Orange Lose Court Battle Over Bad Signal.

diamonds

Jon_01 wrote: »

So who has the responsibility to tell the network ?
The builders won't, the council won't. Hows anyone suppoed to know the impact of a new building on reception ?
I'm sure you'll agree that the networks can't test coverage at every address all the time. The coverage maps show what the range of each tower should be, but there are numerous reasons why you won't get any.
I'm not defending the current system, but it's impossible for any network to know 100% if you're going to get a signal (which is why the T&C's say what they do).

If you give people the get out that if they have no signal they can return their phone it will be abused. People will go from store to store getting free phones for a few weeks and then talking them back. All the networks will end up with a mountain of used phones and the result will be higher charges for everyone else. . .

that falls on you knowing you have a signal at your MAIN address to then research the chances of the next 12/18 months from the local base station to your doMAIN, i agree with everything you say Jon but if Orange/Voda etc SAY you should have a signal & in the first few days you dont the network should be allowing you to return handset & cancel regardless of sales channel

inaspin_3

I bought my Orange phone when I was living at one address, I moved a month later and I could not get any signal whatsoever. After trying to cancel with Orange through one of the terms in their contract, they were having none of it. I did go to great lengths before hand to check that it wasn't my phone, etc and coverage was apparently good on the netwrok coverage checker. I had to get a new contract with O2 and still pay the monthy charge with Orange (cost me about £300 in all, as they they wouldn't allow me to reduce to the lowest tariff straight away, I had to reduce by £5 a month). I couldn't cancel it within a week as I didnt have the problem then. I got in touch with cisas.org.uk (Thank you to Martin :money: ) to see if they could look into it for me and they confirmed that Orange were being unreasonable and they got Orange to give me my money back, with a letter of apology from someone quite high up, after so many 'no, you're not cancelling, etc' from an executive officer. Didn't cost me a thing! :T

Pound

Buzby wrote: »

The banks were in a totally different position. The customer agreed to the contract

Right, because the "customer agreed to a contract" argument worked so wells for the banks.

piggeh

Buzby wrote: »

The banks were in a totally different position. The Networks have contracts in place that SPECIFICALLY exclude (a) network coverage guarantees and (2) service levels.

The customer agreed to the contract, therefore complaining subsequently that there was no signal was already addressed within the contract. If Orange do nothing, there is a real danger that the networks will be put in the position that their contracts far from being 'legally binding' will be little more than a consumer incumbrance. They'll fight tooth and nail to prevent this, as it will provide a loophole to allow anyone to cite coverage issues to walk away from a contract.

That may be the case, but bank customers also agreed regarding bank charges when opening accounts. However there is no real alternative if you need a mobile (ok, want a mobile) or want a bank account you have nowhere else to go for different T&Cs. I think similar to the bank case the terms in the T&Cs could be deemed as being unfair. UK consumer law should take precedence and if there's no reasonable delivery of service, then there should be a right to cancel.

I think the article proves a point though - companies (especially larger ones) do not want to spend their time going to small claims courts to defend against amounts of this size. So if you have a complaint regarding Setanta, BBC, phone contracts, whatever, you can probably get your money back by raising a small claims and it's likely you'll win by default.

WolfSong2000

I wish I'd know about this last year! I had exactly the same problem...bought a contract phone from Orange, who told me that I would get a "perfect" signal at my house...if I'm lucky, I can get one or two bars in certain areas of the house...it's a joke. I tried to complain, but was told there was nothing they could do. I was also told that there was *no* cooling off period after I bought the phone...once I signed the contract, that was it :mad:.

I'm getting out of my Orange contract ASAP (runs out in October) and switching to O2. I'm so fed up of them messing me around (overcharged me for the first 3 months, then didn't fully refund me after I complained). Ugh!

diamonds

inaspin wrote: »

I bought my Orange phone when I was living at one address, I moved a month later and I could not get any signal whatsoever. After trying to cancel with Orange through one of the terms in their contract, they were having none of it. I did go to great lengths before hand to check that it wasn't my phone, etc and coverage was apparently good on the netwrok coverage checker. I had to get a new contract with O2 and still pay the monthy charge with Orange (cost me about £300 in all, as they they wouldn't allow me to reduce to the lowest tariff straight away, I had to reduce by £5 a month). I couldn't cancel it within a week as I didnt have the problem then. I got in touch with cisas.org.uk (Thank you to Martin :money: ) to see if they could look into it for me and they confirmed that Orange were being unreasonable and they got Orange to give me my money back, with a letter of apology from someone quite high up, after so many 'no, you're not cancelling, etc' from an executive officer. Didn't cost me a thing! :T

exactly...it pays to complain...Orange's terms state they will provide alternative & you were not offered that....makes me wonder why Orange dont clear stocks of Unique handsets in the circumstances

diamonds

WolfSong2000 wrote: »

I wish I'd know about this last year! I had exactly the same problem...bought a contract phone from Orange, who told me that I would get a "perfect" signal at my house...if I'm lucky, I can get one or two bars in certain areas of the house...it's a joke. I tried to complain, but was told there was nothing they could do. I was also told that there was *no* cooling off period after I bought the phone...once I signed the contract, that was it :mad:.

I'm getting out of my Orange contract ASAP (runs out in October) and switching to O2. I'm so fed up of them messing me around (overcharged me for the first 3 months, then didn't fully refund me after I complained). Ugh!

CISAS a complaint

gjchester

diamonds wrote: »

as I have said it takes one case on anything to set a standard - the UK law system is built on this

"sets a precident but the next count court judge may take the networks side"

thats highly doubtful in the same NEW contract NO signal CANT CANCEL scenario

IIRC County court judgements do not get reported in Law papers and as such the only persons who may know about it is the parties in the case. As it's been in the newspaper it may be known wider, but if it's not reported in law papers it's not going to be known to all judges.

I think reporting in the Law papers is what sets a Legal Precident, not because the Daily mail have sensasionalised it

Jon_01

I was under the impression that you couldn't set a precident that over turned a contract without a review first ? and certainly not in a County Court . . .

Intasun32

Buzby wrote: »

When I read this, I just KNEW it was a story from the Daily Mail.

In fact it has also been reported in The Telegraph and several local papers in SW London.