Longer Commute - Lower House Prices

sarah_elton

Mr_Matey wrote: »

I still don't understand why trains/tubes are so expensive in the UK.

It's a *lot* cheaper for me and OH to drive places than get the train. Now that we have a car, I wouldn't consider taking public transport to travel to other cities/towns.

The tube I do get, but I need to for work.

For long distance journeys, the train is cheaper than driving with Advance tickets. I went to Liverpool for £8 each way the other week, tickets booked 3 months in advance. The return trip from Essex would have been a lot more than £16 in petrol!

Train is expensive at peak times because they no people have no choice - for me, train is the only possible way to get to work (driving/coach would take hours!)

lostinrates

Interesting noone has factored in health/mobilty with commute. It CAN take 1.5 hours commute each way in London (refering to the 3 hr daily commute questioned above) even in relatively quiet times if you are a slower walker/old/less mobile etc. Which of course might also impact on a choice of commute or staying within a town. Even then, if you are restricted, choosing a good location to be near transport is surprisingly easy to overlook.

Returning on bus to the part of Hampstead I used to live in was awkward involving a change and usually a long wait for that change, and when restricted with mobility I found I would often choose to take the tube (its a station with lifts not escalators) rather than wait for the bus or try to walk up to the top of the hill from the bus stop at the bottom.

Things like age/mobilty health start to factor importantly in these decisions when they happen to you and they are more likely to happen the older you are (FWIW I was 23 or 24)

Also people often, I notice, forget to factor the walk/drive to and from stations when they give optimistic commute times anyway. To not factor time into the choice is a poor option. As chewmylegoff says, how much is your sleep worth, or alternatively, how much is your time worth, to your employer/business, your family or yourself? How much, for example, to miss seeing young children through the week because you are leaving as they get up and back after bath and story time? A nice commute on a train with a seat where you can read/work is not necessarily wasted, but it should be factored in to a decision.

Mr_Matey

sarah_elton wrote: »

For long distance journeys, the train is cheaper than driving with Advance tickets. I went to Liverpool for £8 each way the other week, tickets booked 3 months in advance. The return trip from Essex would have been a lot more than £16 in petrol!

Train is expensive at peak times because they no people have no choice - for me, train is the only possible way to get to work (driving/coach would take hours!)

Thanks, good to know. But 3 months in advance for a train journey, crikey, I'm not that organised with my weekend adventures!

As examples, it cost us something like £55 for 2 return tickets to Oxford which isn't particularly far. Petrol would've cost at most £20 (small car).

A return trip for 2 to Salisbury when we went to Stonehenge would've cost us £70 (I just looked it up online), whereas petrol cost about £40.

If they want to encourage people to get the train they have to do something about that, as even if it was similar prices I'd still drive, because of the flexibility e.g. "I think I'll stop in that village for lunch".

lostinrates

sarah_elton wrote: »

For long distance journeys, the train is cheaper than driving with Advance tickets. I went to Liverpool for £8 each way the other week, tickets booked 3 months in advance. The return trip from Essex would have been a lot more than £16 in petrol!

Train is expensive at peak times because they no people have no choice - for me, train is the only possible way to get to work (driving/coach would take hours!)

Absolutely, but if you are held hostage to transport advance tickets have limited benefit when, for example, something comes up with 24 hours notice. Few people are able to run the majority of their life on a three month in advance notice, bar commuting costs, which as you say, are pretty inflexible.

Really2

Mr_Matey wrote: »

If they want to encourage people to get the train they have to do something about that, as even if it was similar prices I'd still drive, because of the flexibility e.g. "I think I'll stop in that village for lunch".

I Agree I live in the country and the only people who use public transport are people who do not need to get anywhere on time or do not have to pay.

I think their is a goverment site which works out how long your journy would take via public transport.

To get to work.
To do 6 miles on public transport (allowing for bus changes etc. 1.75 hours)
Or 12mins. In a car.

The public transport in this country is a joke.

