* It is not known whether they accept credit card payments - but she has no credit card which might afford her some protection had she decided to commit herself at the time of the sales visit.

This matter has been reported to the local trading standards office, who are understood to be liaising with another office, a major concern being the possible targetting of elderly residents.

And talking of persistence: she received another visit last week, with an almost identical prize draw card and another opportunity to win a 'Nissan Micra'. This time the company name was Elite Systems (U.K.) Ltd near Nottingham, which traces to Company Reg. 06751025, formed November 2008, and therefore having no filed accounts. However, the prize draw card carries the same telephone number as the card delivered in February.

Tozer

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

a lot of this is what the OP thinks rather than proven fact

It is not illegal for a salesman to try and sell a vacumn cleaner, or for an OAP to buy one

As far as I see you have two causes of argument if true

1) Unfair pressure
2) Unable to contract

From what you have posted neither would be satisfied in a legal court.

As ever, complete rubbish. The facts speak for themselves in this case. Elderly lady spends a fortune on a vacuum cleaner from a door-to-door salesman.

Believe it or not, District Judges do have some common sense and know what nasty tactics this sort of company gets up to.