Found the site. It really is good to find out how much of your life you could waste.:)
http://www.transportdirect.info/web2/JourneyPlanning/JourneyPlannerInput.aspx

Mr_Matey

Really2 wrote: »

I Agree I live in the country and the only people who use public transport are people who do not need to get anywhere on time or do not have to pay.

I think their is a goverment site which works out how long your journy would take via public transport.

To get to work.
To do 6 miles on public transport (allowing for bus changes etc. 1.75 hours)
Or 12mins. In a car.

The public transport in this country is a joke.

Interesting. I'd say that public transport here is pretty good compared to Aus. The London Underground is especially good despite the whinges I hear. I'd rate it behind Tokyo but ahead of NYC.

With Britain being so small and having so many people, it could easily have an awesome public transport network, especially in and between cities. Think Japan. All they have to do is get the pricing right to encourage people to use it.

In rural areas it's always going to be tough to rival cars.

Bf109

wobblegobble wrote: »

If this is correct then apart from the non financial factors there is no financial benefit to buying somewhere cheaper and spending the difference on commuting costs?

You have to weigh up the cost of the a worse commute versus the reward of living in a larger house for less money.

In purely financial terms, theres a massive difference in rail fares between Zone 6 and a few miles outside of Zone 6. Last time I looked it was a difference of about £80-£120 per month. Thats quite a lot of money when you have two salaries.If you were to live in Zone 6 and invest the rest in mortgage overpayments, then this would probably be a good investment.

You also have to consider that the real cost of a long commute is not just financial. long commutes cost an enormous amount of emotional capital. Its really quite unpleasant to have to fight your way through the crowds everyday, and it takes a lot out of you. I travel only 40mins on a direct train to work each day, but can truthfully claim that getting to work and back is the most stressful and unpleasant part of each day.

Theres no one size fits all answer to it. You have to weigh it up for yourself. But its far from a purely financial equation.

Really2

Mr_Matey wrote: »

In rural areas it's always going to be tough to rival cars.

Agree and that is when a sensible goverment has to come to some happy medium. (not Russel Grant)

ukcarper

I no longer work but when I did I travelle on average 20 to 30 miles each way by car from outside London to outer London I had to drive because of the nature of my job. Normally if I had to drive say 30 miles due to traffic it would take me half an hour to do the first 20 miles and 1 hour to do the last 10 miles. So the overall time doesn’t always reflect the additional time. The cost of extra petrol may cover the extra on the mortgage if you didn’t move out, but because the banks usually base the amount of mortgage they would lend you on a multiple of your salary you can always get a better house in a cheaper area. I had the chance to move closer to where I worked but I never did, as I much prefer to live nearer the countryside and now when I venture inside the M25 I hate it as the traffic seems so bad what ever time of day.

daveb975

Bf109 wrote: »

In purely financial terms, theres a massive difference in rail fares between Zone 6 and a few miles outside of Zone 6. Last time I looked it was a difference of about £80-£120 per month. Thats quite a lot of money when you have two salaries.If you were to live in Zone 6 and invest the rest in mortgage overpayments, then this would probably be a good investment.

That is true, but sometimes houses prices get more expensive as you move out.

I live on the edge of zone 6 (Surbiton). The next station down the line that is outside of the zones is Esher. Whilst flats and small houses are marginally more expensive in Surbiton than Esher, the prices for the larger detached houses is higher in Esher, even though it is outside of the zones. Of course, if you go a bit further out still, it gets a lot cheaper, but the fares are higher still.

This is replicated all around London (e.g. Sevenoaks in Kent is more expensive than Bromley in zone 5).

That is why the nicer parts of zone 5/6 represent the best financial compromise for a lot of people. Unlike central London, the prices are not that much higher than a lot of the commuter belt, but you still benefit from relatively reasonable commuting times/costs.


I also agree with some of the other posters, though. IF you are prepared to live with a much longer and more expensive commute (i.e. 1 hour each way) then the saving on the mortgage/rent will more than offset the extra cost, especially if there is only one commuter in the family. Wouldn't suit everyone, though.